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Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by baby on Saturday April 27, 2024 @01:21PM (#40181721)
If you think about it, this is one of the reasons I like macOS. Back then, buying a PC with windows meant having a lot of crap installed by default. Not sure if it's still the case because I haven't bought a PC in ages, but I remember that formatting my computer and reinstalling windows was step 1 when I was buying a brand new laptop/PC.
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by nazgulsenpai on Saturday April 27, 2024 @02:48PM (#40182408)
What you describe is the main reason I like Linux, but at last check the reinstall trick doesn't even work anymore because a lot of the preloaded software can get reinstalled automatically even if you install from non-OEM media. Its still probably better than trusting the preinstalled OS in the world of state sponsored spying and supply chain attacks.
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by Rinzler89 on Saturday April 27, 2024 @04:31PM (#40183227)
>Back then, buying a PC with windows meant having a lot of crap installed by default.

Maybe in the US/West when you bought prebuilt form the likes of Dell. But in my home of EE, most PCs we had for sale in shops were locally assembled with no OS, or just vanilla OEM Windows installed (sometimes even pirated).

Crap installed by default on PCs is not something I ever encountered where I live.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by jongle on Saturday April 27, 2024 @10:56PM (#40185639)
In west europe PCs were riddled with crapware if you bought a prebuilt windows machine in the 90s and early 00s. Wipe and reinstall windows was first thing I would do with a new PC, it was a necessity. I don't know about intervening 20 odd years, I used linux, but I recently installed win 11 home and had zero crapware. Windows ISO from microsoft, harder to install than garden variety linux (not hard, just more annoying and takes way longer), but no tiktok, roblox, disney etc.

Maybe it's an EU thing that stopped all the preloaded crap, no idea.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by vitorgrs on Sunday April 28, 2024 @01:41AM (#40186283)
This reminds me of Brazil here! Was pretty common to buy PCs at the time with Linux. Almost no one obviously were going to use Linux at the time. Most people I do say, installed later pirated versions of Windows.

This happened because no OEM license = cheaper. These days I don't think it matters anymore, because probably the OEM license is much cheaper than it was back then.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by ndiddy on Saturday April 27, 2024 @04:59PM (#40183495)
Windows still comes with a lot of crap installed by default, the difference is that Microsoft has decided to cut out the OEMs and preload the crap themselves (a clean install of Windows 11 Professional comes with apps for Roblox, TikTok, and Disney Plus among others) so the "install from retail media" trick no longer works unless you also pirate the LTSC or Education editions of Windows.
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by jbr1ckl3y on Saturday April 27, 2024 @05:56PM (#40183954)
It's not simple but it is doable:

1. Format a flash drive with two partitions 2. Burn the Windows installer ISO to the first partition 3. Download all the drivers to the second partition 4. Flash the BIOS with the latest version 5. Ensure you are NOT connected to the Internet and boot flash drive 6. Install Windows, disallow the metrics they let you opt-out 7. Creating a local account works because offline 8. Install drivers avoid add-on software from manufacturer 9. Edit local group policy - enable "Turn off Microsoft Consumer Experience" 9a. Alternatively, edit the Registry, DisableWindowsConsumerFeatures in HKLM\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\CloudContent 10. Connect Internet, check for updates reboot a few times 11. Open Microsoft Store and uninstall any junk apps (stubs) 12. Install whatever other software you desire 13. Configure your update settings so it is less annoying

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by jmholla on Saturday April 27, 2024 @06:37PM (#40184221)
Good guide. But holy hell.
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by Dalewyn on Saturday April 27, 2024 @08:46PM (#40184949)
It's a needlessly esoteric, bad guide. The first three steps can be simplified into "Obtain an installation media.", and the fourth step of updating your BIOS has nothing to do with Windows specifically.

Creating a local account is basic sense (no, not common sense; we aren't common people), and not connecting to the internet during install is recommended but not a hard requirement.

Installing drivers while avoiding their bloatware is, again, basic sense.

Disabling "Microsoft Consumer Experience" does nothing as far as I've experienced (and it shouldn't, the setting is only effective on Windows 11 Enterprise and Education); I never modify that setting myself.

On the other hand, I turn off Automatic Updates (automatic Windows Update) and Microsoft Store's ability to automatically download and update programs via the Group Policies. This is probably what you want if Disney+ keeps bothering you.

This all said, if you're getting pestered by third-party crapware you are probably using Windows 11 Home. Just pay up for a Professional license and save your time and nerves. The cheaper price of Home licenses is offset by third-party crapware.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by Nullabillity on Saturday April 27, 2024 @11:18PM (#40185731)
> Just pay up for a Professional license and save your time and nerves.

What on earth. This is stockholm syndrome in a nutshell.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by Gigablah on Saturday April 27, 2024 @11:57PM (#40185859)
Stockholm syndrome is continuing to stay on Windows.
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by ambichook on Sunday April 28, 2024 @07:46PM (#40193028)
especially if you just buy a single pro license and keep it across all your pc upgrades. i havent paid for a new windows license in years and all my copies are legal, dont keep nuking and buying new keys and its not expensive
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by TheLegace on Saturday April 27, 2024 @10:38PM (#40185546)
This is all you need. https://windowsxlite.com/win11/
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by buildbot on Saturday April 27, 2024 @11:01PM (#40185659)
Ah yes, install some random (closed source?) software
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by TheLegace on Saturday April 27, 2024 @11:43PM (#40185813)
I agree its a concern. You could argue everything on XDA forums and any modified Windows should have the same problems.

Personally I use the community of version of Arch i3, not going to check the source on that, but will trust that community might keep an eye on anything nefarious.

Doesn't seem like Linux is completely immune from that either(i.e. XZ Utils).

But the build is amazingly stable and fast, and I will have to take it good faith that they didn't do anything that would harm me.

I can at least track down the author in various communities and seems to be semi-open about their identity. There is a forum thread any concerns I can bring up with the person responsible.

They are also taking donations. I would hope that exposes them to some liability and financial trail if they are found doing something illegal.

https://www.teamos.xyz/threads/windows-x-lite-optimum-11-24h...

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by Dalewyn on Saturday April 27, 2024 @08:27PM (#40184866)
>(a clean install of Windows 11 Professional comes with apps for Roblox, TikTok, and Disney Plus among others)

It does not, I've been working with fresh installs a lot this year for one reason or another and no fresh Windows 11 Professional installation has had third-party crapware pre-installed. That includes an install I just did a few days ago using an ISO downloaded straight from Microsoft.

Windows 11 Home probably does have them, though.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by tcmart14 on Sunday April 28, 2024 @01:18AM (#40186193)
Its even worst now. My work PC is unfortunately running Windows 11 Enterprise edition or something like that. Our main product is still .NET Framework with winforms, so I am rather locked into Windows on my work machine. I constantly get pop-ups of, 'hey about you you try using our <insert windows software> with co-pilot now!.'
Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by ksec on Sunday April 28, 2024 @01:23AM (#40186203)
PC OEM earn more from those bloatware installation than from selling the hardware. They have effectively sold PC as a loss leader.

Don't know if that is still true today.

Re:The walls of Apple's garden are tumbling down by etempleton on Sunday April 28, 2024 @03:10AM (#40186654)
PCs generally still have a lot of bloatware installed by default and most Android devices have modified versions of Android. I won’t buy a pre-built windows PC anymore.

Honestly, I think this situation is worse for consumers than anything Apple is doing. Technically you have more choice with Windows and Android but it can be difficult for the average consumer to make an informed decision because the device manufacture cram so much stuff onto these devices without your knowledge.