It's not just "Murica first". If these were European companies, I'd jump ship very quickly to an iRobot competitor with a superior product, thanks to EU's data collection laws and USA's OK relationship with EU. But they aren't, they operate in a regime where questionable data collection is the norm and theft of IP is called "R&D".

Yes, Amazon will use iRobot to vacuum more data than dirt, but at least they are part of the US and EU laws. They provide gov services for a ton of US DoD/NASA infra! China could and would just thumb their nose at us without much concern.

I work in tech, often adjacent or on national projects or highly sensitive R&D. We have regular counter-espionage training.

You are concerned about domestic law enforcement learning about you. Both are valid threat models.

Let’s say it exfiltrates data that eventually allows a foreign competitor to build sophisticated metallurgy for turbines. It’s not like all foreign countries eagerly hire foreign talent, moreover it puts domestic expertise at risk as well as all the collateral subcontractors and suppliers… so, yeah, super metallurgy-guy's job may be secure (can get hired by the foreign competitor), even if the company collapses but not the jobs of 10,000s who work for suppliers, etc.

It seems your actual complaint is that if US Law Enforcement decides you are a target of interest, they would think to go to Amazon and Amazon's reputation is that they'd cooperate in handing over data, whereas the LE officers would neither bother to ask, nor expect cooperation from the Chinese companies.

The Chinese (or anyone) can certainly turn over their data to people who can arrest you, if they decide you are a target.

China and Amazon are both threats to privacy.

But so far I suppose the indigenous big tech spying apparatus has been effective enough to not need foreign operators help.

It is after all a personal decision and to each their own.

The bar for leveraging general information about a regular US citizen in the US by a company like Amazon or the US government is very, very low. One thing I see happening really soon (if not already) is such data being used by medical insurers to algorithmically decide your coverage and rates. Or for authorities to use to establish whatever pattern they want that can be damning even if circumstantial.

Looking around, all of this already happens in the US even without the help of an extra massive data collection net. From companies like Google or PayPal algorithmically locking you out of your critical digital identity, your paid services, your money with simply a boilerplate "sorry not sorry, don't let the door hit you on your way out", to authorities stealing all your neighbors' smart doorbell recordings to see what you have been doing and Stingraying the hell out of everyone on the off chance that they're going to catch the person they're looking for. Anything that makes that easier or opens up more avenues to do more of that is definitely going to be used (and abused) as such.

Well put.

I see the synergy with their Alexa, Echo etc.

I'm not sure if that is the answer to privacy concerns, but at least it is there.

When it comes to patents, I'm fine with that. Our system of patents has become a significant encumbrance to innovation and is causing US companies to fall behind.

I am not sure if Amazon is more trustworthy than that.

I guess you could say my threat model is not “the United States is my adversary”, and more that I appreciate some checks and balances being present on ‘local yokel’ police departments which are empirically not always doing the right thing (especially where oversight is low).

This is legal for the FBI. An illegal wiretap is not.

https://www.wired.com/story/amazon-ring-police-videos-securi...

I think that places in the US will start having to push for the right to turn off and disconnect (yeah, shades of Max Headroom here).

Responding to an inquiry from Sen. Ed Markey (D-Mass.), Amazon said in a letter dated July 1 that it has handed over private recordings to police 11 times in 2022. The company said it was complying with an "emergency request."

Don't you already have that in your pocket?

It's also user-serviceable.

Agree that the "data collection" aspect is muzzy, the same complaint would hold for any IC you attach to your network (hell, even the router itself).