Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by Aurornis on Saturday October 11, 2025 @12:51PM
(#45550618)
> Rendering a million photorealistic objects is not much more compute-intensive than rendering a hundred cartoon objects
Increasing the object count by that many orders of magnitude is definitely much more compute intensive.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by reactordev on Saturday October 11, 2025 @01:24PM
(#45550935)
Only if you have more than 1 bounce. Otherwise it’s the same. You’ll cast a ray and get a result.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by pclmulqdq on Saturday October 11, 2025 @02:23PM
(#45551401)
No, searching the set of triangles in the scene to find an intersection takes non-constant time.
[dead]
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by pclmulqdq on Saturday October 11, 2025 @05:19PM
(#45552806)
Yeah, this search is O(log n) and can be hardware-accelerated, but there's no O(1) way to do this.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by cubefox on Saturday October 11, 2025 @05:48PM
(#45552993)
What if we keep the number of triangles constant per pixel, independently of scene complexity, through something like virtualized geometry? Though this would then require rebuilding part of the BVH each frame, even for static scenes, which is probably not a constant operation.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by reactordev on Sunday October 12, 2025 @08:16AM
(#45557657)
For static geometry we could but for animated geometry or dynamic geometry it would have to be calculated during a mesh shader step.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by account42 on Monday October 13, 2025 @07:55AM
(#45567350)
It's also only O(log n) if the scene is static. Which is what is often missed in the quest for more photo-realistic graphics - it doesn't mean anything if what you are rendering only looks realistic in still frames but doesn't behave realistically if you try to interact with it.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by khalladay on Saturday October 11, 2025 @12:37PM
(#45550499)
> Rendering a million photorealistic objects is not much more compute-intensive than rendering a hundred cartoon objects
Surely ray/triangle intersection tests, brdf evaluation, acceleration structure rebuilds (when things move/animate) all would cost more in your photorealistic scenario than the cartoon scenario?
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by reactordev on Saturday October 11, 2025 @01:25PM
(#45550944)
Matrix multiplication is all that is and GPUs are really good at doing that in parallel already.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by oivey on Saturday October 11, 2025 @01:38PM
(#45551054)
So I guess there is no need to change any of the hardware, then? I think it might be more complicated than waving your hands around linear algebra.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by reactordev on Saturday October 11, 2025 @02:10PM
(#45551290)
Yes there is, to improve ray tracing…
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by newsclues on Saturday October 11, 2025 @01:30PM
(#45550987)
So create a system RT only GPU plus a legacy one for the best of both worlds?
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by thfuran on Sunday October 12, 2025 @11:21AM
(#45558830)
>Consoles don't have that problem, because not providing perfect backwards compatibility for 20+ years of games isn't a dealbreaker there.
I'm not sure that's actually true for Sony. You can currently play several generations of games on the PS5, and I think losing that on PS6 would be a big deal to a lot of people.
Re:AMD and Sony's PS6 chipset aims to rethink the current gr...
by kevincox on Sunday October 12, 2025 @04:12PM
(#45561462)
Maybe they can pull the old console trick of just including a copy of the old hardware inside the new console.
However I suspect that this isn't as cost and space effective as it used to be.
Ray tracing is the obvious path towards perfect photorealistic graphics. The problem is that ray tracing is really expensive, and you can't stuff enough ray tracing hardware into a GPU which can also run traditional graphics for older games. This means games are forced to take a hybrid approach, with ray tracing used to augment traditional graphics.
However, full-scene ray tracing has essentially a fixed cost: the hardware needed depends primarily on the resolution and framerate, not the complexity of the scene. Rendering a million photorealistic objects is not much more compute-intensive than rendering a hundred cartoon objects, and without all the complicated tricks needed to fake things in a traditional pipeline any indie dev could make games with AAA graphics. And if you have the hardware for proper full-scene raytracing, you no longer need the whole AI upscaling and framegen to fake it...
Ideally you'd want a GPU which is 100% focused on ray tracing and ditches the entire legacy triangle pipeline - but that's a very hard sell in the PC market. Consoles don't have that problem, because not providing perfect backwards compatibility for 20+ years of games isn't a dealbreaker there.