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Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by notacoward on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @08:13AM (#14552139)
> Inflation (mostly ZIRP driven) has been very high

Totally untrue. In 2013-2016 inflation was lower than at any time in the last half century. 2017 has been a bit higher, but still lower than all of 1967-1996. Sure, you can cherry-pick a particular commodity in a particular market to make it seem otherwise, but momentary or local fluctuations in supply and demand aren't really inflation. Inflation is a systemic phenomenon, and it's actually at historic lows. The fact that some people make life choices that subject them to rising costs doesn't really have anything to do with inflation.

http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/inflation/historical-in...

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by richardknop on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @09:31AM (#14552536)
Inflation measure (CPI) doesn't include real estate (and stocks etc), a single biggest cost young people will have to face in life. Unless they want to rent forever (and rent prices are not included in the official inflation rate either as social housing is over represented). So I can't take such inflation reporting seriously as that's a major omission.

And young people are the most affected by this shady way of calculating inflation as they are the ones that need to buy real estate to get on the property ladder.

>>> The fact that some people make life choices that subject them to rising costs doesn't really have anything to do with inflation.

Buying a house is not a life choice. It's a necessity.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by notacoward on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @10:00AM (#14552738)
> Buying a house is not a life choice. It's a necessity

Buying a house in a place where real estate will be your single biggest cost is indeed a choice. The way inflation is calculated might not be perfect, but let's not try to make it even more imperfect in a different way.

EDIT: also, even with housing factored in, inflation is still low.

http://cepr.net/data-bytes/prices-bytes/prices-2017-06

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by richardknop on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @02:14PM (#14554740)
Well couple percentage points make a huge difference cumulatively. 2-3% over 10 years adds up quickly.

I don't agree with your opinion though. If you are career oriented and want to be successful you will be drawn to big cities as that's where the best jobs are and where you can get ahead a lot. And real estate is very expensive there. I do think in rural areas it's also your biggest life expense as incomes are lower there. So it's the biggest cost item irrespective of where you live.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by notacoward on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @02:57PM (#14555109)
> 2-3% over 10 years adds up quickly.

So do those 10-50% raises over ten years.

> If you are career oriented and want to be successful you will be drawn to big cities as that's where the best jobs are and where you can get ahead a lot.

There's a grain of truth here. I'm able to work remotely, and just in the past month I've worked from a variety of different kinds of environments in four states. However, that's because I've built a skillset and a track record by working in close proximity with others at a bunch of startups plus a couple of larger companies. I understand that not everybody has that option.

However, even within a big city you have a choice of where to live. The crappiest place I ever lived was right in the heart of a big city. I've lived in crummy places, tiny places, places with awful commutes, places with multiple roommates to defray the cost. Those were my choices. You might make different choices, but they are still choices. People who make far less money than we do can still find places to live where they can come in every day to clean our offices, cook our lunches, teach our children. If they can, so can we.

It's amazing what you can do if you don't enter the rat race of who has the biggest house, takes the best vacations, knows the best restaurants. There will be time for that, after you've built your base. The first few years after college are still part of the foundation-laying stage. You shouldn't expect to be better off materially, and often you'll be worse off for a while. That's life. At least it's not a permanent condition for those of us in tech, like it is for so many others.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by TuringNYC on Thursday June 15, 2017 @06:24PM (#14564979)
"places with multiple roommates to defray the cost"

I had this perspective as well (in my 20s), until I had children. I supposed everything can theoretically be considered a want rather than a need. But how many people are really comfortable having roommates live with your family and children?

As for living in "the crappiest place", I lived in a pretty sketchy place during my childhood. We had metal detectors in our high school in Brooklyn. Reference: https://www.propublica.org/article/nyc-school-children-face-... You can consider wanting to go to a safe school a want (vs a need), but who doesn't aspire to that for their children?

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by notacoward on Monday June 19, 2017 @06:17PM (#14590871)
> how many people are really comfortable having roommates live with your family and children?

Is it not also a choice when (or whether) to have children? I put off having any until I was well established, to make sure that I could provide for them without the kinds of tradeoffs we're talking about. It's amazing what a difference it makes to defer major spending - houses, kids, etc. - until you're further up the salary curve.

> who doesn't aspire to that for their children?

We can all aspire for many things, but we all have to make choices - where to live, who/when to marry, which job to take, which house or car to buy, which trip to take, which money to invest where, etc. Few of us get to have everything we aspire to, for ourselves or our kids. If safe schools are a priority, as I agree they should be, maybe some of those other choices need to be made differently. It's all about priorities.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by richardknop on Thursday June 15, 2017 @04:46AM (#14558791)
It's somewhat true. I have worked remotely before. From my own experience I can charge about 2 times more when I can come to office in central London every day than remote. So that's also a trade off.

I could go back to remote and live in some cheap area but again I think it would hurt my career. The path to progression / promotion when working as remote employee is much longer. Being in the office and building relationships face-to-face, and learning how to navigate company politics is necessary to get to the next level.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by lotsofpulp on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @09:17AM (#14552459)
Whatever inflation is being measured should be linked to the choices people are making, otherwise what is the point of measuring it?

You need to get higher education, at least bachelors if not masters level, in order to secure a decent income. The cost of this higher education increases at a ridiculous rate, and it's one of the biggest purchases a young person makes.

Then you need to live near a city, the bigger the better. That's where all the jobs are and since work is much more fluid, you need to be where there are many employers. Also, you the advantages of networking capabilities in cities will give you a shot at going big. Living costs near large cities have also increased at a rapid pace, whether it be a home or rental. If you're going to have kids, you want them in the best schools, so you pay high property taxes or pay for private school. Best thing you can do to increase the odds of financial success for your kids is to make sure they go to school with other rich kids and have an wealthy network.

Then you get start getting sick and need medical care. This is also one of life's huge, unavoidable expenses. There is absolutely no way inflation is low for you if you depend on certain medicines, just read the headlines, the price could skyrocket anytime if the patent holder chooses to.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by paulddraper on Thursday June 15, 2017 @12:18AM (#14557916)
> need

> need

> need

I think we are confusing needs with wants. All good things, but all choices, not requirements.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by lotsofpulp on Friday June 16, 2017 @12:01PM (#14570102)
The data I have seen shows a considerable earnings and wealth gap for those who did make those choices versus those who didn't. No one needs anything other than a cave in the woods with some squirrel meat every now and then, but assuming you are like most people and want to land an attractive mate and secure heat and air conditioning and a future for your children, then you probably want to place your bets accordingly.
Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by notacoward on Tuesday June 20, 2017 @03:05PM (#14597490)
> earnings and wealth gap

But does that translate into a quality of life gap? It might not, and needing more earnings/wealth to pay for the same quality of life doesn't make it a rational choice.

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by baybal2 on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @04:14PM (#14555737)
The official inflation numbers in US are calculated in a rather dodgy way. You should read about that. Government statisticians take a very big effort to exclude a lion share of basic living necessities out of CPI calculation
Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by dragonwriter on Wednesday June 14, 2017 @04:27PM (#14555854)
> Government statisticians take a very big effort to exclude a lion share of basic living necessities out of CPI calculation

No, they don't.

Now, policy makers and media often highlight, and some programs are based on, the “core” CPI which excludes food and energy [0], rather than the full CPI, but since the data is collected by sector anyway, it's virtually zero additional effort to calculate the core CPI in addition to the full CPI; they are just two different aggregates drawn from the same base data.

The full CPI doesn't exclude “a lion share of basic living necessities” (it excludes taxes unrelated to consumer goods purchases, and that's about it.) [1]

[0] in principal, because of high short-term volatility of those components.

[1] https://stats.bls.gov/cpi/cpifaq.htm#Question_13

Re:The Old Are Eating the Young by baybal2 on Tuesday June 20, 2017 @09:29AM (#14594429)
>Now, policy makers and media often highlight, and some programs are based on, the “core” CPI which excludes food and energy [0], rather than the full CPI

Well, yes. This is how it is

The point where the dodgy part is for example how they do weighting for things like housing rents, their criteria of non-comparable replacements, idea of product classes (an apple is not an inferior version of an apple; a car is a car invariably of it being considered luxury car or not) and so on. The CPI dynamic has real trouble reflecting real consumer spendings.