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Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Friday January 09, 2026 @12:53PM (#46556708)
If the German filters only apply to ISPs in Germany, they have no effect on users in foreign countries. Moreover, Cloudflare is obviously not an ISP.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by riffraff on Friday January 09, 2026 @01:10PM (#46556972)
the filters the Italian authorities complain about also only apply in italy.

It's likely a process thing, Italy has had website bans since forever, but the new regulation applies _without going through a judge_. Some copyright holders can say "this website is infringing" and ISPs, CDNs etc.. are required to shut them down immediately.

A similar system was introduced in Spain, with the same problems, for the same reason (football $$$).

EDIT: to be clear, CF argues that they need to block the DNS globally, and that's unreasonable. The Italian authority argues that they have the skills to do a local block and are just being uncooperative.

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by blibble on Friday January 09, 2026 @01:42PM (#46557401)
> The Italian authority argues that they have the skills to do a local block

they certainly do, they have the source IP and their platform lets them geolocate an ip

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by Root_Denied on Friday January 09, 2026 @05:32PM (#46560367)
> EDIT: to be clear, CF argues that they need to block the DNS globally, and that's unreasonable. The Italian authority argues that they have the skills to do a local block and are just being uncooperative.

Similar to the UK's attempt to try and get noncompliant sites like Imgur and 4chan to block themselves from serving content to UK locations, I think the responsibility for country-wide blocks lies with the country attempting to regulate the space, not CDNs or websites.

I don't doubt that Italy is correct that CF has the technical ability do a local block like they're asking for, but I also don't see how CF is in any way (legally) compelled to do so. Whether or not Italy (or any country) is capable of doing so, or paying contractors for an appropriate solution, isn't CF's problem either.

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by wmf on Friday January 09, 2026 @06:36PM (#46560914)
The difference is that Imgur/4chan have no presence in the UK but Cloudflare has servers and probably a sales office in Italy. Cloudflare does have to follow Italian law within Italy.

Either Cloudflare can block pirate sites or ISPs will completely block Cloudflare (as seen in Spain). Which way do you prefer?

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by Root_Denied on Wednesday January 14, 2026 @05:38PM (#46624873)
As I understand it Cloudflare is being asked to block these sites globally, and what I said was that Italy doesn't have the legal authority to request that CF do so globally.

Locally, within Italy I can see the argument that CF can be compelled to adhere to blocking sites for any requests originating from, or being routed to Italy - so long as Cloudflare maintains any kind of presence there. That goes for any other country, too.

Realistically maintaining this kind of work puts a financial and engineering overhead on Cloudflare (or any CDN) for running operations in that country, and that incentivizes Cloudflare to push back on this request from any country. The logical response from CF is to refuse and threaten to remove all operations from the country if the country tries to force the issue, to prevent CF from getting pulled into the same requirements for multiple other countries, which is exactly what CF did a couple days ago.

I'll reiterate my previous stance - if a country wants to block part of the internet, that country needs to do it themselves and for the space within which they have authority to do so (their borders). At that point it's up to the citizens of the country to push back if they disagree, and if they don't want to be compared to China and their Great Firewall they shouldn't try and regulate the internet.

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Friday January 09, 2026 @03:30PM (#46558922)
I'm pretty sure Cloudflare is an ISP according to German law ("Diensteanbieter" according to DDG). You might confuse "ISP" with the terminology of "Access Provider" according to the (now defunct) §8 TMG.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Saturday January 10, 2026 @04:48AM (#46564283)
If that were true, sci-hub.se would be blocked in Germany on 1.1.1.1 (1dot1dot1dot1.cloudflare-dns.com), it isn't blocked, therefore it's not true. (Modus tollens)
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Saturday January 10, 2026 @11:32AM (#46567089)
Your reasoning is impeccable, bravo. But it's wrong. Both your premise and your conclusion are based on completely wrong assumptions.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Saturday January 10, 2026 @12:23PM (#46567730)
Not sure which premise you disagree with, but the conclusion follows from them.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Saturday January 10, 2026 @12:30PM (#46567803)
I am a Service Provider ("Diensteanbieter") according to DDG and I don't block a single page, which makes your statement not only wrong, but rather so wrong that not even the complete opposite would make any sense.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Sunday January 11, 2026 @01:54AM (#46573276)
Not necessarily. Perhaps small service providers are exempt from blocking sci-hub.se. But Cloudflare is certainly not small.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Sunday January 11, 2026 @06:28AM (#46574673)
Have you ever considered reading the law before attempting to discuss it?
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Sunday January 11, 2026 @10:04AM (#46576308)
You are clearly unable to cite a portion of the law which proves that Cloudflare counts as a service provider.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Sunday January 11, 2026 @12:53PM (#46577838)
§ 1 Absatz 4 Nummer 5 Digitale-Dienste Gesetz: Im Sinne dieses Gesetzes ist oder sind „Diensteanbieter“ Anbieter digitaler Dienste;
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Sunday January 11, 2026 @01:35PM (#46578310)
That's just stating a tautology.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Sunday January 11, 2026 @06:27PM (#46581638)
No, it's not. It's a very precise way to state that the law has to be applied to a very wide range of service providers. This is a fundamental change compared to the previous regulation TKG. Now take the loss and next time, read the damn manual first.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Monday January 12, 2026 @01:58AM (#46585041)
The quote does not decide whether Cloudflare counts as a "service provider" or not.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by nkmnz on Monday January 12, 2026 @04:04AM (#46585897)
Oh really… then let’s make it obvious:

1. Do they offer any kind of service? YES.

2. Is the service they offer of a digital nature? Also YES.

It’s never been easier.

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by bflesch on Friday January 09, 2026 @01:00PM (#46556811)
Do you think the Italian bureaucrats really want to ban something in France or Germany?

The Cloudflare CEO is clearly misinterpreting something that was lost in translation, which is the bureaucrats stating "Cloudflare must prevent access to XY from everywhere". For bureaucrats "everywhere" means "in my jurisdiction". I cannot believe that the Cloudflare CEO is trying to nitpick around a single word that he so clearly misinterprets.

Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by tick_tock_tick on Friday January 09, 2026 @03:03PM (#46558549)
> Do you think the Italian bureaucrats really want to ban something in France or Germany?

Yes 100% they absolutely do.

[dead]
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by monsieurbanana on Friday January 09, 2026 @01:18PM (#46557063)
Or he perfectly understands what they meant but chose to create artificial outrage. "don't attribute to malice what can be explained by stupidity" has not aged well in 2026
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by bflesch on Friday January 09, 2026 @01:24PM (#46557152)
No, in fact I think most in US tech are awfully ignorant about Europe. That's why I explicitly brought it up. Just because we Europeans can speak your language doesn't mean that people from the US understand how our countries work. And most US tech companies are located in Ireland in a small US expat bubble.
Re:Cloudflare CEO on the Italy Fines by cubefox on Friday January 09, 2026 @02:24PM (#46558011)
You are presumably also not an Italian, so I don't know why you would know more about Italy than he just because you are European. I'm also European, and I certainly don't thereby know more about Italy than about, say, the US.