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Re:Keep Android Open by TeMPOraL on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @09:26AM (#45746548)
Technology has a ratchet effect at scale - as a solution becomes widely adopted, it switches from being a convenience to being a necessity, because people start building more stuff on top of it. It's as true of to-the-minute accurate clocks as it is of smartphone banking.

You can still run a version of Word from 2004. It's fine, if all you need is to write some thoughts down for yourself. But the moment you need to collaborate with other people via a Word document, you'll find it difficult without the modern version with all its user-hostile aspects - and more importantly, other people will find you difficult to work with.

Same applies to other software, web and smartphones, and to everything else in life - the further you deviate from the mainstream, the costlier it is for you. Deviate too much, and you just become a social outcast.

Re:Keep Android Open by micahdeath on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @12:35PM (#45749274)
Social Outcast here... It's pretty good.
Re:Keep Android Open by imcritic on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @02:16PM (#45750873)
Now go find someone who cares. I am being mean here as an illustration of the reaction you would honestly get from not social outcasts
Re:Keep Android Open by ashirviskas on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @08:35PM (#45755009)
This is not a HN worthy comment, be nice.
Re:Keep Android Open by imcritic on Thursday October 30, 2025 @07:50AM (#45759003)
I am nice, it was an illustration of what a logical position/reply would be towards their position "I am a social outcasts". It's a poor argument "it works for me as a social outcast". It's not normal to be one.
Re:Keep Android Open by bluGill on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @01:13PM (#45749896)
Which is why we need to ban together. Libreoffice isn't dominate, but it has enough market share that it can't be completely ignored. Also if you are using it you are not alone - you are an annoying deviation, but there are enough of you that many cannot ignore you. The more people who also use libreoffice the more power we have. If we can get to just 5% market share we cannot be ignored. (it need not be libreoffice, there are other choices that support that file format well enough which is what we care about.)
Re:Keep Android Open by tredre3 on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @02:32PM (#45751098)
LibreOffice's best guess is that they had 200M MAUs in 2019.

I personally find that hard to believe and they don't explain their methodology to arrive at that number (presumably they looked at the downloads and picked a number of users based on feelings).

But, if that number is true, then I suppose you're not only right, but LibreOffice is already near 5% market share.

Re:Keep Android Open by Arainach on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @01:33PM (#45750258)
>but it has enough market share that it can't be completely ignored.

This is the Hacker News bubble in action. Most of the world, most of America, most of China, India, etc. haven't even heard of it. They ignore it and they thrive. Maybe you need to pay attention if you're dealing with certain European governments these days - I'm not sure because I completely ignore it and haven't paid attention since there was just OpenOffice and LibreOffice didn't even exist yet.

Re:Keep Android Open by NewJazz on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @02:10PM (#45750787)
Source on most of China/India not having heard of libreoffice?
Re:Keep Android Open by tredre3 on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @02:28PM (#45751037)
Kingsoft recently announced that WPS Office has 620M MAU users, the bulk of which is in China. Microsoft has even more Office users in China

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/chinas-microsoft-office-rival...

So if China has heard of LibreOffice, they clearly didn't like what they've heard...

Re:Keep Android Open by spookie on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @04:02PM (#45752280)
It's the product of a government owned company... in China. What do you expect?

Moreover, what you write is monitored, and you may loose documents based on what you write [1].

[1] https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-frozen-document-in-china-unle...

Re:Keep Android Open by autoexec on Thursday October 30, 2025 @09:07AM (#45759624)
> Moreover, what you write is monitored

So just like MS Word then

Re:Keep Android Open by NewJazz on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @10:47PM (#45755897)
So, because competitors have traction nobody has heard of libre office? That's not a logical statement.
Re:Keep Android Open by Arainach on Thursday October 30, 2025 @04:29AM (#45757632)
You can't prove a negative. Usage numbers tell the real story. Either people haven't heard of it, or, worse for proponents, they have heard of it and have decided it's not good enough.
Re:Keep Android Open by opan on Thursday October 30, 2025 @04:53AM (#45757759)
I fixed a computer for some old people once who weren't the least bit technical, but they had LibreOffice installed. My guess is they found it searching "microsoft word free" or similar. A bit like how some kids end up finding Minetest/Luanti by searching "free Minecraft".
Re:Keep Android Open by graemep on Thursday October 30, 2025 @08:36AM (#45759326)
> Maybe you need to pay attention if you're dealing with certain European governments these day

Open document formats have been the UK standard for things like .gov.uk for many years. About a decade IIRC. Ignored by some people (notably the Office of National Statistics, of whatever its called these days).

> Most of the world, most of America, most of China, India, etc. haven't even heard of it.

I have come across quite a few non-tech people who use Libre Office.

It has great (some people say better than MS Word with itself between version) compatibility with MS office formats.

Re:Keep Android Open by noosphr on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @02:35PM (#45751133)
Word from 2004 works better than the office 365 version.

I've used it in the last three years to automate document generation in an enterprise because the latest versions of word:

1). Randomly break during automatic updates you can't really turn off.

2). Automatically upload everything to the cloud even when you tell them no.

This isn't the 90s when closed software was better. We are firmly in the enshitification stage of windows and office. Open source is better and is the only sane choice for enterprise.

Those are not words I thought I'd ever write in 2005 or 2015, but here we are.

Re:Keep Android Open by worik on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @10:18PM (#45755727)
Office 365 failed utterly today....
Re:Keep Android Open by zkmon on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @03:35PM (#45751918)
And we must let someone or some crowd dictate what our basic needs are. That crowd is part of our world. If we stick to our bows and arrows they come with canons and horses. Argh!
Re:Keep Android Open by TeMPOraL on Wednesday October 29, 2025 @03:39PM (#45751982)
That worked fine before agricultural revolution. Since then, if you stick to your bows and arrows, you get sidelined and lose access to benefits of society and civilization.
Re:Keep Android Open by zkmon on Thursday October 30, 2025 @03:32AM (#45757320)
If it forces you to keep running with more and more speed just to stay where you are, I wouldn't call it as "benefits of society and civilization". A lot of what we call as progress is a forced transformation of basic needs for the gains of business and politics not people.

Even the healthcare, which everyone thinks as a "benefit" of the progress, only resulted in having lopsided demographic pyramid with countries full of old people. I can't think of single scientific result benefiting the human race in its evolutionary goals.

Re:Keep Android Open by XorNot on Thursday October 30, 2025 @06:02AM (#45758185)
Countries aren't full of old people because of healthcare, they're full of old people because birthrates plummeted after one of the largest generations ever was born in the post-war period.
Re:Keep Android Open by Yeul on Thursday October 30, 2025 @12:03PM (#45761525)
Turned out that if you gave people choice they'd rather not have 7 kids! Surprise surprise.
Re:Keep Android Open by dredmorbius on Thursday October 30, 2025 @12:58PM (#45762227)
Causality is complicated and probably impossible to untangle, but the vast decreases in both infant/early child and maternal mortality played a huge role here.

If half your children didn't die by age 20 (or 5), it was possible to have much smaller families. Industrialisation and urbanisation made children net liabilities rather than household assets (providing labour even at a very young age). Financialisation of real estate along with the rest of the economy made earning and saving money critical, and made non-cash or low-cash lifestyles highly marginal (self-sufficient existence or providing many goods and services through the home directly). All that in combination with improved adult lifespans meant that the demographic pyramid consolidated at the bottom and expanded at the top. There are still countries where this isn't the case, most notably now in sub-Saharan Africa, particularly where HIV/AIDS remains endemic:

Contrast Tanzania and Italy, for example:

<https://www.indexmundi.com/tanzania/age_structure.html>

<https://www.indexmundi.com/italy/age_structure.html>

Re:Keep Android Open by anon84873628 on Thursday October 30, 2025 @04:06AM (#45757494)
Interesting to consider this thread with regards to the Amish. They noped off the tech treadmill but it requires a highly cohesive religiously centered society to maintain the necessary critical mass.

It's a lot harder to make an insular society which is self sufficient just to the degree necessary to create an open source smartphone :-p

Technology brings tradeoffs. Conformity in some regards, but it also opens up many new and varied ways of living.