News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by pydry on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:15PM (#36791714)
>introverts find interactions with other “draining”

I'm pretty sure this is bullshit.

Level of drain = lack of trust in that person X overall level of anxiety

If you're highly anxious and socializing with people you dont trust (strangers, acquaintances) then the experience will be stressful draining.

Ive met many self declared introverts who have no problem socializing for long periods in small groups with people they trust absolutely.

Ditto self declared extroverts who are "socially performing" in a critical sitation where they will be judged can't help but find the experience draining.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by karaterobot on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:33PM (#36791971)
I think what you call bullshit is a core part of the generally accepted definition of an introvert, so I'd want some more extraordinary proof than this in order to be persuaded.

> Ive met many self declared introverts who have no problem socializing for long periods in small groups with people they trust absolutely.

How do you know they had no problem socializing for long periods? Did you ask them, or did they just not complain about it to you? Part of the issue for many introverts is the social expectation is often set by a more extroverted culture, and they just try to fit in. That doesn't mean they prefer chatting with you for four hours rather than, say, two hours.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by pydry on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:53PM (#36792218)
>How do you know they had no problem socializing for long periods? Did you ask them

Yes of course. I think pretty much every self declared introvert Ive asked about this had 1-5 people for whom spending time with them didnt "drain" them - e.g. best friend, parent, spouse, etc.

When they described what type of situations drained them that they enjoyed it would generally be something like going to a party where they didnt know anyone.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by em-bee on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @07:40PM (#36795067)
that's not enough evidence. while i would generally agree that it is true and matches my experience that the better i know people the less drained i get interacting with them, i have interacted with people i have never met before without being drained and i can get drained by people who i otherwise trust. in both cases what mattered was that i had to focus on them and not on myself. where i don't get drained with total strangers is when the topic of discussion is one where i can contribute a lot, vs a topic where i feel less secure. naturally interacting with best friends, partners and other close family, topics are often familiar and comfortable, and, uncomfortable topics are easy to avoid. at a party on the other hand it can be hit or miss, and usually hits are rare. out of several dozen events i can count two where someone i never met before and me found a topic so interesting that we were talking about it for hours. going home from those left me full of energy, when most others didn't.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by CPLX on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @07:41PM (#36795076)
> generally accepted definition of an introvert

As far as I can tell this is really just true for a sort of Reddit centric extremely online crowd, in the category of “everyone knows” stuff that just originates from random message board postings that catch on.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by stronglikedan on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:26PM (#36791856)
> introverts find interactions with other “draining”

> I'm pretty sure this is bullshit.

As an introvert, it's spot on. I have no problems socializing with people, whether I trust them or not. I spend long periods (e.g., days camping) with groups that I trust. I enjoy all of it in the moment. I don't have anxiety. It's all still draining, and I need to spend days alone to recharge after days of socializing, enjoyable or otherwise.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by 0xfae on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @04:00PM (#36792331)
I think if you use the model presented by the author of the article, it's less than you need to "recharge" but rather that after a few days you've filled your small group and large group bucket/quota, and now you need to fill that solitude bucket/quota.

It's just two different ways of describing the same phenomenon. I like the authors because it's much more multi-faceted and easier to find practical applications, at least in my mind. "I enjoy a good amount of solitude, and I've just spent several days socializing, so I'm going to prioritize alone time for the next few days" rather than "I need to recharge so I can be social again." It's similar, but I like the first one better.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by tstrimple on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @11:14PM (#36796510)
Yeah, sure. One bucketing emptying over time and then refilling as you change activities is completely different than a battery which depletes over time and then recharges.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by tayo42 on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @04:33PM (#36792835)
if you went camping on your own, you dont think you still need to recharge?
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by stronglikedan on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @04:41PM (#36792972)
No, I do that to recharge.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by kaashif on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @07:07PM (#36794772)
Something about this interaction is funny to me. It's like an alien asking: but after you drink all that water, won't you die? And the human replies: no, I actually do that to stay alive.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by tayo42 on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @07:33PM (#36795003)
camping is a pretty tiring activity though on its own
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by bowsamic on Thursday July 20, 2023 @03:27AM (#36797760)
Personally I think camping is very relaxing. Usually I am camping on a walking holiday, and it's the walking that is physically tiring. Going back to the tent and sleeping is extremely relaxing.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by Shaanie on Saturday July 22, 2023 @01:35PM (#36828083)
Do you mean hiking?
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by jgilias on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:21PM (#36791796)
Well, no. I guess if you don’t know then you don’t know.

As an anecdotal personal example. I love my wife and kids dearly. I trust them, and feel no anxiety being around them. Yet it’s draining. Now they’re gone for a few days, and I feel very good being finally alone for a few days.

Likewise I enjoy getting together with friends and family. I’ve also learned to be sociable. But it’s draining. After a day of having to interact with people I really, really, really cherish being alone for a few hours with my own thoughts, and preferably silence.

We’re different like that, people in general, I mean.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by coffeebeqn on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:40PM (#36792044)
You also adjust to a degree. With a family those longer moments can be as rare as a few times a year. I used to be alone for many hours or days almost daily when I was younger. But I’m doing fine. I really do enjoy the moments of solitude but I guess I don’t need them as much as I thought.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by bityard on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @04:16PM (#36792553)
Well, some of us are. :/
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by jgilias on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @05:11PM (#36793462)
Recognizing that something takes effort doesn’t necessarily imply that the activity is not enjoyable or worth pursuing.

I mean, I do see how someone might believe that just because one finds an activity draining they’d strive to avoid it at all costs. But that really doesn’t have to be the case.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by SketchySeaBeast on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:46PM (#36792134)
You're heavily conflating anxiety and introversion. My wife is an extrovert with anxiety - once she gets comfortable she's energized by people. She comes home bouncing off the walls. I'm an introvert - regardless of comfort level I come home and want to go to bed immediately.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by pydry on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @05:21PM (#36793602)
Im pretty sure everybody gets energized once they've gotten fully comfortable with someone.

That process of getting comfortable is the relevant context though - not a virtual dial in their brain that goes from "introvert" to "extrovert".

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by isk517 on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @06:05PM (#36794127)
Ha, I wish. The level of comfort with someone really only effects the rate of energy drain, at least in my case.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by SketchySeaBeast on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @06:30PM (#36794400)
But that's not what I'm saying - I'm saying conversation drains me even if I'm with someone I'm comfortable with. I'm tired when it's over. My wife is not. She comes home excited.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by tstrimple on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @11:29PM (#36796589)
It's very much like I have a hidden meter for dealing with other people. Once it's full, I'm done with people. It doesn't really matter how much I like or trust these people. I can get burned out from talking to folks at work and need space from my family and vice-versa. I just need time to be alone and not have to consider making conversation or entertaining anyone. I need space for my thoughts to expand and to not be constantly distracted by other people's "noise". I love my wife. I love my kids. I enjoy spending time with them. But when that social meter is full, regardless of how it got full, I have little ability to engage with them.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by bowsamic on Thursday July 20, 2023 @03:28AM (#36797775)
> Im pretty sure everybody gets energized once they've gotten fully comfortable with someone.

They don't though. You just sound like an extrovert that can't fathom that introverts exist.

Even if my family visit me and I am comfortable with them, I will still be extremely tired when they leave. I won't feel "energised"

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by em-bee on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @08:13PM (#36795351)
hmm, that's an interesting perspective. see my comment here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36795067 i can definitely see that the comfort level is a factor. however, it can take a long time before i get comfortable with someone. i have no idea how much, but a few hours at a party are almost never enough, unless we hit the right topic. so yeah, after those conversations i was bouncing off the walls too.

likewise i have given presentations on various topics in front of dozens or hundreds of people. my comfort level depended on how well prepared i was, and how the audience reacted. during the speech part anxiety is higher because i get little to no feedback, but then the Q&A can turn things around if people have lots of questions that show their interest in the topic.

oh, and when i am drained, i can't go to sleep. i have to do something interesting for myself for at least an hour or more in order to divert my thoughts away from the draining experience.

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by vidarh on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @03:59PM (#36792307)
It does not matter how much I trust someone, or how relaxed I am, or indeed how much I enjoy myself with someone, being around people still drains me of energy. There are differences in how fast, but not whether or not it drains me.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by jghn on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @05:05PM (#36793369)
I'm somewhere in that morass. I love socializing with people I know and enjoy. I hate social interaction with strangers and/or people I don't know well, don't like, etc. I'm also completely happy being by myself for long stretches of time. What's draining vs energizing for me is equally a mess.

Don't know what that makes me but I don't worry about the labels

Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by jaredhallen on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @08:32PM (#36795475)
The lack of trust aspect resonates with me. I find interactions with people I know well and connect with to be the opposite of draining. It seems like different people just have different criteria for what constitutes positive interaction. And my experience says even that varies for an individual, depending on mood, energy level, or whatever other factors.
Re:Beyond introvert vs. extrovert by magicalhippo on Wednesday July 19, 2023 @08:55PM (#36795641)
>> introverts find interactions with other “draining”

> I'm pretty sure this is bullshit.

Both me and my SO are more introvert than not.

We've come to the conclusion that one of the core reasons it's so draining for us is that we puts a lot of thought into interactions and conversations, even superficial small talk ones.

At least in our experience, those who appear more extrovert seem to do less of that. They don't seem to reflect over all our actions, or everything we say. Some of it, or at certain times, sure. But seemingly not to the same degree.

If that is the case, then it is more draining, because we exert more mental effort.

> Level of drain = lack of trust in that person X overall level of anxiety

Speaking for myself at least, anxiety has nothing to do with it, nor lack of trust. I don't feel any anxiety striking a random conversation with someone in a bar or with a family member at home. And when I have a random conversation with someone in a bar, it doesn't matter if I trust them or not, because the topics are almost never intimate. With my family members I know I can trust them, so that's moot as well.

But both conversations can be quite draining, and at least for me, I suspect it has more to do with what I described above.