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Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by kccqzy on Thursday February 23, 2023 @11:38PM (#34920836)
From https://www.newyorker.com/news/letter-from-silicon-valley/th...

> The site’s real-life moderators are Daniel Gackle and Scott Bell, two wildly polite old friends. […] Gackle and Bell, by contrast, practice a personal, focussed, and slow approach to moderation, which they see as a conversational act. They treat their community like an encounter group or Esalen workshop; often, they correspond with individual Hacker News readers over e-mail, coaching and encouraging them in long, heartfelt exchanges.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by kennethrc on Thursday February 23, 2023 @11:55PM (#34920958)
Huh. Been pronouncing it in my head as "dang!" (like the "expletive") all this time
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by tjr on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:13AM (#34921068)
Not necessarily wrong though!

https://jargon-file.org/archive/jargon-1.5.0.dos.txt

Login names are often used as nicknames, pronounce[d] if possible and spelled if necessary. My wife and I met at MIT, and she still calls me "Gliss", because my login name was GLS. "Guy" sounds very weird to her.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by benatkin on Friday February 24, 2023 @03:14AM (#34922206)
Some are more than just logins or nicknames, they're handles. I will never use substack.com* after they stole substack's handle.

* as a publisher or a subscriber, and to some extent even as a reader

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by Zecc on Friday February 24, 2023 @03:32AM (#34922302)
My thoughts go to the person in my college whose login, based on their initials, was `acne`.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by jjice on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:07AM (#34921031)
Oh man I just got this too. Dan G. Jeez. I'm going to pretend I didn't see that, but what a minor change to something I interact with every day. Neat!
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by daxfohl on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:15AM (#34921824)
It's like that Seinfeld episode. https://seinfeld.fandom.com/wiki/Donna_Chang
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by spindle on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:43AM (#34921276)
There's no way I'm ever going to stop pronouncing it "dang!". I'm sure dang knows this.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by brundolf on Friday February 24, 2023 @01:11AM (#34921436)
"Dang" is a last name some people have, I assumed it was that for a long time
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by dang on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:42PM (#34929045)
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by pkrotich on Friday February 24, 2023 @04:21PM (#34930303)
Same here - reminds me of a lawyer named “So Sue” - cannot find the reference but I thought it must be interesting seeing her name on legal papers.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by steve_adams_86 on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:08AM (#34921035)
> often, they correspond with individual Hacker News readers over e-mail, coaching and encouraging them in long, heartfelt exchanges

I've been part of a brief but very positive exchange like this with dang, and it's not an exaggeration. This is part of why I still visit the site; there's a real personal touch that makes this forum what it is.

I felt stupid about a comment I'd left and thought "ugh, I should ask someone to delete this". dang responded saying it was a great comment and that I should consider keeping it as it was the kind of content he felt made HN a constructive and interesting place. I was totally caught off-guard.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by daniel_iversen on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:17AM (#34921094)
I also had the pleasure of dang’s help and kindness when I posted something that could be seen as inappropriate as our company was in the process of our public listing, and he was kind enough to help me delete it.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by mettamage on Friday February 24, 2023 @01:38AM (#34921590)
Similar experiences here
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by swyx on Saturday February 25, 2023 @10:46AM (#34937495)
wait what? dang responded to a thought you had? i mean he’s good but nobodys THAT good
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by flangola7 on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:08AM (#34921036)
I wonder how (if?) they prevent NLP bots and influence campaigns.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by dang on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:51PM (#34929174)
NLP bots we're just in the early stages of dealing with. So far we're relying on community members to tell us about them (so if you think you're seeing that, please let us know! [email protected]).

Influence campaigns are an older problem, so we have many years' worth of defenses built up, although it's an arms race where the influencers also evolve.

I'm aware that I didn't answer the "how" part of your question—the trouble is that there's no secure way to do it, so everything relies on a stack of ad hoc techniques that would stop working if we published them. It's basically the old "I'd tell you but then I'd have to kill you" joke. But the answer to the "if" part is yes.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by tptacek on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:20AM (#34921120)
Bell hasn't been affiliated with HN in quite awhile, for whatever that's worth.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by divbzero on Friday February 24, 2023 @12:46AM (#34921301)
My impression is the same: that it’s basically an old-fashioned manual process of clear consistent communication.

That said, he has at least one macro at his disposal for expanding past threads about a topic: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34913653

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by keyle on Friday February 24, 2023 @01:28AM (#34921527)
Thanks, this let me down the rabbit hole of finding out what "Esalen" is about... Fascinating.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by avhception on Friday February 24, 2023 @01:55AM (#34921687)
Mind sharing?
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by veqq on Friday February 24, 2023 @03:22AM (#34922249)
Esalen's a retreat for the human potential movement, which centers on selfactualizing yourself, through New Age spiritual things, alternative medicine etc.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by bobleeswagger on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:04AM (#34921748)
> often, they correspond with individual Hacker News readers over e-mail, coaching and encouraging them in long, heartfelt exchanges.

I think this is outdated, or flat out not true.

I have had particularly sour engagements with dang specifically. I asked him to reach out to me via email and he just kept pushing the matter in public.

Pretty poor handling all around, and completely lacking inclusivity or self-awareness for a "seasoned professional." I'm glad it's daisies and roses for most of you, but some of us have not seen such kindness. Ultimately you have to ask yourself if moderation has fostered an environment of growth and evolution, or an echo chamber. In my experience I have seen more of the latter on HN, and it's concerning.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by kergonath on Friday February 24, 2023 @06:34AM (#34923468)
> I think this is outdated, or flat out not true.

It is entirely true, as of a couple of weeks ago.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by bobleeswagger on Friday February 24, 2023 @10:48AM (#34925668)
Like I said, I'm still waiting to experience it. As far as I can tell, most moderation of HN is done in public, not in private over email.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by dang on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:58PM (#34929282)
I probably spend more time in email than on the site, unfortunately—or at least it feels that way.

I hear you that you didn't get a satisfying email response, and I'm sorry about that. It's possible that I screwed up. Actually, it's likely that I screwed up, because you're posting this some time later and it's my job not to leave people feeling this way.

Without details, though, it's impossible to say what happened. I probably wouldn't email a user who just said "email me" in a public comment. But if you wrote in to [email protected] and I didn't read or hear you or reply in a way that met your concern, then I'm sorry.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by bobleeswagger on Saturday February 25, 2023 @12:28PM (#34938428)
> Without details

You'd think this small thread you replied to would be enough detail if you were willing to reply in the first place.

Look at my original post. Simply sharing my experience (which is on-topic). It currently sits at -3, while other comments praising moderation here are mostly positive. This is a pattern I am noticing across more than one thread, in more than one day, with more than one user. It's not an anomaly.

Replies to me are from folks lacking self-awareness, who think their experience somehow trumps or invalidates mine. Nobody is directly addressing my concerns. Just brushing them off and piling on.

You should recognize there is a growing majority at HN who perpetuate this "SV" flavor of culture, and you should recognize that your inability to scale efficiently is detrimental to the long term growth of HN. Ironically, against the users most willing to help you do better, you level threats publicly and cite HN rules as if they have any relevance.

Frankly, it seems you are blissfully unaware of how much of an echo chamber exists here, or that you are directly perpetuating it. It's concerning. Flagging comments and downvotes are actively abused for censorship, and you clearly have no idea how to fix it. You think the system is working, what if it has always been horribly broken...?

It's even more concerning that seemingly every other member at HN gets white glove treatment, yet I am still wondering when I will be treated like a human by the staff.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by motoxpro on Saturday February 25, 2023 @08:30PM (#34942178)
No one is out to get you bud. You just had a different experience than most people here, hence the downvotes.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by telis on Wednesday March 01, 2023 @02:55AM (#34979841)
…I’m out to get him… but jokes aside. I see his point.

I’m not really active online for the majority of my usage of sites like this.

I’m just here for the content.

Rarely I will submit something interesting I come across but over the years I’ve noticed the cycles of the same sites and the same content.

The “Dead Internet Theory” really does resonate with me. I’ve been browsing HN since ‘06 when Tesla was just the weird roadster maker.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by tptacek on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:43PM (#34929058)
You could provide a link to the public exchange, so we can see the bad experience you had and evaluate it ourselves.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by bobleeswagger on Friday February 24, 2023 @04:33PM (#34930423)
Is that why I shared the experience...? So randos can play jury?

Just look at how popular my original comment is. There's clearly a culture lean here and I'm not going to feed into it.

I'm going to call it out and laugh when I'm proven right.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by tough on Friday February 24, 2023 @08:02PM (#34932565)
You have the mail in the Contact in the bottom of every page

[email protected]

They're kind enough to respond when time allows if it ain't urgent

only good words from my side for Dan G.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by bobleeswagger on Saturday February 25, 2023 @02:12AM (#34934603)
> You have the mail

They have mine too. Courtesy goes both ways.

> only good words from my side for Dan G.

I don't give a shit. The more people that say everything is hunky-dory, the more I am validated that the echo chamber often gangs up on minority opinions here.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by tptacek on Saturday February 25, 2023 @10:16AM (#34937254)
You sound fun.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by bobleeswagger on Saturday February 25, 2023 @12:35PM (#34938503)
You sound vaxxed.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by password4321 on Friday February 24, 2023 @02:21AM (#34921858)
Most recent discussion (Feb 2022): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30374040

Specific mention of a custom browser extension: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30374040#30378776

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by threatofrain on Friday February 24, 2023 @04:11AM (#34922583)
There's also automation for categorizing voting behavior and a deputized admin team. In general dang is not willing to discuss the details of moderation under the argument that sunlight would destroy efficacy.

My account was penalized but I don't have any understanding over the nature of penalties or the conditions under which penalized status is lifted, if ever.

Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by mooreds on Friday February 24, 2023 @06:47PM (#34931923)
I've received a few emails from Dang and can confirm it's a very human interaction, even if he is slapping your wrist for behavior that breaks site norms.
Re:Ask Dang: What tools do you use for moderating HN? by corobo on Saturday February 25, 2023 @06:59AM (#34935982)
Dan has a great way of telling you off that makes you come out of the situation like ".. aye, that's fair actually. No worries, I'll avoid doing it in future"

You don't often see de-escalation on the internet. Especially between moderator and user when they could just as easily disappear you from the site. It works well.