News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by lokimedes on Monday November 21, 2022 @12:34AM (#33689176)
I think the whole industry has degenerated to producing uninspiring grub. No wonder they have mastered it. Everything coming out of the company is CGI+emotional response maximization with little new themes. They should revert to making things that don’t scale, hire screenwriters with original ideas that are difficult to translate to movies, etc.

A friend of mine regularly compares Quentin Tarantino’s early movies to today’s mass produced boredom. Calling it MBA filmmaking. It reminds me of an industry running on Amazon’s recommendation engine, only making derivatives of existing successes.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by karp773 on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:06AM (#33689390)
100%. While we are at this, I am happy to share my heuristic for sifting "uninspiring grub" from quality shows. Two words: theme song. If the protagonists wander around in silence on a CGI generated background, that's a hard pass right away. Unfortunately, most of Netflix originals fall into this category.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by silvester23 on Monday November 21, 2022 @03:22AM (#33690174)
Could you give an example of such an intro? I'm not entirely sure what style you are referring to and am quite curious.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by moritonal on Monday November 21, 2022 @03:30AM (#33690221)
Dur dir duh, der der der. duh duh duh, dih dih dih dih dih! - Indiana Jones

Duh.. Duh.. Dih dih dir! Dir Di dih dih dir dir du du duh! - Star Trek - Next Gen

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by bombcar on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:58PM (#33696395)
dead ant, dead ant, dead ant, dead ant, dead aaaaaaaaaaaaant
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by karp773 on Monday November 21, 2022 @06:52PM (#33699891)
The Bourne Identity, Skyfall, Game of Thrones, Pirates of the Caribbean, and so on.

It does not have to be original. And I don't mean only the intro but the entire soundtrack. Often, the theme song is reused over and over during the film with many variations to set the tone of a scene.

Bad movies skimp on soundtracks.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by thebradbain on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:15AM (#33689436)
As someone who lives in Los Angeles and is mostly surrounded by people in film/tv, the indie film industry is a LOT bigger than many people outside of the know realize. And I’m so thankful for that, because that’s where the “things that don’t scale, … original ideas that are difficult to translate to movies, etc” flourish. In a way, the indie movie scene is in better shape than it ever has been— with well-known big name actors even hopping in now and then.

You could argue the indie scene is similar to the startup scene in SV. You have investors/producers pretty much funding these films based on team/talent and a pitch alone, with the festival circuit (could be considered an analog to SV demo-days or investor powows) essentially serving as a way to get bought by big studios for potential wide release, limited-release runs (which can still make a lot of money for those involved), or teams hired/screenplays bought and adapted by other studios. You can even make it big right out of college (or in college) [1] with little-to-no connections, though of course even more-so than SV a name and pedigree gets you further faster.

There’s so much in LA (and NYC) that gets released in theaters only locally, and the city is better for it. It’s the wide-release that, almost by definition, must serve lowest common denominator in order to make its 8/9-figure budget back in a span of months (tech companies get years!!). It’s sad that SF and LA, so close geographically, have industries so socially polarized to each other in every way, since there’s really a lot of overlap when you get down to it (and each industry could definitely learn things from the other)

[1] https://variety.com/2022/film/news/apple-cha-cha-real-smooth...

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by seanmcdirmid on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:53AM (#33689639)
> There’s so much in LA (and NYC) that gets released in theaters only locally, and the city is better for it.

There are arthouse movie theaters throughout that play the same movies that you think are only locally shown in LA/NYC. You just need the right context (near a university, for example).

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by thebradbain on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:56AM (#33689659)
Yes! Exactly. You can find glimpses of the indie scene in many places, if you know where to look for it. But they’re not as pervasive/all-encompassing outside those two cities. Chicago/Austin have scenes, but they’re smaller; Georgia sort of does, too, but it’s more corporate/extensions of big Hollywood studios than an independent community.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by eslaught on Monday November 21, 2022 @02:17AM (#33689769)
What I'd really personally like to see is space opera with better storytelling. But the impression I've got is that the sorts of films that do best as indies are ones where the props are cheap. So in other words, mostly contemporary or maybe historical settings. There are a handful of exceptions I'm aware of, but only a handful.

Am I wrong about this? Anything I'm missing?

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by phyrex on Monday November 21, 2022 @04:18AM (#33690531)
The Expanse
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by wheelinsupial on Monday November 21, 2022 @06:26PM (#33699656)
Unfortunately this one seems polarizing. I loved it from the first scene, but there seem to be more than a few people who find it slow and boring to start, and don't come around to it.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by phyrex on Tuesday November 22, 2022 @09:17AM (#33706009)
To be fair, it is a little slow and boring to start :) I still liked it, but it’s not representative of where the show goes later on
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by kranke155 on Monday November 21, 2022 @06:23AM (#33691342)
Seriously watch Andor. Best sci fi show I’ve seen in years, SW or not.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by phyrex on Tuesday November 22, 2022 @09:19AM (#33706022)
Does one need to be up to date on the recent Star Wars movies?
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by kranke155 on Tuesday November 22, 2022 @10:37AM (#33706892)
No, in fact nothing in particular relates it to any other SW content.

It’s just a sci fi show set in that universe, that’s the way I see it. Takes the universe seriously, sets down rules for how it could work and it operates within that space.

But it’s better written, acted and art directed than most TV I’ve ever seen.

Id rank it as high or higher than Chernobyl. I’d say it’s must see TV.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by phyrex on Saturday November 26, 2022 @12:53PM (#33754911)
I’m enjoying it! Thanks for the recommendation!
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by squokko on Monday November 21, 2022 @04:06AM (#33690448)
What's disappeared isn't the small independent super-low budget movie... as you said, that market is more active than ever. It's the >$10 million movie that everyone in the country can enjoy, has a name brand actor or two, but isn't just some recycled comic book tripe. Forrest Gump. The Big Sleep. Kramer vs. Kramer. Three Men and a Baby. Four Weddings and a Funeral. Terms of Endearment. etc.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by thebradbain on Monday November 21, 2022 @05:32AM (#33691011)
Indie movies can range anywhere from $100k-$15M+, it’s a big range.

But I understand your point— mid-budget studio movies (romcoms especially) have been hit the hardest by the pivot to Marvel mania and cinematic universes. Unfortunately that’s as much because of audience preference as it is studios.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by eslaught on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:30PM (#33696066)
Maybe I'm naive, but what stops indie studios from creating cinematic universes? The props, sets, visual effects, etc. are primarily what's expensive, not the size of the (in-your-head) universe. If anything, I would expect indie universes to be more consistent and to have more meaningful/powerful plots, because these things tend to be labors of love rather than the more cookie cutter process we see in the big films.

I think the big thing is the financial risk of committing to a series, but it seems like if you take the films one at a time, you get to see how the last one is doing before you get too far along making the next one. Can't be that much worse than making everything a one-off.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by thebradbain on Monday November 21, 2022 @05:55PM (#33699321)
They do! The largest one right now (which is also receiving a wide release, even) would be X (March 2022), then the prequel Pearl (September 2022), and the soon-to-be-sequel in 2023.

They spent probably less than $5M total on the 3 movies (and filmed all at once), and the first two have already brought in $25M at the box office. A pretty good indie success story.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by vagrantJin on Monday November 21, 2022 @05:41PM (#33699175)
The casual audience isnt stupid. Just lacking patience. New, Solid and well written themes are hard work to follow. Aint nobody got time for that.

But then theres also the insidious observation. My generation are now senior writers and also the majority of the audience and between us is as much creativity as a fart.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by matt-attack on Monday November 21, 2022 @06:19AM (#33691320)
…Good Will Hunting. At the time that movie (and the ones you listed) came out, they were the talk of the country. They were THE zeitgeist.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by harimau777 on Monday November 21, 2022 @08:29AM (#33692241)
Is there much in the way of indie action/adventure movies? What I miss most are movies oriented around action that aren't just derivative blockbusters. Compare something like Jackie Chan's Chinese movies or The Matrix to today's generic shaky cam fight scenes.

Even movies like Big Trouble in Little Chinatown or Predator, while not necessarily having plots worthy of the next Great American Novel, at least had interesting memorable ideas.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by BryantD on Monday November 21, 2022 @10:13AM (#33693433)
Quite a bit; just it's mostly living in the direct to video bin, as it were. There's a whole world of pretty decent action flicks out there[1]. Scott Adkins, who's mentioned in that article, makes just about anything he's in worth watching and directors like Jesse V. Johnson, John Hyams, and Isaac Florentine[2] are solid. Oh, and there's a whole cache of good French action movies on Netflix -- Lost Bullet is a good place to start.

As a discovery mechanism, I'd recommend following Vyce Victus[3], who writes reasonably well about action movies.

  [1] https://letterboxd.com/journal/direct-action-scott-adkins-dtv-film-evolution/
  [2] https://www.rogerebert.com/features/the-real-vulgar-auteurs-three-great-directors-of-direct-to-video-films
  [3] https://letterboxd.com/vycevictus/
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by htrp on Tuesday November 22, 2022 @12:06PM (#33708030)
i think a lot of the indie action has gone to the YouTube vfx studios
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by mcphage on Tuesday November 22, 2022 @02:46PM (#33710385)
Have you seen this year's "Everything, Everywhere, All at Once"? If not, I highly recommend it, it's amazing and bonkers and moving and clever. Just an utterly fantastic movie all around. The budget was $25 million—which is not small—but it still feels a lot more indie than most other movies.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by nomel on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:39PM (#33696183)
Are there any streaming services that distribute these? It would be a shame if they were lost to locality.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by thebradbain on Monday November 21, 2022 @05:57PM (#33699353)
They're definitely available for those who are interested-- Criterion is probably the most well known. But a lot of successful indie movies also get picked up by regular streaming services, too. They're just usually not heavily promoted (usually little to no marketing budget).
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by jtwaleson on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:31AM (#33689518)
To clarify: Does your friend mean that Tarantino’s early movies are also mass produced boredom or the opposite?
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by karp773 on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:36AM (#33689541)
Tarantino movies are anything but mass produced, really.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by jtwaleson on Monday November 21, 2022 @02:27AM (#33689840)
I agree but the sentence could be read either way. It’s early morning here and I was confused about the point that GP was making.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by lokimedes on Monday November 21, 2022 @02:22AM (#33689812)
No, he uses them as examples of how quality storytelling on a budget outcompetes the opposite. The problem with the “MBA thinking” is that it can’t quantify that quality beforehand, and makes the safer but more expensive bet on incremental development.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by sundvor on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:50AM (#33689621)
Yes.

I showed my 12 year old son Die Hard for the first time the other day.

He absolutely (...) loved it.

Unprompted, he talked about how good all the effects were - they didn't look like the bland CGI he is used to.

And he absolutely loved the movie. Zero political correctness. So incredibly liberating.

(A few scenes had me question the parenting choice of showing DH to a 12 year old, but it'd been at least a decade since I saw it last).

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by samwillis on Monday November 21, 2022 @02:04AM (#33689698)
I think watching DieHard with your kid is a good choice. The journey to adulthood isn't instantaneous at 18, parents should help to guide the kids there. Introducing them to adult cultural experiences at home, and then talking about it, is an awesome thing to do.

Plus DieHard is one of the best movies ever made!

(Have an 8th so not reached that stage myself yet)

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by sundvor on Monday November 21, 2022 @02:26AM (#33689838)
It was an amazing bonding time actually, so yes very good points. There were quite a few things to explain.

All the best for the journey ahead!

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by bbarnett on Monday November 21, 2022 @04:53AM (#33690784)
Back to the Future seems to resonate well with modern youth too.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by r00fus on Monday November 21, 2022 @10:47AM (#33693860)
Showed BTTF and BTTF2 to my 9 year old twins a few years ago. They loved the films. Not sure what they didn't get - even the concept of alternate timelines seemed fairly well absorbed.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by bombcar on Monday November 21, 2022 @01:56PM (#33696376)
The main things missed are probably all the various in-jokes, but that's not really important to the story.

Also "we'll travel to the FAR FUTURE" being when they were two years old has to be amusing (and sobering, to us olds).

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by Mountain_Skies on Wednesday November 23, 2022 @01:38AM (#33715952)
Even a lot of people who lived in that era don't get the Pepsi Free joke since it was a only know by that name for part of the 80s and overshadowed by the larger themes of the Cola Wars.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by ekianjo on Monday November 21, 2022 @03:40AM (#33690282)
it does not hurt that the first Die Hard is one of the best movies ever made.

Next watch Aliens (the second one) together and you are gold.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by thedrbrian on Monday November 21, 2022 @04:36AM (#33690658)
need the SE version though. Probably best to watch alien too. great example of a limited budget helping a film
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by ekianjo on Tuesday November 22, 2022 @09:07PM (#33714232)
Not the SE. The theatrical release. The SE is the worst director's cut I have ever seen. It gives away way too many things that are better kept secret from the viewer (all the Newt backstory is better left unseen).
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by sundvor on Monday November 21, 2022 @05:01PM (#33698660)
True! The Wikipedia entry makes for really good reading, so much went into its making: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_Hard

Aliens: My son suffered from night terrors in the not too distant past - I'd rather not reboot those just yet! :) (Would have to watch them in order, and the first is absolutely terrifying).

Will do them when he's 14.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by Donckele on Monday November 21, 2022 @03:50AM (#33690352)
I’m was on the fence with DH with my kids but your comments have changed my mind!
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by cykros on Thursday November 24, 2022 @09:51AM (#33731904)
Been there, done this, and yea, I sort of forgot why it had its rating. Not something I completely think was the worst mistake ever, but perhaps could have been better addressed with a pregame primer of what was in the movie.
Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by scarface74 on Monday November 21, 2022 @10:18AM (#33693484)
It’s often been posited that there are only seven plots that all stories are based on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots

That being said, I just saw Black Panther: Wakanda Forever. I thought it dealt with personal issues very well. She Hulk as much as it was derided, was also a different type of MCU show and it was self aware enough to know that Marvel had gotten too formulaic.

Re:Disney Shocker Bob Iger Back as CEO, Bob Chapek Out by jfengel on Monday November 21, 2022 @04:39PM (#33698349)
I find singling out Tarantino kind of odd here. He's an indie-style filmmaker who attracted a lot of attention and now makes big-budget movies with very big stars.

Which is great, for those who like his particular films. But there are literally thousands of other filmmakers making films every year who don't attract the kind of attention Tarantino does. His films aren't better than theirs -- he's just famous enough that we've all heard of him, and he continues to produce exactly the kinds of thing that you specifically like.

There are tons of things to dig into if you want. Netflix does a better job than most of surfacing small filmmakers (because they can get them cheaply). Film festivals have even more -- more than you can possibly watch in ten lifetimes. Most of it, of course, is dreck -- same as everything else.

I'm glad your friend likes Tarantino, but it just feels a bit like saying, "Gosh, I wish they made more stuff like Tarantino." What I want is an alternative to both Tarantino and the major studios -- and it exists. It just takes more effort.