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Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @08:46AM (#18256304)
>Neighborhood association bylaws...

HOAs and the people who subject themselves to them are a self selecting group who want that kind of stuff. In some wealthy suburbs the town government functions basically like a HOA trying to maintain property values by keeping the "wrong" people out and keeping the "wrong" kind of development from happening. However, local governments mostly don't concern themselves with this level of micromanagement, it's the exception not the rule.

Caring about "unsightly" things is universal to rich busybodies worldwide. It's not about freedom, it's about doing things that inconvenience poor people so they don't move to your neighborhood.

For every horror story about an American HOA there's an equivilent

>Land of the free where you can shoot a person that enters your garden

Outside some very specific circumstances shooting someone who is on your property is likely to put you behind bars regardless of what state you do it in.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by leetcrew on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:16AM (#18256865)
> Caring about "unsightly" things is universal to rich busybodies worldwide. It's not about freedom, it's about doing things that inconvenience poor people so they don't move to your neighborhood.

it might have that effect in some cases, but I don't necessarily think that's the intent. people put a lot of effort into making their home and yard look nice and they want to live with other people who also care. I live in a quiet lower-middle class neighborhood and people will be all over me if I don't cut my lawn for a few weeks; it's not just a "rich people" thing. I don't call them busybodies though. I get to enjoy the product of their work every time I sit on my porch, so I don't mind doing my part to make the street pleasant.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by bitexploder on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:14AM (#18256469)
Castle doctrine is scary. Someone has to be threatening you, but it definitely is a thing. See: Trayvon Martin.

I like my HOA and it isn’t to keep poor people out. No more than high rent in SF is to keep poor people out. Market forces do that. I don’t think HOA is some evil force. I am biased of course, I live in a neighborhood with an HOA. Towns have building codes and appearance codes as well, sometimes for practical reasons, often purely for aesthetics.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:53AM (#18256723)
>Castle doctrine is scary

Not having castle doctrine is equally if not more scary. The idea that I could wind up in jail because I didn't make enough effort to retreat within my own home is not exactly comforting. The idea that one has to retreat within their own home or personal vehicle is just kind of absurd to begin with. I can through my own actions greatly reduce the (already minuscule) chances of getting shot by someone else in their home. I cannot through my own actions effect (or at least not to nearly the same extent) the chances of having my life threatened by someone else.

I don't live somewhere "nice" by HN standards (I'm perfectly fine with where I live). While my house will probably never be robbed it will also probably never catch on fire yet I have smoke alarms and a couple fire extinguishers.

>and appearance codes as well, sometimes for practical reasons, often purely for aesthetics.

This is the HOA-esque behavior I'm talking about. Yes, it's common in suburbs of SF, on Long island, etc. It's not the norm.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by rconti on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:33PM (#18257888)
I'm not sure I'd say HOAs are common in the suburbs of SF. Maybe the exurbs. HOAs are more common in what you might call sprawl, newer neighborhoods, and most suburbs of SF are old enough that they don't have HOAs. Unless you're talking, like, out in Danville or something.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by bitexploder on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:05AM (#18257172)
I agree in general about castle doctrine, BTW. The laws aren’t always clear in their scope around when, where, and how you can defend yourself and if they are even constitutional. Inside of your home seems like an obvious place you don’t have to retreat.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by snerbles on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:14AM (#18257234)
Even California has castle doctrine laws.

Many are unaware that in the U.S. the police is not responsible for an individual's personal safety; see Warren v. District of Columbia, Town of Castle Rock v. Gonzales, etc.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @12:51PM (#18258027)
> The idea that one has to retreat within their own home or personal vehicle is just kind of absurd to begin with.

If my home had two pairs of doors I'll be rushing through second one the moment I thought someone would try to brake in through the first one. Not because I had to, just because defending your stuff with your life and health is a bad choice. You have one life and body that will not be the same again after it's shot or stabbed or beaten, but you can always earn more money and get more stuff.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by dsfyu404ed on Friday October 19, 2018 @01:54PM (#18258577)
>You can always earn more money and get more stuff.

I can't just buy another wife

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:13PM (#18260114)
I thought it goes without saying that I'd grab her along the way. Unless she can move only in a wheelchair then I'd have to reconsider my position but we are getting into very specific scenarios.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by snerbles on Friday October 19, 2018 @02:14PM (#18258744)
I take it you're not a parent.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by scotty79 on Friday October 19, 2018 @05:15PM (#18260128)
No. I'm not, but if I was, I'd grab my kid(s) on my way out. That's still prefferable to keeping them in wooden house of flying bullets.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by brandonmenc on Friday October 19, 2018 @09:45AM (#18256655)
Trayvon Martin was an application of "Stand Your Ground", not the Castle Doctrine.
Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by leetcrew on Friday October 19, 2018 @10:09AM (#18256820)
> Castle doctrine is scary.

only if you spend a lot of time in other people's houses uninvited.

Re:Sunshine Helps Kill Germs Indoors by bitexploder on Friday October 19, 2018 @11:03AM (#18257156)
It depends on the state. Castle doctrine laws and stand your ground laws often get intertwined in some states. It isn’t a properly simple term to define.