Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by xg15 on Monday February 14, 2022 @04:17AM
(#30329946)
> The other alternative would be for Meta to change its business processes to comply with the relevant orders from the European Court and the General Data Protection Regulation of not sharing EU citizen data with a US entity.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't one reason this thing is such a headache that, right now, there is no way for US companies to do this?
Because US companies are subject to the CLOUD act, they can be ordered to hand over user data to US agencies, whenever this data is under the company's control. It's irrelevant if the data center is located in Europe, the US or anywhere else, as long as the US company has control over it.
If Facebook could solve this issue by simply doing their behaviour targeting inside EU datacenters, I doubt they would write this down even as a risk, let alone as strange veiled threats.
That was just my understanding of the whole issue, which might be wrong though.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by olodus on Monday February 14, 2022 @11:11AM
(#30333720)
Sorry I might not be understanding. Your suggestion seems more reasonable, but I don't understand how other large companies wouldn't be in the same situation as FB if this would be the case. Is FB just the first one to notice?
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by mlindner on Monday February 14, 2022 @02:00AM
(#30329057)
I wouldn't say it's "waning". This is more an over-estimation of their own self-importance by specifically Facebook. They're a net negative on society. If they left Europe I'm sure most European leaders would say "please do, and thank you".
If for example Microsoft would have said the same thing the reaction would have been very different.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by ls15 on Monday February 14, 2022 @02:19AM
(#30329151)
As a European: I never had a Facebook account, yet they seem to have my data (ilegally). I can't find out without sending them more data. Why are these people still walking free?
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by southerntofu on Monday February 14, 2022 @07:27AM
(#30331187)
If you as an individual made an app that collected all contact information from people who installed it, you'd be in jail by now. Facebook (and others) have done that for years and are walking free (and rich, at that!).
This is the morals of the capitalist system: if you're already rich or powerful, you can do pretty much anything to the rest of us.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by b-mmxx on Monday February 14, 2022 @09:54AM
(#30332680)
“Anacharsis, accordingly, on learning what Solon was about, laughed at him for thinking that he could check the injustice and rapacity of the citizens by written laws, which were just like spiders' webs; they would hold the weak and delicate who might be caught in their meshes, but would be torn in pieces by the rich and powerful.” - Plutarch. Plutarch's Lives [0].
I don't understand why this misinformation is spreading so much. They have clearly stated that they are not leaving or threatening to leave. Don't buy into click bait articles.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by alpaca128 on Monday February 14, 2022 @04:36AM
(#30330077)
You seem to have a weird definition of suicide, considering the economy is still alive and well.
Meanwhile there's no sign that any tech giant will ever be more than a short blip in our history. Not sure why we should sacrifice our privacy so a shameless parasite lives a few years longer.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by bluecalm on Monday February 14, 2022 @05:55AM
(#30330548)
A lot of businesses rely on Facebook/Instagram for marketing, keeping in touch with customers etc. Those disappearing would kill them pretty quickly. Even if they start making their own self hosted websites no one will find them (and it will incur costs and it will be of shitty quality).
Facebook leaving is a huge threat. I think you are underestimating how big a role it (or its other services) play in people's lives. If FB/Messanger/Instagram/Whatsapp disappear today in some European countries and the government's explanation was "we didn't manage to make an deal" I don't think that government would last for much longer.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by bluecalm on Monday February 14, 2022 @10:50AM
(#30333442)
There is just way more business now. Those businesses choose to host their website, information and communication with customers on FB/Instagram. They think it's profitable for them. It's a very arrogant view to think they are all wrong.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by aussiegreenie on Monday February 14, 2022 @05:29PM
(#30339282)
> It's a very arrogant view to think they are all wrong.
It is also correct. Every European company using FB/IG are acting illegally. It is only illegal if you get caught. So, just like speeding or overloading your truck using FB gives you an advantage until you are caught.
Re:Meta's threat to leave Europe hints at waning big tech in...
by olodus on Monday February 14, 2022 @11:15AM
(#30333764)
True,it will probably have an economic impact. Still, there are several ad options/platforms still available (Google, Tiktok,...) so one would hope that a sizeable amount of the businesses would be able to move their ad campaigns to those instead.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't one reason this thing is such a headache that, right now, there is no way for US companies to do this?
Because US companies are subject to the CLOUD act, they can be ordered to hand over user data to US agencies, whenever this data is under the company's control. It's irrelevant if the data center is located in Europe, the US or anywhere else, as long as the US company has control over it.
If Facebook could solve this issue by simply doing their behaviour targeting inside EU datacenters, I doubt they would write this down even as a risk, let alone as strange veiled threats.
That was just my understanding of the whole issue, which might be wrong though.
Good question. My understanding was that they are - hence the recent headlines about GA being illegal.
If for example Microsoft would have said the same thing the reaction would have been very different.
This is the morals of the capitalist system: if you're already rich or powerful, you can do pretty much anything to the rest of us.
[0]: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:20...
I don't understand why this misinformation is spreading so much. They have clearly stated that they are not leaving or threatening to leave. Don't buy into click bait articles.
Don't get me wrong, I don't care for FB's product, but the constant coverage is a bit pathetic.
FB are required to disclose all sorts of low probability risks to investors.
No one wants to live in a museum.
Meanwhile there's no sign that any tech giant will ever be more than a short blip in our history. Not sure why we should sacrifice our privacy so a shameless parasite lives a few years longer.
Foreign companies are:
1) Taking away valuable citizens data
2) Taking away ad money
3) Not paying taxes
If anything it's an economic suicide to support the status quo.
Facebook leaving is a huge threat. I think you are underestimating how big a role it (or its other services) play in people's lives. If FB/Messanger/Instagram/Whatsapp disappear today in some European countries and the government's explanation was "we didn't manage to make an deal" I don't think that government would last for much longer.
It is also correct. Every European company using FB/IG are acting illegally. It is only illegal if you get caught. So, just like speeding or overloading your truck using FB gives you an advantage until you are caught.
The world would be fine without Facebook, other people will step in to fill the void.