News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by askafriend on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @02:18PM (#16969760)
Cue the cynics on HN, but I think this is a very natural step for FB to take and I think the product will do very very well.

Even if you're on a separate dating service like Tinder, you look up your matches on FB anyway as a sanity test. FB already plays a large role in dating and the signaling involved. It just makes sense for FB to own the process from start to finish when they have the ability to do it better than any existing dating app today.

FYI: Shares of Match Group (they are a public holdings company for many of the popular dating sites out there) plunged after FB announced this.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by jbob2000 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @03:20PM (#16970481)
Facebook marketplace has been a boon for buy/sell to me and my family. Kijiji and craigslist are very sketchy, but with FB marketplace, you can see who the person actually is. It makes us feel much more safe when we go to meet the person.

I see FB dating as having similar success. I can see you and your connections and validate that you aren't going to kill or rape me when we meet up for coffee (or if you're male; I can see that you are a real person and not a bot).

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by reaperducer on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @03:43PM (#16970721)
> Facebook marketplace has been a boon for buy/sell to me and my family

Interesting. In my area, Facebook Marketplace is almost all stolen/burgled/shoplifted goods. People even call it "Fencebook."

Want a brand new, unopened PS/4 for $25? Fencebook to the rescue!

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by throwaway613834 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @03:47PM (#16970764)
...huh. How do you tell stolen goods from legitimate ones? Obviously the price can't be the only factor since they could just try to sell it closer to a realistic price.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by mseebach on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:03AM (#16975764)
If you're buying something expensive, require an original invoice and check that the serial number matches. If someone is apprehensive about that, somehow they lost the invoice for the brand new unopened PS4 they bought last week, or similar, just drop it.

If they're selling close to the original price, just get it from a shop instead, that way you'll get warranty etc too (there's generally no warranty on goods with "lost" invoices).

In general, look out for suspicious behaviour. Are they willing to meet with you at their home or office? Do they readily share their phone number? Do they have many excuses (one of the most common tells for liers are an excess of over-thought out excuses) for not doing things transparently? If it's too good to be true, it probably isn't true.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by throwaway613834 on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:17AM (#16975824)
Thanks! The trouble is all of these can fail for what I would consider legitimate reasons. Requiring a receipt fails if they just open it, maybe even use it a bit (or not), and wait a few months before selling it, since nowadays people seem to genuinely go through some stuff (e.g. phones) pretty quickly and not necessarily keep or have receipts, especially if they themselves bought it second-hand. Meeting at my home or office is not something I would ever feel comfortable doing, and is generally recommended against when purchasing online. Sharing phone numbers is something I'd only do when the decision to purchase has gone through and we're actively trying to meet up (obvious privacy concerns), etc.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by mseebach on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:32AM (#16975918)
It's not an exhaustive, binary checklist, they are signals to watch out for. They are basically surrogates for trust. If you're selling something that looks like it might have been stolen, you have to come up with a compelling reason to trust you. Meeting at your office and sharing a business card might be such a reason. If the only thing you're comfortable with is meeting in a deserted parking lot late at night, and only communicating over a throwaway anonymous email account, the counterpart is right to suspect something is fishy. On the other hand, if you have an original invoice from the Apple store, then it might be OK.

Sure, there are legitimate reasons for not getting any of these right, but if they get all of them wrong, be very careful.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by reaperducer on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @03:53PM (#16970833)
It's not hard, once you know what to look for. Basic pawn shop training.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by throwaway613834 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:01PM (#16970915)
Erm... I wasn't asking if it's difficult, I was asking what do you look for? Why in the world would a set of things to look for be a subject to conceal?

Edit: never mind, just realized you're worried I or someone else is trying to sell stolen goods and will abuse such a list that way, sigh...

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by cwillu on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @02:18AM (#16974544)
Because thrift store criminals spend _so_ much time reading deeply nested comment threads on hackernews...
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by bryanrasmussen on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @06:01AM (#16975459)
maybe the response would take 20 minutes to write.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by mseebach on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:06AM (#16975776)
Then spend the 20 minutes, or don't. Writing "the answer to your question exists" isn't a meaningful contribution.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by bryanrasmussen on Thursday May 03, 2018 @09:55AM (#16986034)
are you mad at me suggesting that they didn't write it down because they thought it would take them too long to write?

At any rate they didn't just say the information exists, they also said it was basic pawn shop training, so I googled "pawn shop detect stolen goods" the top answer was from quora https://www.quora.com/How-do-pawnbrokers-verify-that-the-ite... and there was something from a blog of somebody called the blog nerd which is a little difficult reading because of all the SEO keyword optimization he seems to have done

https://www.pawnnerd.com/how-do-pawn-shops-track-stolen-item...

there seemed to be a reasonable number of other informative links.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by bryanrasmussen on Thursday May 03, 2018 @02:46PM (#16988660)
oops, the pawn nerd not the blog nerd.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by TeMPOraL on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @01:37AM (#16974346)
In my area, Facebook is (and was even before the Marketplace) routinely used to sell clothes very cheaply - usually because the seller is buying wholesale and then selling it without paying taxes. You can get them even cheaper if the seller is a person from a rich family who doesn't care much for a profit, but uses this as their pastime.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by bruceb on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @11:46PM (#16973885)
Some of those are not stolen, they are just scams for users to send money someone for say an iphone X and then they get the item sent to them, which of course doesn't happen.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by bradlys on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:45PM (#16971391)
Where do you live?

I'm curious because I've used Craigslist all across the west coast in the USA and I've never found myself worried. I've used it for bigger ($XXXX) and small purchases ($X). Brand new and very used. Most people I've met are very friendly and decently honest. Flakey is usually my biggest complaint with Craigslist people.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by jbob2000 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @07:26PM (#16972692)
Toronto, Canada. A somewhat major news item recently was that a guy was killed trying to sell his truck on Craigslist. These stories have popped on and off the news for a while now.

Other than that, the pseudo anonymity makes people uncomfortable with craigslist. At least, that’s the sentiment I’ve gotten from a few people who’ve used it. Contrasting that with the feedback I’ve heard about marketplace, people just feel safer when you can creep a buyer’s profile before they show up at your house.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by joering2 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @06:57PM (#16972511)
Agree; this comes to mind: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1486616/
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by askafriend on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @09:30PM (#16973369)
Nextdoor’s new For Sale section is the best of these services imo since everyone is address-verified. I get a lot of spam from FB Marketplace but even with the spam, it’s miles better than Craigslist/OfferUp/etc.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by ben_jones on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:36PM (#16971292)
Aren't the majority of rapes perpetrated by people the victim knew previously?
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by noobermin on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @02:33AM (#16974616)
I don't think rape is the only thing people fear when meeting strangers. Unpleasant experiences or stalking creeps might be something to look out for.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by amelius on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:44PM (#16971390)
Other dating services already use data from one's Facebook account. E.g. "Happn" requires you to login with Facebook credentials, and then uses photos from Facebook.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by keerthiko on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @10:47PM (#16973669)
Let's not kid anyone there's a pretty sizeable difference in how much of and how well the data facebook has on individuals can be leveraged by a first-party dating app. Happn and others like are hardly better than a stranger stalking two people's public facebook profiles and trying to make guesses as to whether they could match. Facebook knows what you/I really care about outside of what we may publicly list on our profiles, whether we like that or not, and thus if executed well can use that so much more effectively towards dating optimization.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by pryce on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @12:20AM (#16974028)
Would Facebook's dating service conceivably match me with someone who shares my moral objections to Facebook Inc's behaviour?

This seems like a joke question, of course. But consider: Ten years or fifteen years from now, supposing nearly everyone is using Facebook's dating service, could Facebook Inc adjust their matching algorithm to give shittier / less promising results to those people for whom it identifies as having a dislike for Facebook Inc's behaviour? Conceivably, what about matching them with someone who is likely to be sterile?

Could those who express objections to Facebook Inc's behaviour be gradually phased out of the population (not completely, obviously), by a motivated director, over a few generations?

Possessing objections to domineering corporate behaviour does not have to be genetic, nor does it even have to be overwhelmingly heritable -just mostly so- for Facebook Inc's incentives and capacities to align towards considering this sort of dystopian strategy.

I don't raise this because I imagine it to be true at all; I raise it because we are reluctant to spend time actually considering these kind of hypotheticals for how massively-dominent social platforms might affect our society and way of life, and often as a society we only consider them in retrospect. For example, Cambridge Analytica's unethical actions are a fairly predictable outcome of Facebook's business model and have (already) now lead to significant negative effects on a worldwide scale.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by bryanrasmussen on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @05:58AM (#16975450)
Don't worry, this will only happen if the algorithm determines there is a less than 63% chance that matching you with someone who is very pro-Facebook is likely to change your opinion regarding Facebook to be more positive.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by mseebach on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @06:52AM (#16975713)
Not spending time considering hypotheticals you don't imagine to be true at all is a pretty rational thing to do.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by pryce on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:56AM (#16976063)
That seems intuitive but is surprisingly misguided; in fact, it depends on your purpose.

Consider planned destructive testing in engineering, where perhaps one component is built purposefully weakened and then the whole system stressed in order to ascertain where and how the other components fail in response. This can lead to better understanding and to superior alternative designs in future.

In a related way, we can imagine destructive testing on facets of our institutions and societies, and try to ascertain how our systems may then fail in turn.

One example is when designing constitutional separation of powers, we might find it implausible to imagine a president intentionally undermining the Justice Department and his own intelligence agencies, but yet still design the constitutional separation of powers in such a way that the system retains some amount of robustness or integrity should that ever eventuate.

We might choose to design our medical quarantine protocols in such a way that they don't overly rely on protecting against known agents (viruses, bacteria, fungi, parasites, amoebae etc) but have some robustness against not yet encountered classes of threat, eg quarantine protocols that were concieved before the discovery of prion diseases.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by mseebach on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @09:03AM (#16976462)
When we do destructive testing in engineering, it's because we know for a fact that stuff fails for any or no reason, and while it might be rare, it happens all the time at scale. When the framers of the constitution designed strong separation of powers, they absolutely explicitly expected presidents to try to become kings, and so designed very strong safeguards against that happening.

The problem with your Facebook hypothetical is the absence of a mechanism by which the bad situation happens. How do we get to a point where Facebook to any practical degree has the power to prevent someone from dating at all? There has always been smaller and larger groups of misfits and outcasts, and they have generally been capable of connecting with each other beyond the majority hegemony (caveats here of course for repressive government power, but that's out of scope for this hypothetical, and belongs in constitution-related hypotheticals).

But let's then consider the hypothesis: Even if they do get to a significant position in dating, there are plenty of reason to believe they wouldn't use that power to prevent "anti-Facebookers" to date: privately owned publishers and printers happily print and sell the communist manifesto. You can sell your anti-Amazon book on Amazon, and publish it to Kindle. You can search for all the reasons Google is the worst company ever on Google. You can put "I hate Tinder" in your Tinder profile. And you can form a group about why Facebook is awful on Facebook, organise a "down with Facebook" rally using Facebook events and sell "Facebook sucks" stickers on Facebook marketplace. The logic of private markets very simply shows that it's plainly in a company's interest not to discriminate against people for the transgression of merely not liking the company.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by TeMPOraL on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @01:32AM (#16974317)
Which, incidentally, allows you to background-check a listed person on Facebook easily, if you know how to capture traffic on your device and read out user ID from the photo's URL.

(Or at least used to allow, don't know the current state.)

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by thrillgore on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:02PM (#16970927)
It's the most stable and safest direction to go in, when you know you've reached your peak in features and user-generated data.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by tokyodude on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @02:07PM (#16979642)
So at least in my experience in Tokyo, Facebook is not shared by daters until after they've met. A dating service might use facebook to sign in and gather a few pieces of data but actually letting someone look at all your photos and your posts is not something I think most Japanese women would do if they haven't met you in person already.

If fb shared more data I'm not sure how well that would go over, at least here.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by swiley on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @05:49AM (#16975409)
Ehhh I used tinder a lot and you don’t need to look people up on facebook until after the first date, crazy people pretty much always show they’re crazy before then.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by stctgion on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @08:17AM (#16976191)
I've checked dates before for a friend. Finding out before a date that they are fb friends with an ex is really useful
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by Gudin on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @04:47AM (#16975091)
I wonder if Facebook is going to end up as a dating site because Tinder is mostly hook-up site.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by kowdermeister on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:01AM (#16975754)
Based on my few months experience of Tinder, girls here only want long term stuff. I guess it depends on the country as well.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by golergka on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @07:09AM (#16975788)
People's intended and real intentions are two different things. In many cultures, women are, unfortunately, shamed if they pursue one-time sexual encounters, so they often adjust their signalling accordingly.

Doesn't mean they're not up for hookups though.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by meow_mix on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:03PM (#16970936)
look up matches on fb? dude that's creepy
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by chrisseaton on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @05:23PM (#16971810)
What do you think the point of Facebook is if not to look up people socially? That's literally what a 'face book' was originally for.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by 0xCMP on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @05:11PM (#16971696)
Also with the number of fake profiles and lying that goes on these services it's worth checking just to make sure they're a real person. Otherwise you ask some more questions or just act cautiously until you know they're a normal person. (e.g. Not a con-artist or scammer. etc.)
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by always_good on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:43PM (#16971366)
You generally prefer the other person not knowing you "cared" that much, but it's a simple vetting trick.

Fear of everything you do in private being creepy is just a self-limiting belief.

Digging for bikini pics isn't part of the process here.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by magic_beans on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:47PM (#16971429)
As a woman, it's a basic safety protocol to at least check that a man doesn't appear obviously crazy before going out with him.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by kingkongjaffa on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @05:13PM (#16971717)
Same goes for men too...
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by magic_beans on Thursday May 03, 2018 @11:29AM (#16986869)
A man is not usually at risk of any physical danger, though.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by jacquesm on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @05:23PM (#16971812)
I'm pretty crazy but you'd never know it by looking at me.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by booleandilemma on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @07:51PM (#16972841)
I specifically say I’m not crazy on my profile.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by drewmate on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @11:24PM (#16973803)
Is having a facebook account an important place to start when trying to establish the appearance of sanity? Asking for a friend...
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by 908087 on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @12:07PM (#16978358)
Personally I'd mark having a Facebook account as a negative in terms of sanity.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by doughj3 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @05:32PM (#16971899)
I'm surprised you're being downvoted, I agree with you. I'm not even sure how you would do this, as Tinder Bumble et al don't show surname. Search by given name and job / university? Not everyone shows those, and even if they do, I agree it's weird to stalk someone's info on FB just by finding their dating profile.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by always_good on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @07:34PM (#16972741)
It's like picking your nose in private. You can raise a stink in public about how you'd never do it with fake disgust, but I'm sure you do it.

I don't think it's any less weird to meet up in person with someone after just seeing 3-5 pictures of them and a vapid bio. Looking at the Facebook profile can give you a sense of how they conduct themselves and whether they're crazy. Like if their wall is dedicated to some MLM scheme and they get in fights with their friends/family. Or whether their Tinder pictures are from 5 years and 100 lbs ago.

If you think it's weird, then I'm not convinced you've used Tinder enough to escalate it into a date. If you did, you'd know that having one mutual friend in common makes it easy to hunt them down and even if you don't, Tinder gives you enough info to anyways unless they have their privacy settings jacked up.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by oytis on Wednesday May 02, 2018 @06:44AM (#16975673)
I can't understand why people consider facebook profile something private at all. Profile is your personal web page, containing information you put there for expose to the public. Surfing web pages to see what's available there is a basic activity WWW has been built for.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by joering2 on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @06:54PM (#16972493)
> you look up your matches on FB anyway as a sanity test.

You lookup people from Tinder on Facebook? For what?

I would say its not a sanity test; you just simply a creep.

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by Retra on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @08:08PM (#16972947)
Curiosity is a virtue some places.
Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by reaperducer on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @03:49PM (#16970789)
> you look up your matches on FB anyway as a sanity test

Worst. Sanity test. Evar!

Re:Facebook is launching a dating feature by sjm-lbm on Tuesday May 01, 2018 @04:01PM (#16970913)
Honestly, it depends on what you mean by 'look up' - Coffee Meets Bagel (another dating app) includes a feature that will show you mutual Facebook friends (if such a thing exists). That's a really interesting indicator how/where a match's social circle overlaps yours, which can say a lot of important things. That totally ignores, of course, the opportunity to get a second opinion from one of those mutual friends as well.

Stalking and/or looking up 13 year old college party photos is probabally, shall we say, less sane.