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Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by ChumpGPT on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:00PM (#42035247)
It's quite sad that Russia has better partners than Ukraine does. Zelensky has to beg every day for the West to fulfill its promises while the Russians send some rice and North Korea sends 12k soldiers. China, Iran, and India are funding and supplying Russia with more aid than the US/EU is supplying Ukraine with. Sadly the EU still sends more money every year to Russian coffers than it lends to Ukraine.

The West is losing its influence and the USA is losing its reputation as a reliable partner. An undesirable result of the War in Ukraine will have some severe consequences for the US/EU in the decades to come. A lot of folks are just oblivious to it.

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by bad_haircut72 on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:31PM (#42035482)
If Ukraine falls because USA cuts off aid expect every mid power in the world (South Korea / Japan / Australia / Italy etc) to begin their own nuclear weapons program immediately. “Losing its reputation” is an enormous understatement.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by nradov on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:51PM (#42035635)
It's pretty clear to every world leader now that the only guarantee of security is to have your own nuclear weapons, or to have a solid mutual defense treaty with a nuclear power. President Zelensky has basically stated that if Ukraine doesn't receive sufficient conventional military aid then they'll be forced to pursue nuclear weapons development. Whether they are actually capable of doing this before being conquered by Russia is unknown: they have multiple civilian nuclear power plants and skilled engineers but still it takes a lot to build an operational weapons system including the delivery platform.

https://www.newsweek.com/nato-ukraine-membership-progress-do...

Regardless of what ultimately happens in Ukraine, nuclear proliferation is obviously going to accelerate. This is the very real consequence of the international community failing to collectively oppose Russian aggression.

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by HDThoreaun on Sunday November 03, 2024 @08:50PM (#42037707)
If ukraine builds a credible nucellar program NATO likely sides with russia to end the war asap. Zero appetite for nuclear war
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by nojvek on Monday November 04, 2024 @09:44AM (#42041945)
Russia has quite a bit of apetite for nuclear war. They wouldn’t be poking the bear otherwise.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by HDThoreaun on Monday November 04, 2024 @02:23PM (#42045118)
Which is why NATO wont let ukraine get nukes. Cant stop russia from getting nukes so only option is stopping ukraine.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by nojvek on Thursday November 07, 2024 @10:43AM (#42077617)
NATO can’t do shit. Ukraine should get nukes like North Korea has.

It’s the ultimate card for deterrence. One you have nuclear weapons, no one fucks around.

Russia would have not invaded if Ukraine had nuclear weapons. Period.

US is tip-toeing with Russia because they have nuclear weapons. If they didn’t we’d be raining missiles on them like we did Iraq.

Iran will get nuclear missiles. They see how US behaves with North Korea.

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by mannyv on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:30PM (#42035477)
India isn't funding anything in the war, AFAIK. Just because they're BRICS doesn't mean they're doing anything in the war.

And Russia's "partners" are a shit country stuck in 1880 (North Korea) and, well, China. China's great at intimidating third world countries, but in reality their support and capabilities are limited. As for India, well, back in the old days India would have taken Eastern Russia, since the Russian armed forces are busy trying not to get killed.

At least China and India seem to have cooled down their border issues.

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by zip1234 on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:43PM (#42035576)
India is funding the war for Russia by buying all their oil.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by gruez on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:47PM (#42035614)
There's a pretty big difference between "funding" a war by buying oil (BRICS/Non-Aligned), and "funding" a war by giving military aid (the West). Also, The West is still buying oil from Russia because for some countries there's still no alternative.

https://www.economist.com/europe/2024/09/05/the-west-still-n...

https://archive.is/V0Efv

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by HDThoreaun on Sunday November 03, 2024 @08:51PM (#42037713)
Russia sells oil to india, buys rice. Russia sends rice to korea, buys people and ammunition. How is India not funding russian war efforts?
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by ivewonyoung on Monday November 04, 2024 @12:49PM (#42044133)
You buy a laptop on eBay because you desperately need one for work to feed yourself and you can only afford the cheap one on eBay. The seller buys rice with that money and hires a hitman by paying him the rice, the hitman goes on a shooting spree, how did you not fund that shooting spree?
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by HDThoreaun on Monday November 04, 2024 @02:22PM (#42045115)
India knows their money is being used for war. You dont know your money is being used for murder. If you did you would be an accomplice, yes.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by ivewonyoung on Monday November 04, 2024 @03:14PM (#42045583)
Europe knows their money is being used for war in their own backyard when they buy oil from India.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-oil-e...

Why isn't Europe an accomplice?

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by HDThoreaun on Tuesday November 05, 2024 @04:28PM (#42055325)
they are
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by jajko on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:46PM (#42035598)
Sure they are, buying cheap natural resources from russia in vast quantities. Those money go directly to war efforts, well what isn't stolen by whole kleptocratic structures in russian government but I presume this pipeline is more monitored and subdued now as putin specifically focused on that.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by ChumpGPT on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:40PM (#42035560)
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by xattt on Sunday November 03, 2024 @03:15PM (#42035793)
> The West is losing its influence and the USA is losing its reputation as a reliable partner.

The undermined reputation came about because of a significant foreign influence effort that saw an agent hold the seat of power.

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by ronsor on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:15PM (#42035366)
Russia's "partners" are vultures ready to swoop in and consume everything if the country collapses.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by JohnCClarke on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:40PM (#42035554)
“We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow.” -- Lord Palmerston (and repeated by Henry Kissinger)

It's a dangerous world out there, and best not to be weak.

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by chgs on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:19PM (#42035399)
When. But the same can be said about the US. Look at the “reconstruction” of Iraq.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by no_exit on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:36PM (#42035522)
> Iraq's oil infrastructure was damaged when the CPA took over. The CPA effected selected repairs. But the IAMB found that the CPA had chosen not to repair the meters on the pipelines. The IAMB told the CPA that they were concerned that the lack of metering made auditing Iraq's oil exports unreliable – making it impossible to detect fraud, deception or smuggling. The minutes of the IAMB meeting make clear that the CPA had assured the IAMB that they were in the process of repairing the meters – in bad faith. The CPA's authority came to an end with the meters unrepaired. Estimates of how much oil revenue was siphoned off during the year of the CPA's administration go as high as $4 billion – comparable to the amount Saddam Hussein is suspected of stealing during the entire duration of the oil-for-food program.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_Fund_for_Iraq

You have to laugh...

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by moltar on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:30PM (#42035476)
And Ukrainian partners don’t even wait for that. Lands are being divided and bought out by BlackRock and the like for pennies on the dollar.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by mjfl on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:30PM (#42035475)
I think this sentence makes more sense if you are talking about Ukraine and its partners.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by stonethrowaway on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:19PM (#42035396)
Framing it differently, they have skin in the game.
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by kev009 on Sunday November 03, 2024 @02:29PM (#42035470)
For BRICS it's just business, for NK there is immense value in getting some combat experience without formally entering any war.. NATO countries do this all the time as well, look back at the GWOT and lots of lesser known skirmishes where especially non-conventional forces are cycled through.

I also don't think the US and EU have pure motivations in any of this, particularly the US the EU just seems gullible.. the anti-Russia talk from the politicians is just fodder for the masses so the grift can continue as the actual actions and inactions tell a different story.. send complicated weapons systems ($$$), complicated weapons system doesn't work better start working on some new ones ($$$), oh that's some nice farmland you got there better let our corporations buy it up ($$$).

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by jajko on Sunday November 03, 2024 @03:26PM (#42035865)
Well, you are unfortunately correct. But as coming from Europe, I blame mostly EU at the end. US shouldn't be the sole policeman and shield to 450 million economically strong block. When I look at the government and its steps re defense, its beyond pathetic.

Almost nobody does even mandatory 2% GDP -> NATO flow, the only countries doing so are those treated brutally by soviets/russian in the past - Poland, baltic states. Heck, freakin' Germany is trying to put their highway maintenance costs into those 2%, since 'army anyway has to drive on them' - that's borderline treasonous behavior from Scholz in situation where enemy is at literal gates and repeatedly stated that it will wipe out half of population in nuclear strikes if they want to. Polish army can roll over wehrmacht anytime without breaking a sweat. Sane voices from former eastern bloc countries well-versed in soviet terror and brutality were completely ignored first months of war.

Leading countries in EU are still acting like there is some tiny annoying localized conflict far away and it will for sure end next month, and not like existential situation with many parallels with WWII and Hitler's behavior before and during it. They could have boosted their economies by diverting more money into defense, instead we get shooting in our own foot with endless green deal to kill half of European industry. Environmentally war on Ukraine is an utter disaster - we have some paper straws stupidities while they blow up 1 million plastic + chemistry + metal drones per year, on top of all other stuff blowing and burning to hell.

That's probably the only thing I agree with trump (those 2%), but then again its painfully obvious and Obama kept saying the same. With russians they understand only the rule of stronger, just like typical mafia. Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum.

/rant

Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by CHB0403085482 on Sunday November 03, 2024 @07:21PM (#42037273)
Cartoon from 1930 but just as relevant today ~ https://x.com/Biz_Ukraine_Mag/status/1851955766585950476#m
Re:$200M a year, 700k tons of rice, space tech: deal for Nor... by lostmsu on Monday November 04, 2024 @01:30AM (#42039058)
While I mostly agree, it took Hitler 1 month to take over Poland. Russia is still struggling 2 years later (8 since you should count from Crimea).