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Re:Apple Q4/2022 by SoftTalker on Thursday October 27, 2022 @04:59PM (#33363959)
It's amazing. I sometimes wonder what value these people see in this stuff. I guess I just "think different" as nothing that Apple offers is compelling to me in the slightest way. Yet one can't deny the reality.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by peyton on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:07PM (#33364056)
Even Linus Torvalds uses a MacBook now. I just can’t find nicer machines out there.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by dmix on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:15PM (#33364150)
And considering you probably use your laptop 10x more often than your car spending $2 grand on the best around isn’t really much to ask. Especially if they last long which they tend to, especially do if you get AppleCare.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by dexterdog on Friday October 28, 2022 @12:06AM (#33367577)
AppleCare doesn't make it last longer. It's just an expensive insurance policy with often high deductibles. If you manage a fleet of Macs it's much cheaper to just keep extras on-hand since most AppleCare claims require two shipments to get it fixed and you need something to use during that time.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by dmix on Friday October 28, 2022 @12:34AM (#33367717)
I was talking about startup/personal usage from my own experience. Managing a fleet is a totally different usecase.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by dexterdog on Friday October 28, 2022 @03:38PM (#33376612)
Personal usage it is still an issue. If you have a problem you to send it back in most cases and be without a replacement. The best move is usually to buy a new one, time machine over to it, use it during the repair window, time machine back to your original after the repair and then return the new one. Still unless you are a total basket case with the care of your laptop you are better off saving your money.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by Gigachad on Thursday October 27, 2022 @09:08PM (#33366245)
This fact amused me when I found out. He did part of the work to port fedora to the M series. He also has stated a few times that he can’t stand fan noise. His home office has a threadripper desktop designed to be silent.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by alpaca128 on Thursday October 27, 2022 @09:33PM (#33366437)
The absence of fan noise is definitely noticeable. Going back to a PC with fans feels a bit like going back to CRT screens.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by aliqot on Friday October 28, 2022 @01:00AM (#33367847)
wait, you can run Fedora on m1?
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by Gigachad on Friday October 28, 2022 @02:45AM (#33368390)
It’s a pretty DIY thing but the asahi linux project has got Linux running on the M series chips and I believe Linus put together his own build of fedora using that kernel.

Supposedly it works for him although there are some features still unsupported like 3d graphics

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by aliqot on Friday October 28, 2022 @02:55AM (#33368433)
Asahi is pretty cool, any chance you've tried it on m2? I checked out the feature matrix. As I understand the CPU is doing the work currently and the GPU is unsupported, which leads to quite a bit of battery consumption. Very excited to try it nonetheless.

The m2 is a great piece of kit, I never realized how disruptive heat, vibration, and fan noise was until they were gone. I'm actively trying to put together a fanless desktop similar to the openbsd fanless desktop that is posted here from time to time. https://jcs.org/2021/07/19/desktop

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by fsociety on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:25PM (#33364264)
I have been researching for a Linux laptop to replace my M1 for a month now - mostly to get back on x86 for projects.

The non-M1 offerings are relatively terrible. You have to make some trade-off of battery life, thermals, display, keyboard, trackpad, ports, and reliability.

Lots of threads with people saying “well no one needs 2K screens at 120Hz, just get 1080p 60Hz”.. meanwhile those laptops cost >$2K.

The Starlabs Starfighter specs were announced, they look tempting but slow display and no TB4 on Ryzen processors.

The Dell XPS used to be a favorite of mine, but they are plagued with quality control issues.

Lenovo thermals are bad this generation, and my experience getting my work Lenovo repaired was terrible. Plus I’ve read about quality control issues.

I’ve decided to just use an x86 instance somewhere for the specific things, but no doubt Apple hit the magic sauce with the M1.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by e12e on Thursday October 27, 2022 @09:45PM (#33366512)
I ended up with an m2 macbook air for work - but I was hoping for a amd laptop with an oled screen like:

https://www.ultrabookreview.com/56563-asus-zenbook-s13-revie...

But despite reviews by spring/summer they never seemed to materialize as actual products available for purchase (note 5xx series, not previous generation 3xx) :/

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by procinct on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:11PM (#33364110)
For me, having a really fast laptop with a battery that lasts over a day is pretty great value compared to other laptops on the market.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by chrisseaton on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:04PM (#33364027)
Do you not think M1 is a compelling architecture? I think it’s technically brilliant and it has a positive impact on my life.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by SoftTalker on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:34PM (#33364352)
I mean, no.

For what I do with a laptop, a Chromebook is fine. And it's what I use.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by chrisseaton on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:38PM (#33364384)
> For what I do with a laptop

Are you possibly able to understand that other people do other things with their laptops and so see value in the technology?

Like I spend my time compiling things. A fast, low-energy processor is brilliant for me, because it lets me work faster and for longer. Can you not understand how I'd see value in that?

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by SoftTalker on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:54PM (#33364554)
Of course. But I don't see there being enough of those people to drive that kind of revenue to one company. Apple makes money like a fashion brand because that is what they are. They are very innovative and very good at doing it. I'm not trying to detract from their success. Just amazed that it works and has worked for so long.

But I don't own any Apple technology and can't think of a reason I would buy any.

Yes I do work in tech as a full-stack developer and sysadmin.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by chrisseaton on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:57PM (#33364593)
I don't think it's the mystery you do - they make money because they make the very best technology, that makes people who work with a wide range of workloads more effective, and so those people are willing to spend money with them.

If Apple is compiling my application 1.5x as fast and lets me work 1.5x as long without recharging, that saves me genuine time in the day, either to do more work, or to work on my hobbies, or to take more time out. That's really valuable to me. That's why I buy it, and why so many other people buy it. The cost is pretty insignificant considering it's where I earn all my money and do 50% or so of my hobbies.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by ac29 on Thursday October 27, 2022 @06:41PM (#33364972)
> If Apple is compiling my application 1.5x as fast

The M1 Max (the highest end chip available in a Mac laptop) is slower than competition from Intel and AMD, though. I'm not sure what its supposed to be 50% faster than, unless you are only comparing it to old Intel Macs.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by chrisseaton on Thursday October 27, 2022 @06:44PM (#33365013)
When it came out, the new MacBook Air had better single-core performance than every Intel Mac that ever existed. Not just the Airs - all of them ... on a lower power budget.

I'm sure you can get even faster single-core by brute-force burning power, but Apple were trying to do something more intelligent by balancing with power.

I think anyone seriously trying to claim they can't see any value in this is clearly just being silly.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by alwillis on Thursday October 27, 2022 @07:44PM (#33365599)
The M1 Max (the highest end chip available in a Mac laptop) is slower than competition from Intel and AMD, though.

Yeah, that’s not true; it doesn’t even make any sense. And certainly not performance per watt.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by KerrAvon on Thursday October 27, 2022 @08:41PM (#33366055)
You have to cherry-pick pretty brutally to make that statement true.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by shubb on Thursday October 27, 2022 @07:18PM (#33365353)
I think he's struggling with the question - why do so many people buy sports cars and SUVs when they drive slowly in a city.

Most people don't use a laptop much at home, preferring to consume media on a phone or smart TV. At work, most people use web applications and microsoft office and not much else.

So why do they need a fancy car? People like fancy cars. They have been buying them for years, and they aren't going to stop.

Now you are driving your jeep off road on your mountain ranch saying some people need an SUV and you are right, but you aren't rebutting what he is saying.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by chrisseaton on Thursday October 27, 2022 @07:24PM (#33365408)
Well they said:

> I sometimes wonder what value these people see in this stuff.

And you answered it yourself with your own example:

> Now you are driving your jeep off road on your mountain ranch saying some people need an SUV and you are right, but you aren't rebutting what he is saying.

That's an example of someone seeing value in it right?

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by selectodude on Thursday October 27, 2022 @08:27PM (#33365947)
I spend many hours per day on a computer and the M1 MacBook Pro just feels nice to use. The little things on it that make it a pleasure. The speakers sound good, the screen is excellent, the keyboard is fantastic, the battery lasts forever. I don't even do big bad compiling jobs or anything. I can afford it and that's why I got it. My iPhone is the same way. I'll spend $100 on a single dinner. Simple as that. And clearly, millions feel the same way. Not everything needs to be some sort of min-maxing exercise.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by christophilus on Friday October 28, 2022 @06:40AM (#33369720)
My dad switched from a Chromebook to an M1 air, and said something like: “It was like going from a Pinto to a Cadillac.”

He’s a very casual user. In part, his positive impression was due to me setting up Ad blockers on his MacBook. But it’s also due to the speed, screen, build quality, and the expectation of longevity.

Also, he can resell the Apple for a pretty good price if he wants to. His Chromebook is practically worthless on the used markets.

He feels like it was money very well spent. Apple’s numbers suggest there are many like him.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by seabriez on Thursday October 27, 2022 @05:27PM (#33364277)
M1 saved my marriage, and before that it saved my life as well. My mom loves M1 more than me.
Re:Apple Q4/2022 by soderfoo on Thursday October 27, 2022 @09:51PM (#33366562)
If you don't mind, I'd love if you could share a bit about how it helped your marriage.

Serendipitous solutions enthrall me, and broadens my thinking for when I'm faced with a condondrum.

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by ayewo on Friday October 28, 2022 @03:13AM (#33368528)
Text is a terrible medium for conveying the heavy dose of sarcasm in the GP :)

I assume you are also playing along :) ?

Re:Apple Q4/2022 by seabriez on Monday October 31, 2022 @01:23PM (#33409229)
After I bought M1 for my wife, she doesn't even need to be in the same state as me. It's truly a marriage saver.