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Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by deadbabe on Saturday December 23, 2023 @12:17PM (#38745901)
The target is Hamas. Some innocents are dying, but the intent isn’t to deliberately kill them. And there is no evidence any of those other criteria are even happening.
Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by sschueller on Saturday December 23, 2023 @12:18PM (#38745909)
There is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fP-J8m-BF0 , NY Times: Visual Evidence Shows Israel Dropped Bombs Where It Ordered Gaza Civilians to Go
Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by riku_iki on Saturday December 23, 2023 @12:31PM (#38746059)
> Where It Ordered Gaza Civilians to Go

to be specific: actual content says Israel asked civilians to move to South Gaza, while claim is that they still targeted targets there.

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by dlubarov on Saturday December 23, 2023 @02:16PM (#38747162)
So there are two explanations

1) Israel asked civilians to move south to be relatively safer, some important Hamas officers moved south along with them, and Israel targeted them.

2) The strikes weren't about Hamas officers, but just a deliberate killing of civilians.

If you're saying this is evidence of genocide, that means you're discounting (1) and assuming (2)? Why?

I'm not condoning (1), which suggests IDF is prioritizing its concerns (expediency etc) over civilian lives, but that clearly doesn't meet the definition of genocide.

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by za3faran on Saturday December 23, 2023 @03:09PM (#38747681)
The Israelis admitted that they are fighting "human animals" (remember who else used dehumanization tactics in WWII?), and that their goal was "damage, not accuracy".
Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by Chris2048 on Saturday December 23, 2023 @01:24PM (#38746594)
> The target is Hamas

"Two Thirds of Gaza War Dead Are Women and Children"

-- https://press.un.org/en/2023/sc15503.doc.htm

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by riku_iki on Saturday December 23, 2023 @04:04PM (#38748219)
that person didn't provide source of information. Likely this is data from local authorities, aka Hamas.
Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by Chris2048 on Saturday December 23, 2023 @05:58PM (#38749149)
Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by riku_iki on Saturday December 23, 2023 @08:51PM (#38750318)
Both of your links say that data came from Hamas:

"The Hamas-run health ministry is Gaza's official source for death numbers"

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by tomjakubowski on Saturday December 23, 2023 @09:02PM (#38750381)
The article continues to explain that Gaza health ministry casualty counts for past conflicts have been confirmed after the fact by third party international organizations, like the WHO.

The records they release include names, genders, ages and ID numbers of deceased people. If you claim the data is fake then you should be able to identify some made-up deaths in it.

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by riku_iki on Saturday December 23, 2023 @10:09PM (#38750735)
> past conflicts have been confirmed after the fact by third party international organizations, like the WHO.

This is not my reading that WHO or any other org confirmed anything. They say in 2014 both Israel and Palestinians agreed on number of casualties, but this time discrepancy is 10x.

> If you claim the data is fake then you should be able to identify some made-up deaths in it.

say they made up some ID, name, gender and age. How exactly I could identify this?

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by C6JEsQeQa5fCjE on Saturday December 23, 2023 @02:48PM (#38747470)
> Some innocents are dying

It is estimated that about 70% of killed people (which has gone over 20000 recently) are women and children. Those are not Hamas fighters. Even if you assume that every adult male that has been killed was a Hamas fighter (which is obviously not going to be the case), that is still 70% of people who are killed by IDF being innocent civilians.

[1] https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/how-many-palestini...

> the intent isn’t to deliberately kill them. And there is no evidence any of those other criteria are even happening

On the contrary, even the mere evidence in form of public statements by the leaders of Israel strongly suggests intent to harm civilians. The statements suggest that they are pursuing revenge on the whole Gaza strip, and aiming to inflict as many casualties as they can get away with.

- Prime Minister Netanyahu pledged to reduce parts of Gaza “to rubble” and invoked the people of Amalek, the foe that God ordered the ancient Israelites to genocide in the Bible, in a recent speech. [1]

- Defense minister Yoav Gallant called for a “complete siege” on Gaza and stated that “we are fighting human animals, and we are acting accordingly.” [1]

- Army spokesperson Daniel Hagari said forces would turn Gaza into a “city of tents” and admitted that Israel’s “emphasis is on damage and not on accuracy” in dropping hundreds of tons of bombs on Gaza. [1]

- Ariel Kallner, a member of parliament from Netanyahu’s Likud party, wrote on X after the Hamas attack: “Right now, one goal: Nakba! A Nakba that will overshadow the Nakba of 48. Nakba in Gaza and Nakba to anyone who dares to join!” [2]

- Giora Eiland, a reservist major general and former head of the Israeli National Security Council, wrote in a popular Hebrew-language newspaper, “The State of Israel has no choice but to turn Gaza into a place that is temporarily or permanently impossible to live in.” Elsewhere, he specified that “Israel needs to create a humanitarian crisis in Gaza, compelling tens of thousands or even hundreds of thousands to seek refuge in Egypt or the Gulf” and indeed that Israel must demand that “The entire population of Gaza will either move to Egypt or move to the Gulf.” Finally, he said that “Gaza will become a place where no human being can exist.” [2]

- “Human animals must be treated as such. There will be no electricity and no water [in Gaza], there will only be destruction. You wanted hell, you will get hell.”, IDF general Ghassan Aliyan [3]

- Revital Gotliv, a Parliament member from Netanyahu’s ruling Likud party, called for Israel to use nuclear weapons in Gaza: “It’s time for a doomsday weapon. Shooting powerful missiles without limit. Not flattening a neighborhood. Crushing and flattening Gaza.” [1]

- Galit Distel Atbaryan, also of Likud, posted on X in Hebrew that Israelis should invest their energy in one thing: “Erasing all of Gaza from the face of the earth” and forcing the “Gazan monsters” either to flee the strip to Egypt or to face their death. [1]

[1] https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/13/23954731/genoc...

[2] https://www.vox.com/world-politics/23933707/israel-palestine...

[3] https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/cogat-chief-add...

Re:Meta censors pro-Palestinian views on a global scale, rep... by Xelbair on Saturday December 23, 2023 @12:28PM (#38746016)
So you are saying that genocide is fine as long as it is someone who you deem as not innocent?

Interesting.