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Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by hilbert42 on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @09:16PM (#44439416)
A resident of said country here. Another questionable measure by Government to protect our mollycoddled, insufficiently-resilient society.

That said, a better approach would be to limit kids under certain age from owning smartphones with full internet access. Instead, they could have a phone without internet access—dumb phones—or ones with curated/limited access.

Personally, I'm not too worried about what risqué stuff they'll see online especially so teenagers (they'll find that one way or other) but it's more about the distraction smartphones cause.

Thinking back to my teenage years I'm almost certain I would have been tempted to waste too much time online when it would have been better for me to be doing homework or playing sport.

It goes without saying that smartphones are designed to be addictive and we need to protect kids more from this addiction than from from bad online content. That's not to say they should have unfettered access to extreme content, they should not.

It seems to me that having access to only filtered IP addresses would be a better solution.

This ill-considerd gut reaction involving the whole community isn't a sensible decision if for no other reason than it allows sites like Google to sap up even more of a user's personal information.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by abtinf on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @09:20PM (#44439443)
> Another questionable measure by Government to protect our mollycoddled, insufficiently-resilient society

Complains about mollycoddling.

> a better approach would be to limit

Immediately proposes new mollycoddling scheme.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by hilbert42 on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @09:24PM (#44439464)
Mollycoddling kids is one thing, we've always done that to some extent. Mollycoddling adults is another matter altogether.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by xboxnolifes on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @10:07PM (#44439659)
Both proposals are mollycoddling children. It just happens that one of them inconveniences adults.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by strken on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @10:28PM (#44439743)
"Inconvenience" is downplaying the impact of not letting adults use incognito mode to search for things.

Yes, right now search engines are only going to blur out images and turn on safe search, but the decision to show or hide information in safe search has alarming grey areas.

Examples of things that might be hidden and which someone might want to access anonymously are services relating to sexual health, news stories involving political violence, LGBTQ content, or certain resources relating to domestic violence.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by rendall on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @01:52AM (#44440605)
Also porn. Let's be honest, all of this energy expenditure is about porn.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by roenxi on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @03:47AM (#44441134)
While anyone who wants to ban people looking at porn will be on side with this, the political oomph is probably more from authoritarians who are working towards a digital ID. Anyone who cares about the porn angle would be forced to admit this won't do very much. Anyone who wants to keep the wrong people out of politics would be quietly noting that this is a small but unquestionable win.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by GoblinSlayer on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @03:22AM (#44441009)
People search porn in google? Because google is internet itself?
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by falcor84 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @04:21AM (#44441295)
Because it's easier to put your query into the address bar than to open a dedicated search page, and most people use Chrome with the default being Google search.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by XorNot on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @05:04AM (#44441512)
Absolutely no one searches for porn on Google except if they don't know the URL of an aggregator.

Which that one kid will tell everyone if they don't.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by Erikun on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @05:49AM (#44441785)
More people than searches for free fonts at least (couldn’t think of a good comparison search term to “Free porn” off the top of my head) https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%205-y&q=...
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by Cartoxy on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @02:28AM (#44440768)
is it tho because we have been doing porn since forever and porn is not gatekeeperd by SE at all.

seams like long term slow burn to Gov tendrils just like digital ID and how desperate the example came across as to show any real function, contradictory even.

Pivot, what about the children. small steps and right back on the gradient of slippyslope we are

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by ptek on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @06:14AM (#44441933)
Hmm people will go back to using lingerie catalogs or start using LLM prompts?
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by tacticus on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @11:03PM (#44439898)
> That said, a better approach would be to limit kids under certain age from owning smartphones with full internet access. Instead, they could have a phone without internet access—dumb phones—or ones with curated/limited access.

This wouldn't allow them to watch gambling ads or enjoy murdoch venues.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by hilbert42 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @12:19AM (#44440224)
Oh, the cynicism of some people. :-)

Yes, that empire exported itself to where it would have the greatest effect—cause the most damage.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by bamboozled on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @09:33PM (#44439508)
We basically have to teach children about misinformation, propaganda and the dangers of the internet from the age of 5...that's basically how it would need to go, it would suck for the ruling class though because we'd have to stop feeding kids religion (for example) from the day they're born...How can we expect kids to know what the truth is when they're lied to all the time.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by frollogaston on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @11:19PM (#44439983)
or just don't get them smartphones
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by pmontra on Tuesday July 01, 2025 @11:55PM (#44440125)
Misinformation and propaganda are not only on smartphones.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by fc417fc802 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @12:20AM (#44440226)
Still those do make it awfully easy to subscribe to notifications that actively push all sorts of problematic things onto you at an alarming rate. A high rate of exposure to something can lead to problems where there otherwise wouldn't be any.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by frollogaston on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:23PM (#44449892)
This doesn't mean they should have smartphones
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by DiggyJohnson on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @12:46AM (#44440332)
> it would suck for the ruling class though because we'd have to stop feeding kids religion

This seems out of place and unrelated. If anything Gen Z and presumable Alpha, eventually, are more religious than their parents.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by graemep on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @04:25AM (#44441316)
> it would suck for the ruling class though because we'd have to stop feeding kids religion

The ruling class in the west are generally extremely anti-religious. They have a good reason to be - the biggest religion in the west is anti-wealth (the "eye of the needle" things etc.) and generally opposed to the values of the powerful.

The US is a sort of exception, but they say things to placate the religious (having already been pretty successful in manipulating and corrupting the religion) but very rarely actually do anything. I very much doubt the president (or anyone else) in the current US government is going to endorse "give all you have to the poor".

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by SlowTao on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @02:05AM (#44440671)
> Thinking back to my teenage years I'm almost certain I would have been tempted to waste too much time online when it would have been better for me to be doing homework or playing sport.

That is true. I spent my time coding a 2D game engine on an 486, it eventually went nowhere, but it was still cool to do. But if I had the internet then, all that energy would have been put into pointless internet stuff.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by kolinko on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @03:15AM (#44440976)
I had internet access since 13yo, although it was the internet of 1996, so it was way more basic.

And for me it was a place to explore my passions way better than any library in a small city in Poland would allow.

And sure - also a ton of time on internet games / MUDs, chatrooms etc.

And internet allowed me to publish my programs, written in Delphi, since I was 13-14yo, and meet other programmers on Usenet.

On the other hand, if not for internet, I might socialise way more irl - probably doing thing that were way less intelectually developing (but more socially).

It just hit me that I need to ask one of my friends from that time what they did in their spare time, because I honestly have no idea.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by bombcar on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:02AM (#44442201)
The Internet of 1996 and even of 2006 was a lot more “work” than the direct-into-your-eyebulbs Internet of today.

YouTube didn’t start until 2005! Even just getting Flash working to watch Home*Runner was an effort.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by jdcasale on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:17AM (#44442325)
I'd keep in mind that internet usage of 96 (I was there) bears no resemblance whatsoever to internet usage of today. The level of predatory sophistication of today's attention economy makes any sort of comparison between the two misguided at best.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by kolinko on Saturday July 12, 2025 @03:33AM (#44540079)
Yes, but complaints about my generation sitting in front of computers was not that much different from my generation's complaints now of the next generation being on social media.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by theshackleford on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @03:32AM (#44441067)
I had the internet as a youth, and it is pretty much entirely responsible for me having been able to build a social network and social capabilities, build the career I have today and ultimately break out of poverty.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by johnisgood on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @04:28AM (#44441325)
I had the Internet when I was a kid and I ended up being a software engineer with useful skills in many different areas.

You are wrong to blame the Internet (or today LLMs). Do not blame the tool.

Sure I consumed sex when I was a kid, but I did a fuckton of coding of websites (before JavaScript caught up, but in JavaScript) and modding of games. I met lots of interesting, and smart people on IRC with mutual hobbies and so forth. I did play violent games, too, just FYI, when I was not making mods for them.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by pferde on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @04:36AM (#44441360)
Could the difference between your experience and that of today's teenagers be in the fact that in your time, there were no online content farms hyperoptimized for maximum addictiveness, after their owners invested millions (if not billions) into making them so?
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by ta12653421 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @05:54AM (#44441812)
back then the web (or prior networks like Gopher, Usenet) were used and filled mainly by professionals working in the one or another field; and if you were online, you demonstrated already a basic tech undertstanding, since it wasnt as convenience as today. Sure, porn existed early on; but the "entertaining web content" was just not existing as today.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by johnisgood on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @06:14AM (#44441930)
Yes, especially IRC. What people call today "gatekeeping" is exactly what gave IRC networks value.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by johnisgood on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @04:44AM (#44441402)
Yes, I believe so. The only thing that was addicting to me was coding. It really was addicting. I did not leave the house all summer when I was >13 because I was busy coding. But then again, this "addiction" helped me a lot in today's world. That said, I am left with a serious impostor syndrome, however, and my social skills aren't the best, which is also required in today's world, by a programmer. :/
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by qingcharles on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @11:00AM (#44444581)
I spent time creating 2D and 3D game engines. It was a lot easier once the Internet arrived to me in 1993. I could connect with other like-minds and found a wealth of useful information.

Sure, there was a lot of dicking around, but overall it was positive.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by Tade0 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @02:14AM (#44440703)
My take is just like we have allowance to introduce children to the concept of money, parents could use data allowance to introduce children to the concept of the internet.

The worst content out there is typically data-heavy, the best - not necessarily, as it can well be text in most cases.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by closewith on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @02:36AM (#44440798)
That's a naïve view of the internet, where much of the worst experiences children have are in text via chat.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by Tade0 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @04:54AM (#44441464)
Pretty sure a picture is still worth a thousand words. Also text is something you can prepare for, police if need be.

Random visual internet content? Too many possibilities, too large a surface area to cover.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by red_admiral on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:19AM (#44442342)
Money is, depending on the country, slowly evolving from physical coins/notes to plastic cards to pretend plastic cards on smartphones, to the same but you need an app to manage the account, to let's stop pretending and just use an app in the first place.

The last one is difficult because you need a common standard, either someone becomes a monopoly (or two or three quasi-monopolies such as google/apple) or better still this is one of few cases where government regulation could do more good than harm.

I think China is already close to the last phase at least in cities, going down the government regulated route?

This is highly country dependent of course - in some places shops must accept coins by law, even if it's so unusual that you have to roll a critical success to get the right amount of change back.

I would like a world where we can give children physical pocket money rather than some abstraction, and they don't need a smartphone of their own to check their balance. But we'll probably have to fight for that at some point.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by dzhiurgis on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @03:17AM (#44440989)
Australian gov can’t even enforce vape ban, how you’d expect smartphone ban to be enforced?
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by florkbork on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @05:34AM (#44441697)
What if the point isn't to enforce at the user level, but at the company level?

30,000 penalty units for violations. 1 unit = $330 AUD at the moment.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by theshackleford on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @03:28AM (#44441053)
> That said, a better approach would be to limit kids under certain age from owning smartphones with full internet access. Instead, they could have a phone without internet access—dumb phones—or ones with curated/limited access.

This would be completely and utterly unenforceable in any capacity. Budget smartphones are cheap enough and ubiquitious enough that children don't need your permission or help to get one. Just as I didnt need my parents assistance to have three different mobile phones in high school when as far as they knew, I had zero phones.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by account42 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @06:39AM (#44442063)
Which is of course why we don't bother making selling cigarettes and alcohol to children illegal. Except we totally do that because it largely works even if sufficiently motivated individuals can and do get around the restrictions.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by theshackleford on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:39AM (#44442474)
Cigarettes and alcohol are consumbable products that must be acquired again and again. There are already millions of phones in open circulation and you only need to acquire it once.

Even if you could stop phones, you wont stop them from accessing it from literally a near infinite supply of other devices.

It's pure and utter fantasy.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by account42 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:51AM (#44442574)
Mobile phone plans are still subscriptions and not buy for life things last I checked.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by tzs on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @09:49AM (#44443708)
You don’t need a mobile phone plan to use free Wi-Fi to access the Internet.
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by florkbork on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @05:31AM (#44441680)
I find I am broadly supportive of these laws (The Online Safety Amendment (Social Media Minimum Age) Bill 2024), even if this specific regulation is a bit of pearl clutching wowserism.

Why? If you read the original legislation https://parlinfo.aph.gov.au/parlInfo/search/display/display....

You get 30,000 civil penalty units if you are a scumbag social media network and you harvest someone's government ID. You get 30,000 civil penalty units if you don't try to keep young kids away from the toxic cesspool that is your service, filled with bots and boomers raving about climate change and reposting Sky News.

This absolutely stuffs those businesses who prey on their users, at least for the formative years.

And when I think about it like that? I have no problem with it, nor the fact it's a pain to implement.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by kypro on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @05:44AM (#44441756)
100% agree.

The framing that explicit material is bad for kids, while probably true, is besides the point. Lots of things a parent could expose a child to could be bad, but it's always been seen as up to the parent to decide.

What the government should do is ensure that parents have the tools to raise their kids in the way they feel is appropriate. For example, they could require device manufactures implement child-modes or that ISP provide tools for content moderation which would puts parents in control. This instead places the the state in the parental role with it's entire citizenry.

We see this in the UK a lot too. This idea that parents can't be trusted to be good parents and that people can't be trusted with their own freedom so we need the state to look after us seems to be an increasing popular view. I despise it, but for whatever reason that seems to be the trend in the West today – people want the state to take on a parental role in their lives. Perhaps aging demographics has something to do with it.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by immibis on Saturday July 05, 2025 @03:46AM (#44470864)
Since when does HN believe it's technically possible for an ISP to implement content moderation tools?
Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by jolmg on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @09:06AM (#44443272)
> That said, a better approach would be to limit kids under certain age from owning smartphones with full internet access. Instead, they could have a phone without internet access—dumb phones—or ones with curated/limited access.

Why should this be the government's responsibility rather than the parents'?

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by reaperducer on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @01:09PM (#44446206)
Why should this be the government's responsibility rather than the parents'?

For the same reason that the government limits smoking and alcohol. Because the parents can't/won't.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by jolmg on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @02:17PM (#44447077)
A teen can go to the store on their own and consume the cigarettes and alcohol right out the door without the parents knowing. There I can see why the parent would need the collaboration of greater society.

But for a phone? A child/early-teen shouldn't be able to afford a phone nor contract with a cellphone-service-provider being underage. That should be collaboration enough. If they got a phone beforehand, it's because the parents themselves got it for them.

Even considering a mid teen starting work, buying a phone and using it with WiFi, they can only really own things with the parents' approval. They can't really use it enough to form an addiction without the parents noticing and having the opportunity to confiscate it.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by gt0 on Wednesday July 02, 2025 @07:42PM (#44450028)
I'm in Australia too.

I feel a lot of Australians think the government is more mollycoddling than it is, it's hard to think of an actual policy in Australia that is outside of the norm of the Western world.

Re:Australians to face age checks from search engines by justinclift on Friday July 04, 2025 @09:57AM (#44464625)
I wonder how well solutions like "Spriggy Mobile" work in practice?

https://www.spriggy.com.au/mobile