> It’s what I love about HN. Sure, most of us wouldn’t mind being rich (sorry, ‘financially independent’), but it’s not the driver. The driver is to make something cool; to make something better.

Is this sarcasm? If it's genuine, I can think of many reasons. Either you are too young or wearing horse blinds or not living in the valley. Practically every start up is driven by a desire to be rich. This is why everyone sells to make millions at the first opportunity. They objectively have made the tech industry a worse place.

It's not black or white. There are people in the startup ecosystem that are driven mainly by money and there are those more idealistic.

The startup industry is a great place for the people who are driven by money to prey on those that are idealistic, just like the game industry profits off of people who really like video games.

Hopefully now with more information available out there us workers can stand up more for ourselves and get more for the value of our labor and expertise!

I’m sorry, but no. Not anymore. Everything is run by being able to get money from VC investors, and to make money for them. It IS the main driver. Idealists learn pretty fast how their idealism won’t take them anywhere in Silicon Valley of 2023. Or they’re stupid or tone deaf enough to keep on going and thinking that their n-th to-do list app will change the world. I’m afraid I gotta break it to you, but your romanticized idea of Silicon Valley is dead in the water.

It can be the main driver for some, but not the only one for all :)

And the people who are mainly motivated by money greatly appreciate the second group. I think in poker jargon they're called "marks" (less politely, suckers).

Still, as a neutral observer to this, their sacrifice is greatly appreciated!

And they operate how, exactly? with the money of people who are in there for the money.

> Is this sarcasm?

No. I’m a long way — physically — from ‘the valley’, and I’m certainly not young.

When I say ‘HN’ I mean the day to day discussion on this site. I know there’s VC and whatnot here but really, mostly, that’s not what I’m reading. Perhaps I subconsciously avoid it?

I’m reading people who are passionate about technology. I’m reading nerds who love a new thing. That’s what brings me back here day after day.

You are making judgement calls on people's personalities based on not very much. HN is a public website, the discussions can be good and genuine and we can all be the same narcissistic psychopaths that are only here to accumulate HN karma that for some reason we value higher than money.

Or we can all be dogs, it's the internet and you have no idea. I'd start taking online communities with a bigger grain of salt.

I’ve been online since ‘94, don’t worry about me. I’ll figure it out eventually.

HN hasn't been geared towards VC startup founders for probably 10+ years. Compare the old HN, where PG still commented, to today's list of topics.

> What I find distasteful about these fellas is that they’re not adding anything to the world. They’re taking away.

I find that distasteful about the whole advertising industry, that celebrities are just a part of.

Including reviews and ratings industry. Advertisement is not the engine of the trade anymore, Search is. Ads and reviews only destroy what Search and old newspaper ads created and should be finally heavily regulated, in search too. It’s a legalized fraud nobody cares about.

I admit I envy their ability to not care how they are making their money.

I was once pitched a gig that, after you boiled away the flowery tech contraptions, amounted simply to “run your own scummy leadgen business.” I felt like I had to take a shower after hearing that pitch. Wouldn’t it be nice if I didn’t have that part of my brain that recoils in disgust at treating other human beings as “leads” to be bought and sold?

If you want to get rid of that part of your brain, check my profile and fill out the form on my homepage ...

Apart from the lack of personal fulfillment, isn't it good for society, and thus not such a bad job, that fools are parted from their money? After all, consumers decide what our society does. If a consumer is not able to recognize a scam, how can society trust them to make meaningful decisions? A hustle guru will spend their money on fast cars and thus at least support state of the art engineering.

I do wish this is a sarcastic comment, can't tell anymore these days.

Since there is no homepage linked on his profile, I would think it was sarcasm ..

Still, to adress that point:

"isn't it good for society, and thus not such a bad job, that fools are parted from their money"

It is overall bad, as it creates an atmosphere of distrust and distrusting everything costs a lot of energy.

Unfortunately the hustle gurus usually spend it on making the world even worse: more scams, content promoting scammy lifestyle, paying scam buddies, paying off politician to pass scam friendly laws etc.

I don't really care (that much anyway, I do care a bit) that some useful idiot went broke buying into yet another crypto scam. I do care about the guys running the operation getting more resources though as they will use them to make the world I live in worse.

Consumers make the world worse, too. The housing bubble exists because useful idiots are willing to pay beyond reasonable market value, destroying prices for everybody.