What kind of attitude? Wanting employers to respect my goddamned time? Wanting to know how much employers are willing to pay for my services?

Yeah. I want a job listing to actively tell me how much I stand to gain in exchange for my time and skills. How absolutely entitled of me. Imagine that? A potential employee wanting to know upfront how much their time is worth in the eyes of a potential employer? Nonsense! You get what you get and you don’t get upset.

If that’s your line of reasoning then I can only assume you’re exactly the type of employer that indulges in such practices.

The UK is currently passing laws to make every job listing include salary:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckg7gg2zdexo

That’s a good start.

It would be nice if they passed a law to also make every job listing represent an actual job opening at the actual company (or their representative). There are too many postings that are all about "collecting people", forming candidate algorithms, tracking applicants, and mining. It is really grotesque.

Good luck on your job hunt.

Very kind of you good stranger. I’m not job hunting at the moment but I appreciate the support!

This is not helpful and untrue, if you've tried to apply for jobs within the laat ~6+ years you will know it's screaming into the void. New accounts for the N+ glassdoor/indeed/bamboo/handshake/yougettheidea clones. Poorly pulling information from an uploaded resume, requiring manually editing or adding the info _every_ time. If your dilligent/dumb you writing a cover letter for each one (no AI the signal is too bad), then you submit it and wait an arbitrary amount of time for the rejection. There is a good reason people are complaining, it's asinine to put this on jpb seekers.

Greenhouse saves your info and auto fills it. Companied that use Ashby are pretty much upload your resume. Only workday sucks or other random small ones that show up.

Workday is the only one of these I’ve heard of or encountered in the US.

Probably because workday sucks so much that you notice it.

> if you've tried to apply for jobs within the laat ~6+ years you will know it's screaming into the void

I have applied for, and got, 3 jobs in the last 8 years. So yeah I think I am allowed an opinion on it without people telling me Im wrong.

Two things can be true. I’ve applied to a few jobs in the last few years and got a few of them as well. Does not mean that the hoops I had to jump through were any less demeaning, disrespectful or downright stupid.

It is even weirder in my case. I am not applying for any jobs, recruiters reach out to me. After exchanging plesantries with HR ladies at video calls they ask me what are my salary expectations. I explain them there are two options. For full time employment I expect them to give me their best offer for me to consider. For consulting I expect them to give me exact goals so I can give them exact quote. I mostly never hear back from them, in rare cases they say their technical colleagues reviewed my resume and decided I am not appropriate candidate. I suspect most of them are just mining data about salary expectations.

If OP is a hiring manager, they're on the other side of the job market right now. It can be true that managers have no problems getting jobs and the rest of us do.

Nobody is allowed to do anything without someone telling them they're wrong.

Three jobs in 8 years? Seems like a red flag, we want to hire someone who will stick around.[1]

1. (Actual feedback I got in an interview two weeks ago, for a position no sane person would want to stay in for longer than two years.)

Fair enough, dont hire me. There are thousands of jobs out there.

>then you submit it and wait an arbitrary amount of time for the rejection

You get rejections? When I was jobhunting, half of the companies I applied to never replied to me.

>the ones who just emailed their cv and didnt overthink it are happily working.

Tell that to the last 3 years of new grads.

Two times I posted in the "Who wants to be hired?" HN thread in the past few years, I had a job within the month. Both times, I did not even have any resume or CV at all. But this year, I've been posting there for over 6 months and nothing. Not sure if attitude is such a big factor -- the job market kinda does what it does. You do make a mistake by not putting yourself out there though, because then there's basically no chance that an opportunity will come your way. One comment in an HN thread could be your ticket, or you could be applying to thousands of listings for months and getting nothing but the occasional rejection (though of course, never nearly as many as you made applications).

"Just email your cv" is literally impossible at many employers today. the app process is absolutely far more onerous for the applicant than it was a generation ago. For a bit of silver lining, I have noticed the "auto-populate from my resume" feature actually works reasonably well on some sites, which was not the case just a couple years ago when I was last looking.

Also, in some orgs you physically cannot send the cv.

I can't send or recieve documents as email attachments anymore to external stakeholders, everything must be via sharepoint link.

That, plus a decade of compulsory anti phishing training means no half competent HR person should be blind opening an attachment that says 'CV'.

I don't know a single person who's got a job by just emailing their CV. In fact, it reads as asinine as the idea that you can get a job by just showing up in person with a good handshake.

Taking time off your existing role to do multiple interviews for something that turns out to pay 10-15% less than you are currently on is insulting.

how are you getting to multiple interviews without having a concrete-ish idea of what the pay will be?

literally the first thing I talk about with recruiters during an initial phone screen.

yeah okay there may be a ~5-10k, maybe even a little more, bit of wiggle-room but if I can't make a reasonable guess where I'll land why would I even consider interview #2 when I already have an existing role?