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Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by TonyTrapp on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @04:28AM (#42449152)
IRC is pretty much the opposite of the definition of a walled garden. Its content is not discoverable by search engines by default, but that is not the definition of a walled garden, which is typically a synonym for closed platforms where you have no choice how to access their content (e.g. being forced to use a specific client software).
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by sandos on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @05:29AM (#42449425)
But in general IRC is not really archived etc? So just as throw-away as Discord imo.
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by johnisgood on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @08:05AM (#42450124)
Lots of people log channels, and that is another discussion when you see yourself online. They usually mention it in the topic though that the channel is logged.
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by dijit on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @07:40AM (#42449983)
Any single client can upload their logs, since it's "archived" in plaintext on every users PC.

You can also log from the server; using a multitude of modules; https://docs.inspircd.org/4/modules/log_syslog/ or https://docs.inspircd.org/4/modules/log_json/ if you're using inspircd.

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by hombre_fatal on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @10:46AM (#42451399)
The point still stands. Regardless of how easy it might be to access logs, not a single popular Freenode (or otherwise) server I spent years chatting on has an archive online. It might as well have all taken place on Discord.

Turns out what matters isn’t how easy it is to access logs but whether anyone cares to do it.

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by dijit on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @11:04AM (#42451633)
You sure? There are loads. Have you tried looking?

Heres an archive searcher for #bitfighter on freenode: https://bitfighter.org/irclogs/search.php

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by hombre_fatal on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @01:28PM (#42453328)
That's the counter example?

A channel with one day logged in 2024, then nothing for two years, then nine days logged in 2022, five days logged in 2021, etc?

What about big tech channels like, say, nodejs and javascript?

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by dijit on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @01:41PM (#42453463)
I’m not exactly sure why you think that matters. Everyone in those channels have logs that any program can read.

The point that I am making is that the capability and software exists, even for others to view, if you want. I mean: did you need an account or specialised client for these logs?

Thats the point.

Be the change you want to see if you want archives uploaded. Or, do what others do: grep your local files or znc logs.

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by mbreese on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @01:42PM (#42453466)
Many years ago at $WORK we had an in house IRC server (pre-Slack). It was well archived and logs were easily searchable. It was a pretty easy setup.

And for IRC, I think this is a good compromise between "everything is public at all times" and "everything is walled off and private at all times".

If you want to have a log of your use, it's possible. If the org running the server wants a log, they can do that too. Is that possible with something like Discord?

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by johannes1234321 on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @06:02AM (#42449546)
However on IRC this is not for technical reasons, but limited interest.

Pre-LLM-GenAI gathering information from huge chat logs was quite limited.

But different extraction mechanisms always existed. Some people kept logs, some servers/channels had web-archives.

Discord tries to keep it exclusive to them.

(Focussing on technical side here, whether it's socially wanted is a different big question, which ends with a "it depends")

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by anthk on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @01:52PM (#42453555)

       grep/recoll. Fast even on ancient machines.
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by johannes1234321 on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @02:08PM (#42453712)
That's nice for finding Keywords, but dismantling a chat discussion, which probably consists of many parallel threads in a channel, isn't easy.
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by corobo on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @07:15AM (#42449870)
Being knowingly throwaway meant that any long term knowledge got turned into a blog post, documentation, a forum thread, or a search engine indexable logs-to-html site in the worst case.

With discord the message might get pinned if a mod thinks it was useful and remains undiscoverable for the majority of people

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by thunky on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @01:35PM (#42453394)
> remains undiscoverable for the majority of people

IME it doesn't work very well. If you hang around a discord server long enough you see the same conversations happening over and over and over. And the app is not good at helping you finding old conversations (which is why they are repeated endlessly).

It's also very bad at resuming where you left off, so it's incredibly difficult to follow an active thread without missing anything:

https://www.reddit.com/r/discordapp/comments/18d4tiv/inexpli...

Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by tryauuum on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @05:08AM (#42449344)
Hm, for me the definition of the walled garden is "you have to have an account to see any discussions"
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by fl0id on Wednesday December 18, 2024 @05:48AM (#42449488)
Which you don’t need for irc. Also pretty sure that’s not an accurate definition as you can be walked without needing an account technically.
Re:Ergo Chat – A modern IRC server written in Go by Klonoar on Thursday December 19, 2024 @02:10PM (#42464705)
This is notably not the definition from the thread you’re responding to, though.

So…