After spending 8 hours a day at work, plus an hour lunch, plus time commuting—we're talking up to 11 hours here for work even if only 8 is spent in the office—I'm exhausted and don't have the energy for much else. I'm not just physically exhausted, either. I'm socially drained: spending 8 hours surrounded by coworkers and being forced to interact with them uses up my entire social budget for the day. Socialization is extremely draining to me, and work forces me to use up that energy on coworkers instead of my friends.

OK, that's a little harsh to my coworkers: I get along with them well enough, and after I or they leave the company I'll probably add some of them on Facebook, but that doesn't change the fact that I have no energy for people I know outside of work.

On the occasion I do have the energy to go out to a bar or something, then I have to choose between socialization and spending time on my hobbies. I can spend a few hours after work at the bar... or I could spend them at home reading more of a novel or hacking at one of my personal projects. Back when I was in college, I had plenty of time to do both. I could hang out with friends and then go and do stuff on my own at home. Now that I'm out of college, I have to choose, and having to choose sucks.

This is basically the entire problem. And, if I want to be good at my job the upcoming week, I basically have to hermit around the house and avoid the computer to avoid burnout. I love my job and I really like the people I work with, but the tank is only so big.

Except it's exhausting after 8 hrs (or more) in a job, 30-45m commute each leg, and some gym or other exercise (which can energize but steal hours from the day to socialize). Going home and opening a beer is the popping of the pressure/people overdose cork. Commuting on a crowded subway is exhausting personally.

In general, stamina (social, mental and physical) is like a muscle. The more you train it, the better shape it gets in and the more work it can do before it's exhausted. Start with something small like reading a book in a coffee shop after work, or meeting a friend for dinner and a beer. Slowly do more over time.

Just like you wouldn't go to a gym and deadlift 300lbs cold, you're not going to get off work and run a social club in your free time - but if you put in the consistent work, you can absolutely get there.

> but if you put in the consistent work, you can absolutely get there.

I'm guessing you're right - you _can_ do it (the same way people in medical residency can force themselves to work 80 hour workweeks), but will it ever feel pleasant and not like a chore? I can go out with friends in the evening after work, but I'll be a bit slow and groggy.

> I can go out with friends in the evening after work, but I'll be a bit slow and groggy.

And this is why the weekends are typically much busier than weekday evenings at restaurants and other social locations.

To continue using the gym metaphor - there's often times an initial hurdle, but once you're actually socializing and out there, you have a good time and you feel good afterwards.

> Commuting on a crowded subway is exhausting personally

Honestly I find all types of commuting exhausting in different ways, except possibly a medium-to-long trip on a nicer train, where I can use my laptop (mostly) how I would in a hotel room.

It will probably never happen, but in my view the next major worker's rights advancement should be some kind of amelioration of the commute factor, either by employers or the government. It's probably more than half the reason I left my last job.

I've always believed that making things 'feel more fair' tends to motivate at least some workers to put in extra effort more enthusiastically.

Honestly, I just want self-driving cars. Let me kick back and relax in a private vehicle where I don't have to do anything or interact with anyone.

I wouldn't expect it any time soon (except on specially regulated roadways, which hopefully there will be a lot of), but I tend to agree that in the long run, full automation is the ultimate answer to the commuting issue. Safety first, though.

remote working is another answer.

Have you tried mixing your exercise and socialising? Do a team sport, or a class, run/swim in a group, or just go to the gym with a friend.

I had a friend who once told me that once you have kids socializing is easy by the nature of getting the kids out and meeting up with other parents. I have found this to ring true since having our first. We have met other parents through daycare, mutual parenting groups, and other distant relationships. Having a kid also makes this inherent struggle a bonding exercise for new friendships as you learn to rely or at least sympathize with each other.

Also, no one is ever stuck. On your time for self care you have to make an effort. This is a lesson you simply have to learn. I know I have.

This is very true, I've found. I have more in common with people who also have small children; together we easily have things to talk about.

I'll sit and have hours-long conversation with other parents of my kids' friends'. Pretty meaningful conversations. I'm not even entirely sure of their names.

My lifestyle is already shifting me out of the no-kid lifestyle (and therefore friends who don't have kids) by default.

Right on. My definition of alcoholic shifted. I now see occasional binge drinking as legit (ie. it’s an occasion) and nightly beers are where damage comes from due to compound interest logic. It takes several days to truly recover from even one beer, so I almost never feel the price is worth it. It’s not age, I regained my ability to drink like a Mad Man again over 30 when I moved to SF, but cut back again after a year and it’s totally obvious that even 1 beer kills the week (3 sober periods in life: 0-21, 28, now 32-33 sans 4 occasions). I would’ve downvoted this a couple years ago, but now I preach it because it’s so counter intuitive yet life changing and I think took 2-3 points to make a line. Occasional drinking without limit if ever fine, vs. daily beer and you have a problem. Compound interest and greater energy levels = best self every single day.

He didn't neglect that, he said, "...and you're not interacting with people in a way that leads to making friends in your 8-hour evenings,..."