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Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by grabcocque on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:12PM (#15150392)
Uber's main success was to take something that already existed (taxi services) but then found a way to work around local labour laws on a technicality.

Because Uber drivers are all self-employed, they're not unionised or protected in any way. Thus, Uber pays its drivers a pittance, and is able to undercut and undermine existing taxi services who are forced by unions and law to pay drivers a living wage.

That's the key to being Uber for X. Ask: can I use the internet and shady business practices to exploit workers to undercut a business that previously workers were protected in?

If the answer is Yes, then you can be Uber for X.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by krrrh on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:47PM (#15150741)
I'm often an Uber critic, can't see how their valuation is justified, appalled by their lack of ethics, etc., however I think your analysis sells them short.

Hailing or waiting for a taxi was a horrible experience in most cities. Leveraging the smartphone platform's ability to track location in real time, along with its ability to be connected and handle payments created a better service. This did compete with existing Taxi monopolies (which had enormous costs associated with rent seeking in many jurisdictions, not just labour costs), but it also competed heavily with non-consumption, car ownership, and car rentals for those on trips. The pattern of social life has changed in many cities where the inconvenience, lack of reliability, and cost of using a taxi had previously constrained peoples' options, and forced reliance on owning a car, driving when they shouldn't, or staying closer to their neighbourhoods or going home early.

It's true that most of what gets called Uber for X is just enabling casual labor, without significantly expanding the market, and that's why so few of them achieve anything close to an Uber-level of success.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by always_good on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:05PM (#15151519)
Or any time I've only had a 50 peso bill and a 200 peso bill, the ride will cost 100 pesos, and the taxi driver somehow doesn't have change.

Or any time I've tried to hail a taxi among a bunch of other people (after an event or at 2am at the city center when all the bars close) and I'm stuck hoping I'm the lucky chosen one the next time a taxi comes, losing out each time to a group of people.

Or any time a taxi driver took advantage of the fact that they knew my options were limited late at night.

Uber solved major points of frustration with taxi services.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by monocasa on Friday September 01, 2017 @04:12PM (#15152021)
Or the time when my SO and some of her friends took a taxi from LAX, and when one of her friends noticed that the taxi was going a particularly circuitous route, the driver locked the doors while saying "I'll take you anywhere I damn well please".

She won't use anything other than Uber/Lyft/etc. now since they have the GPS constantly running, and a record of who she gets in the car with.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by fragmede on Friday September 01, 2017 @04:06PM (#15151966)
Of course, after hailing and waiting, and then taking the ride, you had to pay for the taxi. And frequently the credit card machine was "broken" and you had to argue with the driver about not having any cash. In a time when many individuals have moved away from cash almost entirely, that was a huge source of friction, and Uber and Lyft largely solved with in-app credit card payments. Because you had to have the app to hail a ride, payment for individual rides after entering a card for the first one is frictionless for the user.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by bmm6o on Friday September 01, 2017 @07:38PM (#15153154)
This happened to me last month, in the US. We were in a popular tourist hotel, so I figured we would take a cab that's already here rather than trying to hook up with a Lyft driver. It was the worst! "Broken" credit card machine, charging extra for bags, etc. It's like instead of trying to compete with better service, the taxi driver wants to get his before the industry implodes.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by barry-cotter on Friday September 01, 2017 @07:42PM (#15153178)
Uber also made getting a ride while black a significantly easier experience. And their drivers will actually take you where you ask to go whereas regulations be damned if the taxi driver doesn't want to go there he won't.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by mpweiher on Friday September 01, 2017 @04:02PM (#15151947)
> taxi..horrible experience..smartphone..track location

So I use a taxi app. Real time tracking, payment, etc. No Uber, no undercutting safety standards or labor laws.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by crooked-v on Friday September 01, 2017 @05:47PM (#15152640)
Most taxi services don't have apps, or have apps that are just the equivalent of phoning the dispatcher.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by mpweiher on Saturday September 02, 2017 @03:12AM (#15154742)
So the solution would be to add better apps, rather than skirting safety regulations and undermining workers' rights.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by krrrh on Saturday September 02, 2017 @04:00AM (#15154867)
Yes, and in a city such as Berlin where the taxi supply is not artificially restricted through a mediallion system, and sensible safety and labour laws prevail to the extent that Uber is not even able to operate, an app like MyTaxi functions just about as well as "ride sharing" apps in my experience (though it trails in significant innovations such as UberPool / LyftLine).
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by WillPostForFood on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:35PM (#15150633)
The Taxi medallion system is more exploitative of labor than Uber, forcing poor people to prepay for the right to work. It's as close to indentured servitude as you can get.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by rwmj on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:46PM (#15150732)
The medallion system seems to be a US peculiarity.

In the UK you have to also pay fees up front (and pass certain tests) but the fees are relatively modest[1] and the tests include things like knowledge, medical fitness and criminal records, which all seems reasonable. This legally applies to Uber drivers too, although whether it is enforced seems to be in doubt[2].

(I'm not talking about London black cabs which operate on a slightly different system)

[1] The fees for my local council are in section 10 here: http://www.dacorum.gov.uk/docs/default-source/licensing-docu...

[2] https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/uber-may-face-21m-...

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by dmurray on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:52PM (#15151879)
> The medallion system seems to be a US peculiarity

The equivalent system existed in Ireland until 2000, with taxi licenses changing hands for over $100,000. I'd be surprised if this doesn't persist in other European countries and cities.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by Kankuro on Friday September 01, 2017 @04:43PM (#15152243)
In France, licenses have been given for free in limited numbers, and with the right to resell them on the market. So their price have increased up to 200-350k€. So some people made a lot of money there (and they one accept cash, so you know what can happen with the taxes). Recent buyers are in a bad position because they get it for a high price and now risk their value to drop because of the recent competition.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by zjaffee on Friday September 01, 2017 @08:00PM (#15153271)
The thing that OP is neglecting to mention about the medallion system is that it's purpose was to limit the number of cars on the road at any given time, which eventually turned into a cartel like market because there was a higher demand for medallions than was decided upon for how many taxis should be on the road to reduce congestion and the number of cars within cities.

In places with good public transit, this resulted in people using public transit to get home when taxis weren't available, now everyone just takes an uber/lyft. Additionally, this also hurts the speed at which busses can travel. However, now you see places like manhattan have far more cars on the road at any given time than before considering the taxis never left, and the number of cars went up to meet demand.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by icebraining on Saturday September 02, 2017 @09:02AM (#15155760)
eventually turned into a cartel

It was always so. The medallion system was imposed after taxi drivers rioted, set stuff on fire and attacked the police, since they disliked the competition from unemployed people who tried to make a living during the Great Depression.

"Striking taxi drivers was nothing new–the first strike took place in 1908, a year after the first taxi company was founded. But this strike had a hostile energy to it, as strikers went hunting for scabs to punish. As one driver put it, “the bastids that was scabbin’, we pulled the doors off their cabs.” Independent cab owners, who had nothing to gain by striking, had their windows smashed by blocks of ice and passengers thrown from their cabs. Police who tried restore order had their tires slashed and marbles thrown under their horses. By February 5, angry crowds of driving were brawling in the street with the police and torching independent cab cars."

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by ralmeida on Friday September 01, 2017 @06:04PM (#15152733)
Not sure how the values for a taxi license compare to a NYC "medallion", but Brazil does have expensive licenses as well. Anecdotally, most taxi drivers I've met rent the vehicle from someone else (don't have hard data on that right now, though).
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by chx on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:54PM (#15150828)
Uber got closer. They give you a subprime mortgage on your car where the payment comes out of your Uber fees and if you are behind, a remote inhibitor does not allow starting the car.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by ralmeida on Friday September 01, 2017 @06:07PM (#15152752)
But then at least you build equity on the car, right? Also, if you already own a suitable vehicle (which is arguably easier than owning a medallion), you wouldn't need the mortgage?
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by chx on Sunday September 03, 2017 @01:43AM (#15159880)
The medallion was a safe investment until Uber broke the law and got away with it.

It makes no sense to "build equity" in a car since the car is depreciating very fast especially if you use it a lot for example because you are driving it to serve your debt to Uber.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by ralmeida on Monday September 04, 2017 @08:40AM (#15167814)
It doesn't matter whether the medallion is a safe investment or not. Wikipedia tells me a NYC medallion was worth around 500k in late 2016. Median household income in NYC is around 50k, so that's 10 whole years of gross salary.

The truth is that the average person is not able to afford to drive a taxi without renting the medallion. Even building equity on a quickly depreciating asset such as a car used for Uber is better in terms of not having to pay to work.

Also, a Uber loan would not be the only way to get a car to drive for Uber. Even if you have no means to finance the car for yourself, many more people own a Uber-suitable car than a taxi medallion, so the price you'd have to pay to work for Uber would in any case be lower.

The original discussion was whether Uber or taxis would be more worker-restrictive. I don't think driving a Uber gives total freedom, but I fail to see how driving a taxi is any better for the worker.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by evanlivingston on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:42PM (#15150692)
That doesn't provide an argument for choosing the lesser of two exploitative systems.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by WillPostForFood on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:50PM (#15150780)
I don't think Uber is a good company, but I also don't think they are exploiting drivers. Even if you do, it is less exploitative than trapping drivers into a system by forcing them to prepay for the right to drive. Choose whichever you think is less exploitive when you need a ride, but don't pretend taxis are some noble system.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by goialoq on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:54PM (#15150830)
Less exploitative is clearly better. If you don't like Uber, make something better or lobby for Uber to change, but don't wish for things to go back to how they were worse.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by s17n on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:41PM (#15150680)
Definitely true in NYC but Uber is global, in places like France they are lowering the bar for drivers' working conditions.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by corford on Friday September 01, 2017 @06:27PM (#15152839)
In Lisbon, Portugal it's like NYC. Any expat or local will tell you that they feel infinitely safer and more comfortable in an Uber than they do in a normal taxi.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by vasilipupkin on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:12PM (#15151578)
Eehh, care to explain ? I just came back from Paris and I used Uber multiple times a day while there, including to go to the airport. It was very convenient. My drivers didn't seem unhappy to be there. So, what's the problem ?
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by Kankuro on Friday September 01, 2017 @04:44PM (#15152253)
> My drivers didn't seem unhappy to be there

If they look unhappy, maybe the customer will give them bad ratings for bad customer experience…

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by enraged_camel on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:38PM (#15150652)
Those are two extraordinary claims. Let's see some equally extraordinary evidence.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by WillPostForFood on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:45PM (#15150723)
It's how the medallion system works, you prepay for the right to work.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_New_York_City#Meda...

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by sjg007 on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:08PM (#15150975)
So do strippers? And hairstylists? It's rent?
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by cableshaft on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:18PM (#15151071)
My understanding of those professions (strippers, hairstylists, etc) is they pay the business they work at up front for the night (or maybe week or month) and are expecting to make their money back and then some by the end of that short period of time.

Taxi Medallions are different, especially in large cities. They can cost $300,000 to $1,000,000+, upfront. Most taxi cab drivers have to take out a loan or lease the medallions in order to pay for it, and then they're beholden to the loaner for a long, long time.

This is why taxi cab drivers HATED when Uber starting taking away their business and didn't just shrug their shoulders, buy a black car, and join Uber. They are pretty much stuck and can't easily get out of it.

That's completely different than these other professions where if something isn't working out, you can switch which place you go to or try something else next week or next month.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by sjg007 on Friday September 01, 2017 @04:37PM (#15152194)
Most cab drivers lease the medallion from the medallion holder typically (including the car).. so it's the same. The medallion holder has no incentive to drive if they can rent out the right to drive. That was the game until uber. Uber could and probably will just buy all the medallions. Or if not necessary the medallions will just be effectively worthless.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by WillPostForFood on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:19PM (#15151079)
I'd put licensing fees for hairstylists in the same category, but it is the large price of medallions (hundreds of thousands to over a million dollars), and the long term commitment that creates that draws the analogy to indentured servitude. Along with the fact that medallions are government mandated and controlled. At least a hairdresser trying to rent a chair might have options to find other places, or even open their own shop.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by enraged_camel on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:54PM (#15150837)
That's true, but that doesn't make it indentured servitude, or even close to it.

Medallions exist to keep the supply of taxis limited. It ensures cab drivers have a certain standard of living. They can also be sold, so if the driver is retiring or wants to change to another career, they can do that.

It's not a perfect system but it strikes a decent balance between worker protection and limiting externalities (e.g. by making sure not everyone decides to become a cab driver and clog up roads).

edit: I guess Uber shills are out in force today.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by sctb on Saturday September 02, 2017 @03:27PM (#15157758)
Could you please stop violating the guidelines, which ask you not to complain about voting or insinuate shillage?

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by fragmede on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:54PM (#15151890)
> It's not a perfect system

I mean, slavery could also be described as "not a perfect system". Medallions in NYC had wholly undergone regulatory capture, so while the system may have started with good intentions, it had since been perverted into a self-perpetuating machine that prints money for a couple of lazy fat cats, to the detriment of everyone else.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by enraged_camel on Friday September 01, 2017 @06:55PM (#15152956)
>>I mean, slavery could also be described as "not a perfect system".

Medallion system is nothing like slavery. False equivalence.

>>it had since been perverted into a self-perpetuating machine that prints money for a couple of lazy fat cats, to the detriment of everyone else.

The medallion system benefits citizens because it ensures that taxis don't dominate city streets at the expense of regular car owners.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by kazinator on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:09PM (#15150991)
University degrees are also a system by which, effectively, people (some of whom are poor) prepay for the right to work.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by Waterluvian on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:18PM (#15151072)
You definitely need a medallion if you want to be a taxi driver.

But the medallion isn't an indicator that you're an expert professional driver. So it's different than, say, an M.D. or a law degree that are required because those things are difficult and the public needs protection from frauds.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by kazinator on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:01PM (#15151494)
Some degrees are "worthless", yet are needed as a document to tick off on a list of job requirements.

Of course, the analogy is far from perfect; in fact, I didn't really intend an analogy, as such.

A degree obviously isn't a license token you can move from one person to another, like the taxi medallion.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by bsder on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:03PM (#15150930)
The taxi medallion system was put in place precisely to avoid the inherent race to the bottom that is caused by a low barrier to entry (just need a car to be a taxi) and a fixed consumer base (limited number of passengers).

That is not fiction or speculation--it is history. You can look up the problems New York had before the taxi medallion system.

I am by no means defending the taxi system. It was rife with problems (especially outside the very biggest cities): unreliable pickups, long wait times outside of a very small number of areas, not wanting to take credit cards, bad driving routes to overcharge, and a whole litany of other complaints.

The only reason why the whole system hasn't devolved into a free-for-all is that Uber and Lyft have so much VC money subsidizing ride cost that nobody can get under their prices--they are below the bottom.

The real competitor to Uber/Lyft is the company who can take the existing cabs and cab companies and insert them into an app that does real-time bidding on their end and works like Uber/Lyft from the consumer end. Austin, TX showed that once Uber and Lyft quit sucking the oxygen out of the space, competition and new options start opening up.

However, Uber and Lyft will have to both implode first. And the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by wlesieutre on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:13PM (#15151029)
FWIW I tried to use RideAustin when I was there a few months ago and couldn't even get signed in to the app. Ended up using Uber instead.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by bsder on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:28PM (#15151180)
Well, once Uber and Lyft came back, the alternatives all basically fizzled out. It's kind of hard to compete against VC subsidized rides.

The telling thing to me is that Uber and Lyft came back to Austin with no concessions after throwing a hissy fit and leaving. That tells me that they saw something that scared them and they needed to squelch it before it escaped to other cities.

Edit: I stand corrected. The state legislature overrode the Austin laws. (Side: Wish I could put an overstrike through my comment.)

Make no mistake, this is 1990's Microsoft levels of predatory behavior. It is nothing to be praised.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by wlesieutre on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:33PM (#15151226)
The reason they left was Austin saying "You need to fingerprint all potential drivers and run them through an FBI fingerprint database."

They came back when legislature said "Actually you don't need to do that."

I'd hardly characterize it as a hissy fit.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by fragmede on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:39PM (#15151774)
City of Austin: "You need to fingerprint all potential drivers and run them through an FBI fingerprint database."

Uber: I don't wanna do that! Uber: stomps feet Uber: goes home Uber: Bribes Texas state into passing laws to force Austin to accept them.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by jsjohnst on Friday September 01, 2017 @05:56PM (#15152689)
While I am usually an outspoken critic of Uber, I feel this is an unfair portrayal of that situation. If I owned a ride hailing service, I would protest the same law.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by bb611 on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:39PM (#15151298)
Both services return were widely predicted here even before they left. It wasn't a hissy fit, it was a calculated move to reduce business costs, and it worked better than I think they even expected.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by tim333 on Friday September 01, 2017 @07:44PM (#15153193)
Probably the biggest problem with no medallion regular taxis is you can end up with dozens of them trying to pick up a small number of passengers and cluttering the streets and causing congestion. With Uber you don't get that - they seem to drop the prices to regulate the number of cabs instead.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by ardit33 on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:44PM (#15150713)
Taxi Medallion used to cost more than 500k in NYC.

So half or more of your fare are going to some guy that bought the medallion years ago (or some investors actually), and just rents the privilege for other drivers to drive, it doesn't go the driver's pay, or propper car maintenance, etc...

That is pure rent seeking via "regulation", and Uber and Lyft are cutting through it. (and I am glad they are doing it).

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by ams6110 on Friday September 01, 2017 @10:05PM (#15153793)
If by "cutting through it" you mean "breaking the law" I agree. And sometimes laws should be broken, to make a point. But let's not be under any illusions.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by dismantlethesun on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:55PM (#15150842)
Private cars services are hardly a 'technicality'. They've always existed and always been competitive with taxis, it's simply that their practice was to hire by the hour, and only do A-B transactions between major landmarks.

Uber was a private car service with black-cars only to begin with and evolved to allow more car types, which made it competitively priced to taxis.

Critically, when they began, they were intended for limo businesses to use to minimize driver downtime, hence the idea that Uber is merely a contract marketplace was normal and non-exploitive.

Now, that people are driving for Uber "for fun" or "to make extra bucks", Uber has found itself dealing with a large unsophisticated assembly of drivers, whom it can be claimed that they are exploiting (i.e. exploiting their ignorance). Is it a fair assessment? I'm not sure, but I can point at other business verticals like residential cleaning services, and moving companies that function as a market of independent contractors who united only under a 'brand' that does client-contractor matchmaking. At least in this respect, Uber is not unique.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by enraged_camel on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:48PM (#15150754)
Unfortunately, many people have a weird fetish for "disruption", and use it to justify pretty much any type of behavior.

They also view laws and regulations as inefficient, and don't understand that they often exist for good reasons (such as consumer protection).

If Uber ends up putting taxi companies out of business and becomes dominant, THEN we will see its true face and start hearing arguments for regulating it.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by delecti on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:14PM (#15151038)
Uber's killer selling point is not skirting labor laws, it's facilitating connecting labor with demand via an app. Skirting labor laws certainly made them more attractive because it let them charge less, but I use Uber (well Lyft, but same thing) because it's convenient to pay and to get picked up and dropped off.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by rayvd on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:53PM (#15151885)
In addition, it's questionable that those labor laws do more to protect laborers or exist solely to preserve a government-backed monopoly...

If someone doesn't want to drive for Uber, they can be a taxi driver instead...

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by fragmede on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:57PM (#15151912)
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by strken on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:45PM (#15150721)
A large part of Uber's early success was circumventing the quite frankly corrupt and intrusive taxi regulations that had congealed everywhere. Drivers no longer had to choose between purchasing a ridiculously expensive license or working for someone else: they could use an existing car and smartphone. At least part of the wage drop was the result of lowering barriers to entry for prospective drivers. Yes, Uber exploits its drivers now, but the existing taxi system was acting as a moat to prevent people becoming drivers in the first place, which was hardly any fairer.

Maybe a better question to ask is: which protectionist laws can my app help circumvent? "Uber for breaking down NIMBY coalitions and real estate developer cartels" would be extremely welcome.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by pjmlp on Friday September 01, 2017 @01:32PM (#15150594)
Which is the main reason why I will never use any Über for anything.
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by seanmcdirmid on Friday September 01, 2017 @03:02PM (#15151498)
> Uber's main success was to take something that already existed (taxi services) but then found a way to work around local labour laws on a technicality.

> Because Uber drivers are all self-employed, they're not unionised or protected in any way. Thus, Uber pays its drivers a pittance, and is able to undercut and undermine existing taxi services who are forced by unions and law to pay drivers a living wage.

What country are you in? In the USA, taxi drivers are also self employed, not unionized, and paid a pittance.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by ancap on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:24PM (#15151134)
> Because Uber drivers are all self-employed, they're not unionised or protected in any way. Thus, Uber pays its drivers a pittance, and is able to undercut and undermine existing taxi services who are forced by unions and law to pay drivers a living wage.

The fact that Uber drivers willingly and voluntarily engage in that work rather than pursuing alternative work doesn't align well with your narrative.

Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by anon_dev_123456 on Friday September 01, 2017 @02:06PM (#15150949)
I disagree. If I told you break some laws, you'll be protected, you still wouldn't be able to come up with a billion dollar idea and _execute_.

Uber's success hinged on the fact that they did a lot of things right, most importantly building something that's a net positive to the end user. Breaking laws just helped them expand quicker.

The end user for Uber doesn't care at all about wages for the drivers. "Oh that's so sad... but I need to use Uber because it's hassle free."

[dead]
Re:Read This Before You Build Uber for X by sctb on Friday September 01, 2017 @07:47PM (#15153201)
This account has been making personal attacks and they're not OK on Hacker News. Please stop and (re-)read the guidelines.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html