News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by m12k on Saturday April 30, 2022 @04:35PM (#31219069)
A tech company in Bellevue Washington with a "shadowy and illusory "peer review" system" - this is Valve we're talking about, right? (fits his Twitter bio)
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by razh on Saturday April 30, 2022 @04:56PM (#31219258)
Yep, he posted a similar set of tweets back in 2018:

https://www.pcgamer.com/ex-valve-employee-describes-ruthless...

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by lol_what on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:04PM (#31220341)
keep in mind that he is literally the only one who talks about the company that way from everyone whose ever worked there (many, many have left for various reasons since).

I also can't help but not overlook that he's an UFO nut. can't trust info from someone who can warp reality in a way to see only what fits his own preconceived notions even if they fly in the face of basic facts.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by mattalex on Saturday April 30, 2022 @08:16PM (#31220825)
> keep in mind that he is literally the only one who talks about the company that way from everyone whose ever worked there (many, many have left for various reasons since).

That's not true.

There's been lots of criticism coming at Valve's management style over the years: There are many people who _hate_ it, but also many people who love it. It really depends on the type of person you are. If you really really dislike bureaucracy Valve's a great place to be, but also don't expect them to enact any quality-of-life systems: If your coworker wants you dead, then that's something you yourself have to deal with.

This is also why you see a lot of different opinions when looking through e.g. glassdoor: Some people that do the murdering love it there and thrive, but that system only works if people are there that can be murdered. Some people I know have described the atmosphere as "prison yard style": You trade rigid bureaucracy against a "you have to know who you have to know" bureaucracy. Richard Geldreich's account lines up pretty well to what I have heard about valve's emergent self-organization system.

A couple of years ago there was a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41XgkLKYuic that summarized the working environment.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by lawl on Saturday April 30, 2022 @09:43PM (#31221311)
> There's been lots of criticism coming at Valve's management style over the years: There are many people who _hate_ it, but also many people who love it.

Looking at it as a consumer, Valve didn't get anything released for many years, which imo would point at there in fact being a problem. Not necessarily what this guy is claming, but there did seem to be issues.

They have shipped HL:A and Steam Deck now, so maybe they've solved it or are solving it.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by 0xy on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:05AM (#31222341)
The measure of success for a corporation isn't number of products released, it's revenue/profit. Valve has higher revenue per employee than any other gaming company.

They have first mover advantage on a platform that's true, but even when competitors significantly undercut them they can't take any notable percentage of Steam market share. Epic is literally giving away free content every month and can't compete.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by ensan on Saturday April 30, 2022 @09:36PM (#31221275)
“I also can't help but not overlook that he's an UFO nut.”

Well, that’s your personal opinion but I’m not sure how his thoughts on UFOs discredits his view of the work culture at Valve. One can have metaphysical and spiritual beliefs and be an extraordinary scientist as well for example.

Many have left Valve but usually people in the relatively constrained game dev industry tend to be conservative in voicing their opinions if only for their future careers prospects.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by stickfigure on Saturday April 30, 2022 @10:55PM (#31221749)
> One can have metaphysical and spiritual beliefs and be an extraordinary scientist as well

The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong... but that's how you bet.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by throwaway787544 on Saturday April 30, 2022 @10:17PM (#31221507)
Or, because he's a UFO nut he's willing to call out things that seem crazy when it's socially unacceptable to do so
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by naikrovek on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:17AM (#31222666)
> he is literally the only one who talks about the company that way from everyone whose ever worked there

false. wrong, wrong, wrong.

he's the only one you know about, is all. he's not even the only one that has spoken publicly about it.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by Handytinge on Monday May 02, 2022 @11:47PM (#31244339)
Can you provide substance to your claim that other Valve employees have talked about a sabotaging culture due to bonuses?
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by ido on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:19AM (#31222406)
I've heard/read such reports about valve from various other people, including friends I trust saying so privately. He is an outlier in how vehement his criticism is but is hardly the only one that throws that criticism at Valve (keep in mind workers face massive disincentives to do so publicly).
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by newobj on Sunday May 01, 2022 @10:37PM (#31230856)
Well I have several friends who have worked there and no one has had anything positive to say about the culture.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by rasz on Saturday April 30, 2022 @11:18PM (#31221874)
Nah, many people spoke out about ruthless insider politic cliques and how they were at a mercy of invisible forces with "totally democratic" decisions about their work being made for them.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by rhexs on Saturday April 30, 2022 @06:14PM (#31219922)
Does Valve really have 7 figure bonuses? That's quite impressive if so. Wonder what it would take to get that -- do you have to launch/invent a new, successful microtransaction store? Can't imagine it's easy based on that twitter thread.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by LAC-Tech on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:30PM (#31220508)
Wonder what it would take to get that -- do you have to launch/invent a new, successful microtransaction store?

You have to make a really cool looking hat for Team Fortress 2.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by usednet on Saturday April 30, 2022 @08:22PM (#31220856)
I wish Valve still cared about Team Fortress 2. Unfortunately their terrible work distribution system has lead to the complete abandonment of many of their most popular franchises.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by Cyph0n on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:44PM (#31220605)
You mean “choose from one of the really cool hats made by the community and add it to the game”.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by exdsq on Saturday April 30, 2022 @04:38PM (#31219100)
Just coming to say that - he's not the best at keeping things secret lol.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by daenz on Saturday April 30, 2022 @04:59PM (#31219299)
There's a difference between keeping a secret, and avoiding legal trouble by not specifically naming an employer.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by nindalf on Saturday April 30, 2022 @05:07PM (#31219371)
Is Valve really going to file a lawsuit against him and argue in court whether this actually happened or not? They're not. Do they even have grounds to file a lawsuit? Likely not, American courts aren't that sympathetic to libel claims.

But let's assume for a minute that what you're saying has some merit. Maybe Valve does have grounds to sue. And maybe they're interested in suing. In that case, is this lousy attempt at being coy helpful? It's clear from his bio that he's only worked at one such company. So it's abundantly clear to everyone who he's working for.

In reality, this pattern ("worked for a large software-advertising company with a double O in it's name") is fucking annoying. It's designed to make the reader curious and more likely to read the rest of what's written. It's similar to clickbait in that sense. And I wish to God it would stop. I'd request people to please just name names, or keep it yourself.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by devwastaken on Saturday April 30, 2022 @05:12PM (#31219417)
American civil system is not based on merit or reason. Anyone can file for any reason, any decent lawyer can make some claims that will require you to argue against, else they be automatically defaulted to true and you lose. It doesn't matter if the big corp wins or not, the toll it takes on you is threat enough.

This isn't about civil disputes anyways. No employer wants to see a prospective new hire trash talking their previous company. Doesn't matter if it's deserved or not, it's seen as a liability.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by daniel-cussen on Saturday April 30, 2022 @06:10PM (#31219888)
Hahaha yeah you know what start with this exact preamble next time you're a plaintiff telling the judge why you deserve money. "The American civil system is not based on merit or reason." I would say it is in fact based on both of those, but more than anything on judgment.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by 21723 on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:19PM (#31220436)
Whether the US civil system itself is based on merit or reason, the problem is that employers have all the resources and can play parliamentary procedure ad nauseam--even in the rare cases where the good guys win, they'll file appeals and motions while refusing to pay the judgment. Not to mention, they know which judges can be corrupted, and they also have PR resources and will rape the shit out of anyone who even mildly embarrasses them.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by daniel-cussen on Saturday April 30, 2022 @10:02PM (#31221420)
I was against you up until the "rape the shit out of...". That got real real, real fast. It is by all means the intention.[1] Almost happened to me in a setting that wasn't employment, I had to do all these defensive maneuvers like getting out of America to make sure I got a trial[2]. I am not a judge of any court, to a small extent just the court of public places, but I find merit and solid reasoning in your case.

[1] You know what, one employer definitely did that, apparently bribed my lawyer to get them to drop the case, got that vibe from the lawyer. Yeah, I thought I could argue with you at the very beginning, but no longer.

[2] Extradition from a country of which you are a citizen requires a real trial, like that takes years, America will let me go to prison without trial but Chile will not let America do that without any kind of extradition trial at all. A lawyer congratulated me on this defensive maneuver.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by Qem on Sunday May 01, 2022 @08:51AM (#31224625)
I think a textbook example of that is what Chevron did to Steven Donziger.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by 21723 on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:17PM (#31220425)
Frivolous litigation happens but is fairly rare but, as you said, nothing in this country prevents potential employers from anally raping candidates for "bad-mouthing" prior companies. In the US, that's a legally defensible reason to fuck someone over, even if what was said about the ex-employer was truthful.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by rhexs on Saturday April 30, 2022 @06:11PM (#31219894)
American companies always have bored lawyers on staff, and lawsuits are just day-to-day activities for them. Suing costs the company virtually nothing, while defending against that suit as a private party can be ruinously expensive. The company can almost always afford better PR than you can, and relying or hoping your case going viral and the company backing off due to negative PR isn't going to help you sleep at night.

It isn't fair, but that's how it is. Don't poke the bear anymore than you have to. All you have to do is personally anger one executive and they can go after you.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by YokoZar on Saturday April 30, 2022 @08:48PM (#31220988)
Retaliating against employees for discussing their working conditions is in fact enormously legally risky for a company. Doubly-so when doing it via SLAPP lawsuits. Why on earth would Valve take the risk?
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by chii on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:42AM (#31222511)
> Why on earth would Valve take the risk?

yes, exactly. Esp. if he is the only one talking about it this way publicly. If it's truly awful, employees will vote with their wallets and quit.

And if valve wins the law suit, what reward would they have gained, other than stopping him from saying what he has already said (which cannot be taken back). There might be punitive damages to be paid, but it's not like the corporation is going to make money from doing so.

And in fact, making a law suit would legitimize the claims!

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by moron4hire on Saturday April 30, 2022 @05:20PM (#31219477)
It's very likely that Valve is a major client of his current business. Geldreich builds and licenses a texture compression system that can supposedly outperform anything else on the market.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by filoleg on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:35PM (#31220543)
> Is Valve really going to file a lawsuit against him and argue in court whether this actually happened or not?

They most likely won't, you are correct. But it just simply doesn't seem to be worth the trouble on the off-chance that they will decide to do it.

The whole thing is just a situation where you risk a lot (even if the chance of that risk materializing is very small), but you aren't really gaining anything by taking the risk. What's the point of taking the risk of naming the company, if you can tell the entire story just as fine without naming them and reducing the risk to zero?

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by nindalf on Saturday April 30, 2022 @11:12PM (#31221840)
> if you can tell the entire story just as fine without naming them and reducing the risk to zero?

That’s my point. He’s not reducing shit. We all know exactly who he’s talking about. All he’s done is curiosity baited us into reading this.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by CPLX on Saturday April 30, 2022 @05:40PM (#31219646)
Or just maintaining plausible deniability.

I would certainly have a different opinion about someone saying negative things about me in anonymous generic terms that people paying attention could figure out, vs using my name and posting direct criticism. As would most people I think.

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by sundvor on Saturday April 30, 2022 @06:44PM (#31220181)
Heard that's not necessarily enough, "not specifically naming".
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by daenz on Saturday April 30, 2022 @06:54PM (#31220252)
IANAL but would love a lawyer to chime in. My understanding was that you could indeed get in trouble if you don't cast enough ambiguity around the identity of the person/company you are trashing, but casting some ambiguity is better than none.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by Rebelgecko on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:17PM (#31220426)
I am also not a lawyer, but I've always heard that telling the truth is a bulletproof defense in libel/slander/defamation situations. Some employment contracts have non-disparagement clauses but I think they're fairly rare (kind of a red flag) and at least where I live they can't prevent you from truthful griping about working conditions
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by EE84M3i on Saturday April 30, 2022 @08:55PM (#31221040)
As I understand it, this might be true in America, but in Japan, "it's the truth" isn't a defense against libel.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by aetherson on Saturday April 30, 2022 @09:41PM (#31221297)
In the United States, truth is an absolute defense against libel. You are correct that it is not in other countries, but this is someone in America (probably an American) talking about an American company.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by daenz on Saturday April 30, 2022 @09:51PM (#31221352)
That's wild. How does that work out legally? A company can sue an employee for telling a damaging (but uncontested) truth?
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by ghaff on Sunday May 01, 2022 @09:28AM (#31224856)
It works if the law says that reputational damage trumps the fact that the statement causing the damage is true--or can't be proven to be false. Although the UK has made some changes in recent years, it's probably the best example in the West of a country where truth isn't necessarily a defense against a libel suit. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_defamation_law (And somewhat ironically given that US law has its roots in English common law, the US swings heavily on the side of free speech.)
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by OJFord on Saturday April 30, 2022 @07:23PM (#31220456)
Bio also says 'FBI witness'.. that's just a completely meaningless random fact isn't it? 'Happened to witness some crime, interviewed by FBI', why's that in a Twitter bio?

(Unless it means 'expert witness' in court, in which case 'and the FBI were involved' is the weird bit.)

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by stickfigure on Saturday April 30, 2022 @10:18PM (#31221513)
We're talking about a twitter bio, right? Sounds like you're expecting linkedin.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by OJFord on Sunday May 01, 2022 @08:18AM (#31224421)
No, just.. if you want to list stuff like that then I'm expecting it to make some sort of sense? Unless you're saying it's a joke? (I don't really get it.)
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by ffhhj on Saturday April 30, 2022 @06:55PM (#31220259)
Yeah, around a decade ago this also made the news:

"Valve fires Jeri Ellsworth, who was developing Steam Box game controllers"

Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by charcircuit on Saturday April 30, 2022 @08:05PM (#31220754)
She was working on AR which she was able to take after she was fired and form TiltFive https://www.tiltfive.com/
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by secondcoming on Saturday April 30, 2022 @05:33PM (#31219587)
I thought it might have been why the Windows UI is such a mess.
Re:At one company I worked at only one thing mattered: the y... by m12k on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:08AM (#31222628)
Yeah, I've heard similar complaints about dysfunctionality regarding Microsoft's "stack ranking" system that they had under Balmer, where the best engineers would actively avoid working in the same teams, to avoid being ranked in the same stack. But afaik they didn't have that nebulous peer review system - I've only heard about that at Valve.