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Re:Just Use Sublime Text by ebbv on Thursday March 21, 2013 @12:54AM (#5413012)
Am I the only person in the world who:

a) Never thought vim was that hard to learn (and I first learned it when I was a teenager and nobody helped me. I switched when someone on a MUD made fun of me for using pico.)

and

b) Thinks vanilla vim works just fine. Seriously my vimrc is like 10 lines long and I don't even have it on every server I work on. I don't bother with any plugins. I don't need vim integrated with git, I don't need it to do anything except let me edit text efficiently.

I dunno maybe I'm crazy.

EDIT:

I also often feel like I'm alone in not treating what tools (including text editor) I use like it's a religion. I don't care if anybody else uses vim or not. People should use what they wanna use, what do I care?

These kinds of rants make me wonder what kind of medication the OP stopped taking. If he hates vim so much stop using it. It's clearly causing him a lot of misery.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:35AM (#5413560)
> what kind of medication the OP stopped taking

The OP has a really "sane" take on things imho (yes, it's incredibly opinionated, but it's blog post featured on HN, not a SO question someone like you can close in minute :) - and I'm glad he bothered to write it, as I'd probably just send the link to it to any newbies asking me about "the magical vim" instead of bothering to tell them what I think) and he's right on one thing: vim will not increase the productivity of a new user. The actual productivity increase will only happen months later (basically too late to worth it), and it will not matter that much because 90% of the time spent coding is actually spent either:

(1) plainly writing code (no advanced editor functionality helps here, Notepad++ is basically good enough!),

(2) making simple edits to code (again, more editor functionality doesn't really help because 90% of the time spend editing code it actually spent thinking about what to edit, not actually pressing the keys)

(3) reading code,

(4) exploring codebases (the only thing helpful at this is a full featured IDE - it just takes too much work to turn vim in to something like this, and you'll just end up with something mostly matching Netbeans feature-wise, so you could just as well install Netbeans or something else better for your language/framework in 5min and spend 1h to really learn how to use it),

(5) debugging (again, the only thing that could, for some, including me, increase productivity, is a full-fledged graphical debugger).

...and if you need to improve that last 10%, then you are far from a beginner at anything, eg. you are not the person that vim tends to be recommended to nowadays.

And the OP also expressed why I like ST so much: "To code in Vim, you have to keep Vim in your head just as much as the code that you’re editing. You have to constantly think about what you’re doing." - at most (not all) things ST beautifully follows the "don't make me think" principle: eg. arbitrary multiple cursors (no other IDE or editor besides Notedpad++ has them yet, no matter how many users requested this for JetBrain IDEs for example), that just let you "edit without thinking", keeping the code in your working memory instead of the sequence of search and replace commands.

But all that said, I absolutely love vim's keybindings and modal editing concept, so I tend to enable vim keybindings or install a vim-emulator plugin on most IDEs and editors I end up using because it also spares you of having to commit the different shortcuts that every other IDE and editor uses to "muscle memory". I see vim like more like an uptional UI/X layer that should be addable to any decent editor or IDE to enable experts to improve their 10%. Fortunately Sublime text has such a "layer" so OP's post is kind of valid.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by pekk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:39AM (#5414583)
What nonsense.

It is absolutely incorrect that you have to 'keep Vim in your head just as much as the code that you're editing' unless you have not learned Vim at all. The reason you don't (constantly) have to think in ST or notepad++ is because you have already learned that editing paradigm. Although, that editing paradigm IS more obtrusive than vim's. It's abundantly clear that you do NOT understand vim's keybindings and modal editing concept, if you constantly think about vim.

vim has code exploration tools integrated: they just have funny names like ctags, grep, cscope. If you want them. You can also just use separate tools for browsing vs. editing, with no obvious productivity loss.

The productivity impact of having the debugger in your editor process cannot be a big deal, and it's pretty weird to hear that this is essential right after you stress that notepad++ is good enough. Which one is it?

If the point is that you spend most of your time writing, editing and reading code and otherwise the only advantages are in heavy-duty tools not present in ST, then the implication isn't that it's "sane" to reject vim, the implication is that it doesn't make any difference what you use.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @10:50AM (#5415385)
notepad++ is good enough for editing, not debugging, I didn't say that. I reject vim as a "general purpose programmer's text editor" and I reject recommending it to someone as such, but it's probably great for someone neck deep in nix sysadmining - actually that's what I use it for, on the server to quickly edit some configs, but on my laptop or desktop I just never touch it... and I also reject the vim way from a more "philosophical" pov: as an UI designer, I hate modal interfaces - if you have to think of or remember where you are, in order to know what you can do, or where to go in order do do some thing, then that UI needs a manual/guide, therefore it's broken by design (no, I never rtfm :) ).
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by ldh on Thursday March 21, 2013 @04:39PM (#5418788)
I am not a UI designer, but I don't buy into the idea that this blanket notion of "modal interface bad" and "oh, it's got a manual? it's broken" applies universally across all interfaces for every use case. Or are you being facetious?

When we're talking about a text editor for programmers, I don't need it to be usable by somebody who doesn't grasp the domain to begin with. I'll gladly give up some UI sugar because in this context a modal interface is exactly what makes me so productive with it and partitions the complexity into composable chunks that are easily reasoned about.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @06:22PM (#5419630)
> Or are you being facetious?

Well, I do use vim, so I can't really hate it, can I? :) ...it's just the thing that some things should just be plain and simple imho, code editing should not be a "domain" in itself and one should rather learn unrelated new things than bother tweaking that last 10% ...it's just a matter of preference and take on life, some strive for "mastery" at something and work on that last 10% to get an edge, others don't bother to achieve "mastery" at one thing but prefer to explore more things and get that edge by "perspective shifting" or "thinking more outside the box". I bothered to learn vim out of "exploratory curiosity", because I found the concept of such an interface interesting. But though interesting, I don't consider it a good idea anymore - if you give people a tool to manage complexity, they will take advantage and add more of it, for very little benefit.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by ldh on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:07PM (#5420361)
Makes sense.

I guess I look at vim as less an interface that a user needs to become familiar with and more of a language that one learns to manipulate text. For example, I don't think the same design principles that go into maximizing conversions on a website necessarily apply to learning Russian. The tradeoffs are different, as is the payoff.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by sanityinc on Thursday March 21, 2013 @04:39AM (#5413762)
> eg. arbitrary multiple cursors (no other IDE or editor besides Notedpad++ has them yet

Emacs support for multiple cursors is also available: https://github.com/magnars/multiple-cursors.el

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by Avshalom on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:48AM (#5414634)
Jedit has had multiple cursors built in for years. like '08 at least.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by gbog on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:35AM (#5414885)
And multiple selections. I didn't find any use case for them.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nobleach on Thursday March 21, 2013 @01:52PM (#5417338)
They're GREAT for refactoring. Select something. CTRL-D a few times to keep selecting other instances of the same thing. It's not global find and replace.

Or, when you have a nice set of lined up/indented declarations, it's trivial to just right-click+SHIFT and drag a cursor before every line and start typing.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by rrreese on Thursday March 21, 2013 @06:11AM (#5414020)
Visual Studio also has this with the MultiEditing plugin: http://visualstudiogallery.msdn.microsoft.com/2beb9705-b568-...
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @11:02AM (#5415480)
can it select, copy, paste and do zen-coding like expansions in multi-mode? if it can't do all of them or I can only use it to insert multiple cursors at search points (like the emacs multiple cursors plugin, sigh) I'll consider it useless for my workflow.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @11:11AM (#5415547)
I said "arbitrary" exactly to differentiate from the emacs multiple cursors: I need to either add a cursor to each line of a selected region or add them based on search keywords, I can't just mindlessly ctr+click in 3 completely different non-adiacent places and have it work (or can I?).
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by npsimons on Thursday March 21, 2013 @10:59AM (#5415451)
eg. arbitrary multiple cursors (no other IDE or editor besides Notedpad++ has them yet, no matter how many users requested this for JetBrain IDEs for example)

Oh, you mean like this?

http://emacsrocks.com/e13.html

https://github.com/emacsmirror/multiple-cursors

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by gngeal on Thursday March 21, 2013 @10:17AM (#5415143)
"at most (not all) things ST beautifully follows the "don't make me think" principle: eg. arbitrary multiple cursors (no other IDE or editor besides Notedpad++ has them yet, no matter how many users requested this for JetBrain IDEs for example"

What do you mean by "arbitrary multiple cursors"? Do you mean the thing that all Scintilla-using applications (which Notepad++ happen to be one of) have?

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @10:21AM (#5415179)
I said "arbitrary" because a number of editors like emacs or jetbrains IDEs have some sort of multiple cursors or square selection, but they just don work in simple way like ctrl+click to put them anywhere or allow breaking up the selection into lines ..."arbitrary" is not the right word, I know, I mean more like "multiple cursors done right" :)
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by gngeal on Thursday March 21, 2013 @10:33AM (#5415276)
Honestly, I can't remember finding a recent text editor that couldn't do it, TextAdept being the latest one. Sublime Text definitely has major selling points (in the sense of having advantages compared to other editors) but this is hardly one of them.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by nnq on Thursday March 21, 2013 @11:06AM (#5415509)
Can you tell of any IDE editor that has this? (Eclipse: nope, Netbeans: nope, all the Jetbrains IDEs family: nope, Visual studio: nope / actually there's one handicaped plugin to sort of do it in VS)
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by gngeal on Thursday March 21, 2013 @12:41PM (#5416506)
I've never used any IDE other than Emacs, so I can't comment on that.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by trowftd on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:57AM (#5413650)
Notepad++ is good enough until you need to do a regex search that includes new lines in it.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by akavel on Thursday March 21, 2013 @05:10AM (#5413856)
?? he can do, in Ctrl-F dialog box enable ". matches newline", I've done that more than once and never had any problem...?
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by EwanToo on Thursday March 21, 2013 @04:53AM (#5413806)
True, but in extended search and replace mode you can handle newlines without goo much hassle, it's just not in the standard regex option
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by dsego on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:08AM (#5414736)
And it's windows-only.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by Puer on Thursday March 21, 2013 @01:19AM (#5413098)
I switched from nano to vim a few hours ago. When I first installed Arch Linux all those months ago I was intimidated when I was presented with the choice between nano, the default, and vim, "for experts only." When I used vim for the first time today I expected it to be a lot more "difficult" based on everything I had read/heard prior, but after reaching the Arch Wiki entry I was able to hop right in with no difficulties at all. Honestly, the biggest "challenge" I'm facing so far is just getting used to typing "vim" when my brain is used to typing "nano." I'm not denying that vim is complex, and it will probably take me months to "master" it and use it to its full potential, but it isn't hard to just jump into and use, and like you mentioned vanilla vim works perfectly fine.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by bcoates on Thursday March 21, 2013 @02:12AM (#5413267)
Just out of curiosity, what made you decide to change? I've never felt a strong motivation to not just keep using pico/nano, actually putting effort into learning a text editor strikes me as the weirdest hobby ever.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by kevinnk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @02:53AM (#5413396)
I used to use nano, and for me it was the fact that every one else seemed to love vim, so I felt like I should at least try it out. Honestly, it takes about 20 minutes, max, to get to the level of being able to do what nano can do in vim. And if you want something more, it's not very hard to learn after you get the vim basics. I'm not going to say it's for everyone (especially if you're already used to a full IDE) but I would encourage anyone who's at least a little interested in trying it out for a day.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by Puer on Thursday March 21, 2013 @11:01PM (#5421120)
It just happened to be a good time to switch, to be honest. I've migrated from Openbox to Awesome WM in the past few days, and I needed a good editor with features like syntax highlighting, line numbers and great community themes as I learned my way around rc.lua. Also, as mentioned previously, Vim has a "reputation" for being difficult to master. It interested me, and all of the Linux gurus I know seem to use it, so I figured I would give it a shot.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by pekk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:49AM (#5414640)
It isn't a hobby, it's a one-off investment. Surely anyone who programs learns a new thing every now and then?
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by bzalasky on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:30AM (#5413539)
One time I started editing an nginx.conf file in nano while setting up a remote server on Linode. I forgot to sudo when I opened the file and couldn't save my changes. I might be an idiot here but (could I have resolved this in nano?)... but I'm fairly certain this would have been a non-issue in Vim.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by mateuszf on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:37AM (#5413572)
One simple solution that people often forget - at least I know I did in this situation is to save the file in home directory and then move it using su(do).
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by npongratz on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:13PM (#5418031)

  " Use w!! to sudo save after file is already opened
  cmap w!! w !sudo tee % >/dev/null
See Nathan Long's awesome answer for an explanation: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2600783/how-does-the-vim-...
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by riledhel on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:20AM (#5413514)
Once you learn to jump quickly between words, lines, etc. and change whole blocks of text with a few strokes you discover another dimension of vim that's very hard to replace with other tools.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by adestefan on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:04AM (#5414710)
If you learn how to do the same things in emacs, about 90% of it carries over to the native text widgets in OS X and Linux.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by johncoltrane on Thursday March 21, 2013 @05:53PM (#5419381)
No.

C-a and C-e and a dozen of others are there, yes, but good luck if you think you can use M-%, M-h or whatever is the Emacs equivalent of Vim's text-objects and motions (which is what the parent was thinking about).

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by MetaCosm on Thursday March 21, 2013 @01:01AM (#5413038)
He tried to turn vim into an IDE, a role that vim specifically decided not to embrace, that will make anyone go a little crazy.

Vim is good at editing text, is extremely portable, and works great with a partner in crime like tmux.

I have used vim for 12+ years, and the complexity of his setup makes me a bit dizzy.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by pekk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:48AM (#5414633)
There is nothing wrong with using vim's intentionally built in extension mechanisms.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by MetaCosm on Thursday March 21, 2013 @12:24PM (#5416283)
There is nothing wrong with using them, except that (as the article points out) they don't work terribly well, take a lot of effort to get right, and aren't the focus of the editor.

Sublime and Emacs are joys to extend versus Vim, that doesn't mean it can't be done, just that it is tough.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by davedx on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:06AM (#5413451)
I'm the same really. I had to learn vim when I started at a games company that had a Linux build chain. I printed out the keyboard quick reference and was reasonably productive after a few weeks. The only plugin we used was ctags, to be able to find shit in our massive C/C++ codebase, but that worked ok (despite having to manually rebuild tags yourself).

I agree with the author - I'd also recommend Sublime Text 2 - but vim fills a great niche - when you only have a telnet terminal, so it's always good to know the basics.

Right tool, right job, etc.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by andybak on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:04AM (#5414453)
> reasonably productive after a few weeks

Dear God. We're talking about a text editor.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by goldfeld on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:28AM (#5414844)
Dear God, we're talking about what programmers spend the majority of their working hours using, for the foreseeable future. I suppose you never learn new programming languages, because god forbid, you're gonna be crippled for some time getting around new frameworks there and who really wants to make investments?
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by npsimons on Thursday March 21, 2013 @11:04AM (#5415488)
In all fairness, the argument being made is that learning vim is a waste of time for programmers on a deadline who don't already know it, or they wouldn't benefit from it. I have made the same argument about learning PHP, MATLAB and C# (while at the same time being eager to learn about just about any language new to me, eg, Go, Scala, Clojure, Haskell, etc).
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by T-zex on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:58AM (#5415026)
I have started using vim just a couple of years ago, much later than I've started coding and got introduced to vim. Initially I thought that vim is for hipster nerds who would rather use something awkward and completely ignore some useful mainstream stuff like arrow keys and a mouse.

Later I've developed a wrist pain and got interested in ergonomics. One thing I've noticed was how badly the arrow keys are positioned and how "unhealthy" it is to use a mouse with a right hand (numpad shifts the position of a mouse too far right). And then I started thinking about minimising use of a mouse and arrow keys. This led to the rediscovering of vim.

It was surprisingly easy to learn and later surprisingly hard to use other editors.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by shardling on Thursday March 21, 2013 @01:43AM (#5413162)
>Never thought vim was that hard to learn (and I first learned it when I was a teenager and nobody helped me. I switched when someone on a MUD made fun of me for using pico.)

I'm pretty sure as a teenager is the best time to learn such tools. :P

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by readme on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:55AM (#5413645)
Yeah, I learned Vim before I was a professional programmer, too. I think that practicing programmers get more frustrated, because the learning curve is really disrupting their productivity.

I started with gvim, then eventually got comfortable. I never felt like I had to cram down vim facts. I just took them as they came.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by jamesrcole on Thursday March 21, 2013 @02:43AM (#5413362)
Vanilla Vim is pretty sub-optimal for writing prose.

Vim is my text-editor of choice, but it took me a lot of time and effort to customise it to make it more suitable for writing prose.

E.g. the fact that it scrolls by logical lines rather than screen lines (note I that I said scrolls. I'm aware that you can navigate by screen lines by using gj and gk). The way this makes the text scroll by unpredictable amounts when you have paragraphs of text is pretty jarring. You can hack around that by getting the text to auto-format and break lines up into screen lines, but there's all sorts of niggles with that (and FWIW, it causes some of its own problems, such as making it harder to search for phrases, because words may no longer be separated by just spaces but also possibly linebreaks).

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by pekk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:51AM (#5414648)
When you say prose, do you mean emails or some document format or what?
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by goldfeld on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:36AM (#5414893)
How about actual prose? With the right plugins Vim is the best article/book authoring tool I've found.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by daxelrod on Friday March 22, 2013 @10:12AM (#5422973)
What plugins?
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by goldfeld on Friday March 22, 2013 @11:43AM (#5423623)
My own vim-seek was created for navigating long sentences easily; criticmarkup is a superset of markdown for cuts and other edits, which I ported to vim. And vimroom offers a IA Writer-inspired experience. For what Scrivener and outliners offer I'm working on something to scratch my own itch.

What else would you find missing for a writing workflow?

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by jamesrcole on Thursday March 21, 2013 @12:09PM (#5416091)
I mean text written in sentences, as opposed to code (or files relating to code, such as configuration files).

For me this is primarily my planning/diary file and the phd documents I'm writing.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by Avshalom on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:13AM (#5414754)
text that doesn't have line breaks every 20-100 characters.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by smalltalk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @11:27AM (#5415699)
How have you customized Vim to make it suitable for writing text that doesn't have a line break every 50 characters or so?
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by jamesrcole on Thursday March 21, 2013 @12:07PM (#5416068)
Primarily by having these in my .vimrc:

    autocmd FileType text set textwidth=75
    
    autocmd FileType text set formatoptions+=a

    autocmd FileType text set formatoptions+=w
explanation:

- formatoptions+=a: auto-format as you insert text, which means it will (basically) automatically insert a newline once you've typed 'textwidth' number of characters on your line. it will insert a newline while you are typing.

- formatoptions+=w: this isn't necessary, but it has an effect on the way the auto-formatting is done. i find the 'w' options more convenient. With 'w', a linebreak means a new paragraph, unless trailing whitespace at end of line. It means that the 'a' option doesn't auto join lines separated by a linebreak.

- if you're not familiar with Vim's autocmds, what they're doing in the above definitions is setting those options for any text files that are opened (and only text files).

I've also setup Taglist http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=273 so that it can show a listing of the markdown headings in my document.

[EDIT: added brief explanation of autocmds]

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by smalltalk on Thursday March 21, 2013 @12:41PM (#5416489)
Thank you, that's useful to know if I ever try vim.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by latitude on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:48AM (#5413622)
Amen.

I have the same setup as you - vanilla vim, barely customized and the development pace is hardly any slower than when I use Visual Studio with all its auto-completion, deep syntax parsing, etc. I saw Jonathan Blow (of Braid) saying that auto-completion and better debugging support is a deal-breaks for him, but everyone`s work pattern is different and I`ve seen plenty of cases where people using vim accomplished far more and faster than those with fancy editors. Tools are important, but they are secondary.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by alexkus on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:06AM (#5414462)
Agreed.

I use plain vi[m] for several reasons but mainly because I used to visit customer sites all the time and have to use their environments. If I need to edit a whole bunch of files I needed to do it with what the customer has installed, and the bare minimum to rely on is plain old vi.

My .vimrc (if it even exists) contains:-

    set background=dark
That's it, and I generate that by hand whenever the syntax highlighting begins to annoy me if it isn't set. I've never used or even looked at a vim plugin.

Of course plain old vi has its limitations but I know what they are and have pretty good ways of doing anything else I need to do.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by npsimons on Thursday March 21, 2013 @10:46AM (#5415352)
Am I the only person in the world who:

a) Never thought vim was that hard to learn (and I first learned it when I was a teenager and nobody helped me. I switched when someone on a MUD made fun of me for using pico.)

Yeah, I was rocking vi in high school, and I'm no genius, I had an ULTRIX vi reference card. The article's assertion that you have to read any books to use vim effectively is bullshit. As for the religion part, that usually comes in when someone tries to dictate what editor other people will use. I don't give a shit if someone on my project uses Eclipse or MSVS, just don't take my Emacs away.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by w-ll on Thursday March 21, 2013 @01:02AM (#5413042)
Yea, I use vim for editing files quickly in a terminal, 90% of the time im working in a windowed environment and use sublime, but when im putty'd into a server and need to quickly modify my nginx.conf. vim\r\njji
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by rytis on Thursday March 21, 2013 @02:40AM (#5413353)
Don't know about a) - can't remember. I'm just happy with my vim skills as they are now. Sometimes I come across a tip showing a trick or two that I didn't know.

Totally agree regarding b). I like to be able to jump on a random machine and NOT miss overcomplicated .*rc configuration. My .vimrc is 11 lines long, including 3 comment lines and to blank lines....

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by gbog on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:42AM (#5414920)
Same here. Never remapped the leader key, tried and ditched pathogen, never used gvim, never used hill, but I have checked 2G in vim, and I know how to do some advanced search and replace, I have python errors in red as I type and I got once in the highlight engine to fix an annoying color.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by lefinita on Thursday March 21, 2013 @03:50AM (#5413629)
I'm absolutely agree with you, using Vim just to editing text, nothing more.

Sometime, Vim user tend to make their Vim into full-fledged IDE, like completion, file-browser, etc. That things I though, makes Vim user gone insane.

Seriously, Vim just for editing text, nothing more, nothing more.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by Supermighty on Thursday March 21, 2013 @09:47AM (#5414950)
You're not crazy, you're spot on. As long as a new user understand vim insert and command mode (and how to :w) then they should be as productive as if they were using any other editor.

When I started learning vim all I knew were the command modes and how to move around using hjkl. Slowly over time I added more commands.

Re:Just Use Sublime Text by signalsignal on Thursday March 21, 2013 @01:40AM (#5413157)
I actually think people who use esoteric tools are more interesting than people who think that one tool is the best. And I've been working professionally for well over a decade now.
Re:Just Use Sublime Text by freerobby on Thursday March 21, 2013 @08:25AM (#5414530)
What about people who use esoteric words?