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Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by vessenes on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:14PM (#7469563)
This is a good move by Facebook. VR is going to be huge, huge huge. It might even be as big as Bitcoin. :)

I think what Oculus did was massively de-risk their next ten years. In their business plans, there were undoubtedly very large gray circles with things like "gain overwhelming market share (how?)" and lists of competitors that included, well, everyone in tech.

If you had to pick a tech company to leverage your disruptive new consumer technology, and make sure it kept the 'awesome', and was hacker friendly, who would you go to?

In exchange, they probably lopped another 10-50x of potential value off the top of their company. Not that they won't see some of that realized in Facebook if this is succesful -- they will. But, they will be sharing the gain around in exchange for getting access to that giant global customer base and being able to tap the considerable resources available at FB.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by Blahah on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:15PM (#7469568)
> If you had to pick a tech company to leverage your disruptive new consumer technology, and make sure it kept the 'awesome', and was hacker friendly, who would you go to?

google

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by prawn on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:27PM (#7469684)
I expected Microsoft to grab them and I'm surprised they didn't. Would've made a smart fit with Xbox and given them easy ways to directly integrate it with their OSs. Would work well with gaming, education, eventually business, mobile and so on. $2b a few months ago would've been a small price to pay to get in early on this, unless they have something comparable up their sleeves from the research division.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by presty on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:33PM (#7470139)
Well, Don Mattrick left last year and Marc Whitten's leaving/just left, so I don't really find it surprising.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by vessenes on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:17PM (#7469596)
Yep, those would be the two companies you'd have bidding. Except, Carmack is too heavy metal to go to Google. I only partly jest.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by kposehn on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:38PM (#7469755)
Carmack is definitely too heavy metal for google :)
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by fernandotakai on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @10:46PM (#7471232)
tbh, of all companies, i would never say "carmack is going to facebook".
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by aviraldg on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:17PM (#7470034)
Valve or Google definitely. Valve because of the gaming expertise, Google for the existing experience and culture of innovation.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by Florin_Andrei on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:42PM (#7470613)
> Google for the existing experience and culture of innovation

Perfect contrast with Facebook.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by barbs on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:15PM (#7470023)
Valve
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by relampago on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:38PM (#7470170)
Nintendo
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by vicbrooker on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:19PM (#7469613)
amazon?
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by 10098 on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:43PM (#7469786)
When big companies buy small good products, they often turn to poop, because the new masters lack the original vision and the decisions about the product will be made by PMs trying to get a promotion, not by those who actually care. I suspect this will be the case with this acquisition. My opinion is based on the way I see facebook managing their products: whatever they're offering to ordinary users is mediocre and basically stays afloat only because of the network effect, and whatever they are offering to their paying customers is effectively a scam (youtube search for "facebook fraud"). I can't see them possibly making good use of Oculus.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by _zen on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:23PM (#7469643)
Spoken like an investor who knows nothing about the audience. Sorry, VR was intended for PC gamers. They're not casual mobile gamers. They loathe casual games. They now loathe VR for wedding with Facebook.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by runako on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:32PM (#7469719)
>> VR was intended for PC gamers

I'm not familiar with the intimate details of the Ocululs business plan, but their story page says they have a larger view of the potential for VR:

"revolutionize the way people experience interactive content"

and their vision says nothing about games:

"Immersive virtual reality technology that's wearable and affordable."

Perhaps the negative comments here are part of the natural bitterness from insiders that accompanies any technology as it goes mainstream?

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by cheald on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:44PM (#7469800)
I think a lot of the problem is that VR as a means of improving the process of "experiencing interactive content" only really works when the content is presented from a first-person view and there is value in that perspective. Right now, that means FPS and FPRPG games. Amnesia through the Oculus Rift is a genuinely amazing (and terrifying) experience that is improved by the headset (it makes you, the player, feel like you can't step back and escape, which adds to the experience); shopping in a virtual shopping mall is just an impediment to getting what I want.

Remember the VR-32 and VRML? Everyone was super excited that we were going to start doing all the things in virtual reality, and then we figured out that it's a really cumbersome way to present most information.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by runako on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:50PM (#7469834)
>> Right now, that means FPS and FPRPG games.

Sure, I understand that. My point is that perhaps folks who went to the trouble of dedicating their lives to VR might have a larger vision than this.

In 1992, you could have defined the Internet in similarly limited terms -- after all, using the Internet largely meant text interfaces. I'm just positing that the folks who run Oculus are a) smart and b) have spent a lot of time thinking about how best to spread VR.

If VR takes off, by definition it will mean expanding beyond FPS games, because most people do not play those (you could alternatively get VR to go mainstream by increasing market penetration of FPS and FPRPG games by orders of magnitude, which might be harder than putting VR to other uses).

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by cheald on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:00PM (#7469915)
I'm certainly willing to be wrong - I'm not an expert in the space beyond having been an enthusiast gamer for 20 years (and I recognize that doesn't give me domain authority) - but I've been waiting for VR to be a thing for a long time now, and while it's had some neat demos, it's almost never something that I look at and decide that prefer over more traditional interfaces.

Carmack is a ridiculously smart guy who is damned good at squeezing things out of hardware that shouldn't be possible, and if there's anyone that I think could work out the how-to of VR, I think it'd be him, but I'm not sure that I trust his read on what the markets want.

The question isn't so much "will VR take off?" as it is "what could VR possibly do beyond FPS games that could make it take off?" and I just don't have any answer to that at all.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by WalterSear on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @02:18AM (#7471906)
Yes, but first it has to win the gaming market, or it's a non-starter. Games are the Facebokulus's killer, game changing, app. Everything else is just speculation, and will take a while and will build on whatever happens in gaming, because VR gaming is already here.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by semiel on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @03:24AM (#7472070)
Before you can expand, you have to first hit your core market. This deal seems like putting the cart before the horse, to me.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by genma_it on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @06:41AM (#7472568)
Actually, in the Kickstarter they state in bold:

"Designed for gamers, by gamers." [1]

Now, I understand that in the Kickstarted it was promised only the first developer kit and that it was successfully delivered, but I feel very uneasy knowing that the Facebook platform is geared exclusively to casual gaming. My worry is that Facebook will be happy with a VR technically good enough for a social VR but that can't stand the requirements for gaming. I may be too old to understand, but I really don't feel the urge to interact in 3d with my friends to say hello or to watch their holiday's pictures.

[1] https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1523379957/oculus-rift-...

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by waterlesscloud on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:33PM (#7469724)
Spoken like a fan with no imagination. Sorry for that, but seriously, come on. PC Gamers are the only audience you can see for VR?

VR is way, way, WAY bigger than some hardcore gaming nerds (of which I am one).

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by cheald on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:40PM (#7469773)
VR, at least as it stands right now, is squarely in the domain of the enthusiast, which has a very broad overlap with PC gaming crowd. Something like the Oculus Rift has no real potential with mobile gaming (power requirements alone preclude that).

What sorts of applications can you imagine? The idea of virtual presence being a killer app is silly, IMO - I've played with both the Oculus Rift and telepresence robots - they're neat, but for meetings/gatherings, I'll take a plain old webcam any day. I can't imagine what Facebook would do with this that I would be interested in.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by aviraldg on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:19PM (#7470048)
True. But the best strategy for widespread adoption is to get the hardcore enthusiasts first, who in this case are the PC gamers.

For example, see how well that's worked out for Tesla.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by baby on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:07PM (#7470367)
Isn't that what they exactly did? They got all the PC gamers on fire, got Carmac, got bought by facebook. Now they're reaching for the moon, they became so big that people started hating, you can't avoid that.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by LoganCale on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:41PM (#7470602)
Literally no one is hating them for getting big, everyone hates Facebook and doesn't want Oculus (which makes awesome technology) ruined by them.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by phenol on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:50PM (#7470672)
I don't think people are upset because they "got big", but because they were acquired by a corporation that signals a core shift in their ideals. If they were bought by Valve, or even Microsoft, I don't think there'd be nearly as much backlash -- because it's not that they're BIG, it's that Valve and Microsoft would not be pushing for a different market with their product (not to say they wouldn't later).
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by deciplex on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @02:40AM (#7471966)
>They now loathe VR for wedding with Facebook.

No just Oculus.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by joyeuse6701 on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:05PM (#7470349)
Filthy Casuals. Yeah that demographic was basically given the finger by this move, if I were Sony, I'd capitalize.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by T-R on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:43PM (#7469794)
This is a terrible move for Oculus, though. The reaction from their core audiences - hardcore gamers and developers - seems to be largely negative, at a time right after Sony - a company that caters to that audience - announced its competing "Project Morpheus". It's not being taken as a signal of Facebook's innovation, but as Oculus moving toward a casual audience, and their fan base feels abandoned. Do they really feel that whatever plans they have with Facebook are so low-risk and high return that they no longer need that audience?
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by baby on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:05PM (#7470344)
They have a new audience now: the world.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by LoganCale on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:39PM (#7470593)
The world's reaction is also negative. They don't want to wear a box strapped to their face to interact with their friends. Seriously, look at the reaction on Twitter by non-gamers and Facebook users. It's being met with incredulity and mockery.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by nnq on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @07:06AM (#7472648)
They don't want now, but wait 'till Facebook does "their magic" on them :) That "networking effect" stuff is not buzz-speak, and they know how to wield it.

Plus, gaming and socialization go hand in hand - it's amazing that others just don't fucking get this yet and see "gamers communities" as just niches or islands.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by T-R on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @09:04PM (#7470764)
Their new audience isn't quite as easily convinced to invest hundreds of dollars on a piece of dedicated hardware.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by WalterSear on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @12:21AM (#7471570)
They already had that audience - down the line, once they have established their beachhead. Selling themselves to facebook doesn't bring it any closer.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by audiophilip_ on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:23PM (#7469641)
>If you had to pick a tech company to leverage your disruptive new consumer technology, and make sure it kept the 'awesome', and was hacker friendly, who would you go to?

Valve.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by aryastark on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @07:05PM (#7469956)
Or Blizzard. They have an actual virtual world already. I can easily see WoW fans who already sit at a PC and buy special hardware for their games to flock to VR tech.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by ericd on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @09:20PM (#7470837)
Yeah, there are so many companies that I'd have picked over FB if I were them. Blizzard and Valve would have been excellent choices, though.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by anaphor on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @04:45AM (#7472238)
Or even Nintendo, or maybe even Bethesda (assuming they aren't bitter about him leaving Id)
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by icelancer on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @05:45AM (#7472415)
Bethesda already passed on it.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by lotu on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @10:57PM (#7471270)
Does Valve have $2billion dollars lying around to acquire companies with?
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by fleetfox on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @02:17AM (#7471904)
Yes
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by masklinn on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @03:41AM (#7472102)
Don't think so. Valve's total equity was estimated at ~$2.5bn in 2012
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by zerooneinfinity on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @11:28AM (#7474032)
Just curious where you got the source for this -- no pun intended.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by masklinn on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @01:59PM (#7475101)
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/09/technology/valve-a-video-g...

> Not that Mr. Newell hasn’t had opportunities to sell out. Valve has been pursued over the years by Electronic Arts, which would very likely have valued Valve at well over $1 billion had the talks progressed that far, said two people with knowledge of the discussion who spoke on condition of anonymity because the talks were private.

> Although Valve’s finances are private, Michael Pachter, an analyst at Wedbush Securities, estimates that the company could be worth around $2.5 billion today.

It's guesswork and no method is explained though, so it's not like that's a very reliable estimate or anything.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by zerooneinfinity on Wednesday April 02, 2014 @10:18AM (#7515645)
Ah interesting, thanks for following up.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by tomelders on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:20PM (#7470473)
My bold prediction: Facebook will be broke in five years, gone in ten. Anyone getting into bed with them now is putting the noose around their own neck.

Facebook is a prototype of what "social networking" should be. Anyone who took five minutes out of their day could think up ten ways "social networking" could be better, and probably all of them would be incompatible with facebook's business model.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by yourad_io on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @11:45AM (#7474190)
IANABP (..Business Person) but their 2 big acquisitions have increased their share of the social/data/identity pie considerably. Yes, these can be very ephemeral and the market can change on you (as MySpace will gladly tell you), but having 1.1B+ monthly actives on your core platform alone (plus however much instagram+whatsapp do) gives you a lot of room to try and recover when things start shrinking.

The oculus VR acquisition feels special, in that they aren't just buying users/reach, but something more substantial and forward looking. If they're smart, they'll let the oculus team work on the track they've been on, and let Facebook teams develop the "non-gaming VR experiences" they want to push.

Hard to think how much the landscape would need to shift for FB to be broke in 5 years. If Oculus delivers on their VR dreams, that alone could potentially bring an almost-bankrupt FB back from the brink.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by tomelders on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @12:49PM (#7474641)
I find it's very easy to imagine how the landscape could change for FB to be broke in five years; Anyone can build a better way to "social network", and anyone will. Guaranteed. The only real question is... what happens if Facebook can't buy them?

I admire what Facebook has achieved, but it's clear to me that they don't understand what their actual role is, or what people "want" from Facebook as a company if it is to survive. There is an air of mild desperations to the whole enterprise that hints at the acknowledgement of an imminent demise. This acquisition reeks of that desperation.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by ivanca on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:44PM (#7469799)
False false false; this is the dead of Oculus for one simple reason: Developers, doesn't matter how much ridiculous amounts of money you have if you scare away developers making it part of one of the spammiest and most hatred companies in the world it will fail.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by jo_ on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @01:28PM (#7474902)
Part of the reason I asked if I could cancel my preorder of Dev Kit 2 was some bad experience with Facebook dicking devs early on. Unless they've changed their tune in recent years, I don't understand how this could bode well for their support audience.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by qq66 on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @04:20AM (#7472187)
> most hatred [sic] companies in the world

Look at #81. http://www.apcoinsight.com/methodologies/tools/el-top-100-co...

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by baby on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @08:08PM (#7470375)
Facebook is not the most hatred company in the world, especially after Instagram, Whatsapp and Oculus' acquisitions.
Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by wildermuthn on Tuesday March 25, 2014 @06:25PM (#7469665)
I agree that it is a good move, but not because of takes away risk. It's because Facebook has a great deal of users, money, and apparently vision. I had no idea Zuck was this smart (although building Facebook into a giant ought to have been a good clue).

Oculus isn't being conservative here. They're shooting for the moon.

Re:Oculus Joins Facebook by WalterSear on Wednesday March 26, 2014 @12:22AM (#7471573)
I would have said Oculus, before today.