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Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by ajross on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @11:23AM (#32663334)
This is a good example of how the discourse on this subject seems to have twisted itself around. No one serious ever thought "advertising" was a bad thing, not really. It was the potential abuse of the stored data people were worried about. But that's hard to explain, especially without good examples to which to point[1]. So fast forward a few years and... now it's "adtech" that's the enemy in isolation.

That seems unfortunate. And futile anyway, because the truth is that society as a whole actually wants advertising, in all its forms. We may find individual ads annoying but we still make our purchase decisions based on those ads and use those channels to hawk our own wares.

[1] The truth is that the big ad-driven internet companies have been, on the whole, actually fairly good stewards of this stuff. People don't trust them out of principle (or, just as often, tribalism), but at least so far the dystopia hasn't arrived.

Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by hedora on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @11:35AM (#32663565)
The big ad companies definitely have not been good stewards.

Here's an ongoing example that should get someone put in jail:

Pharmaceutical companies target ads for addictive drugs at the people that are most likely to become addicted to those drugs.

(For the victim of this that I know personally, it wasn't painkillers. As far as I know, there have been no repercussions for the manufacturer of the drug in question or the ad networks.)

See also: The millions of comments on any thread on HN that discusses SEO, dark patterns, cookie consent, or apps that interfere with advertising revenue streams.

Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by bagacrap on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @12:21PM (#32664447)
"won't somebody think of the drug addicts" is a novel (to me) argument for why all ads are bad
Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by hedora on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @02:56PM (#32666746)
In this case, the drug addicts are people with medical conditions that have been intentionally pushed to abuse their medication by the pharmaceutical company and Google, etc.

The argument is closer to "encouraging and profiting from illegal drug abuse is not 'responsible corporate stewardship'".

Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by topaz0 on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @11:30AM (#32663464)
That's not true -- many people think advertising as practiced is abusive in its own right.
Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by ajross on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @11:35AM (#32663556)
"Society as a whole" and "many people" are not the same entities. Again, there was a time when serious discourse about internet privacy focused on abuse potential and how to provide data security guarantees. Now it's just "ads bad", and I think that's a real problem with the discourse. To repeat, you can win fights over privacy (c.f. the GDPR, which while pretty flawed was a real and tangible win for users). You'll never win a fight over "ads". Ever.
Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by hedora on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @11:41AM (#32663691)
The vast majority of Americans are concerned about data collection:

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/11/15/key-takeawa...

There's no point in additional discourse on the issue. We may as well be arguing about whether cigarettes cure lung disease.

Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by blep_ on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @06:59PM (#32669439)
But "many people" and "no one serious", which is what you claimed, are also not the same.
Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by account42 on Thursday September 01, 2022 @07:07AM (#32674720)
> You'll never win a fight over "ads". Ever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cidade_Limpa

Even for cities that do not outright ban it, outdoor advertisement is heavily regulated in many parts of the world. Compare you typical european and asian big city street. Clearly many people do not like ads even without the tracking.

Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by user3939382 on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @11:16PM (#32671490)
My personal view is that most ads drive materialism and fulfillment through consumption which is evil. We also have research correlating familiarity and trust, so ads are there to brainwash you into trusting brands you have no reason to trust. If the ad business was boiled down to ads that were good for society it would be so small there’d be little conversation about it. The dark side of the ad business is what keeps everyone in it, the abusive user tracking is just the newest horrible dimension of it.

> People want ads

Says who? Sounds like rationalization from someone who works in the industry. I could be wrong.

Re:Things not available when someone blocks all cookies by JohnFen on Wednesday August 31, 2022 @04:56PM (#32668254)
> We may find individual ads annoying

I actually don't really mind ads as long as the volume of them isn't too great. But I greatly mind the tracking that comes along with them.

> at least so far the dystopia hasn't arrived

I disagree. From my point of view, we reached the dystopia stage quite a while ago.