> This is completely detached from reality.

what's completely detached from reality is that the problem is so bad in (US) cities like NYC that it seems inconceivable that it isn't a universal truth that cities just have an indigent population that regularly threatens and sometimes follows through on threats of violence to passersby.

How did we let the problem get this bad‽

> like NYC

You don't know how ridiculous that is. Stop watching propaganda and just visit NYC. I'm tempted to buy you a ticket. Or just ask someone who lives there.

You can tell when people don't live somewhere and get their opinion of that place strictly from social media.

Makes you wonder how badly social media is distorting the rest of our lives.

> This is completely detached from reality. I find it hard to believe you are being truthful unless you're doing some sort of gotcha where you carry a gun or are some sort of jiu-jitsu master.

As someone who has lived in San Francisco, CA for the past long-ass while, I agree with the paragraph that you're objecting to. I own no firearms, and can hardly throw a pillow, let alone a person.

Maybe try, like, talking to more homeless folks? Or at least observing them from a distance? They're folks like anyone else, and most of them (like most folks) simply don't want police attention, so doing anything more to regular folks than asking for spare change isn't in their repertoire. Honestly, I'm a LOT safer in the parts of the city where there are folks out on the street than I am places where there's noone. [0]

[0] The only times I've gotten mugged or robbed were when I was in the fancy parts of town where there's noone on the street to provide assistance... and my assailants were groups of folks who looked to be doing well for themselves, rather than rough-looking folks looking for cash for a score.

> my assailants were groups of folks who looked to be doing well for themselves

Bitcoin bros!

_Probably_ not, no. But who knows?!?

> This is completely detached from reality.

Well if you say so, but it's reality. Have you lived in a city? I think you would know.

> https://nypost.com/...

The post pushes right-wing propaganda; it's a Rupert Murdoch publication, the same as Fox News. Ignore it.

Manhatten is so safe it's dull. It's lost its edge, its variety, its lifeblood which is the dynamic people. Really, I'm not kidding you. Look up the crime stats. Or just go visit - if more people would stop believing the right-wing nonsense and just see things for themselves, they'd be much happier (and how about holding the the NY Post, etc. accountable?).

> Like you honestly never seen an aggressive person who is high?

No, or if they are aggressive, they are aggressive to the empty air around them - I don't engage in conversation. But people high on opiods, which is most common by far, are quiescent. Some are basically asleep standing up, drooling in place. Very scary!

Lived in cities all my life, 3 capitals, 2 non capitals, 3 countries. And gave you a personal example of my current local homeless guy, thanks for discounting my lived experience as one says.

You're a victim now because someone disagrees with you? Maybe cities are too dangerous for you.

Regular people have a stigma against the homeless and that perceptions of crime from the homeless are higher than they should be and that's detrimental to help them. That is clear as water. I genuinely think you're trying to just push some perceived overton window and are ending up in a nonsensical argument about nobody being afraid of a whole group of people. And then you say I'm too fearful, which was the opposing argument you made, that nobody ever felt fear. It's like inflammatory rhetoric for it's own sake.

> I genuinely think you're trying to just push some perceived overton window

Wow.

Whether the very real fear of the homeless/mentally ill/drug addicted is justified and rational is a big elephant in the room.

Fear is a feeling, and I'm not sure what "very real" means, as if your feelings are matter of national importance. If someone commits a crime, then the people are justified in acting - in a proportionate, necessary way - through government. Otherwise, your fear is your problem. Maybe the homeless person is scared of you - after all, you can call the police and subject them to serious abuse.

I agree that it's an often implied issue, but I think the sub-subtext, the point of it all, is far more serious: whether you can do things to other people - via the state or personally - for arbitrary reasons. That is, whether people have universal human rights. That is the elephant they are hunting.

They have found their best test cases, their best steps toward destroying universal human rights, with homeless people, people without legal immigration status, and those engaging in progressive protests.

They won't stop there, of course. It's either human rights for all or for none.

I'm saying the fear people feel is real, and "valid" in the sense that the rest of us must recognize it, not dismiss it.

Only when we meet people in the fearful place they're at, and they feel heard, can we start to try to make them see that the fear is not justified or rational compared with the actual risk posed by the homeless or mentally ill or what have you.

I do agree, it's human rights for everyone or no-one.

I generally agree, but that's perhaps more appropriate for the vulnerable. For powerful, fearful people, they need to stop actualizing it or making it important before they hurt someone.

In Finland, "homeless" actually means "homeless". We don't mean "people suffering mental illness and substance abuse issues". So that's the background for the article.

I recently visited NYC and understand your specific angle, but "homeless" actually can just mean "person without a home" without connotations of mental issues or substance abuse.

There are extreme cases where people willfully live under bridges or something but that's super rare.