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Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by rapnie on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @04:46AM (#29482812)
See also this discussion when FerretDB was still called MangoDB: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29071623
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by Narretz on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @08:22AM (#29484378)
That was a good name, but too close to MongoDB. FerretDB does seem to follow the rule that databases need to have terrible names.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by peterfarkas on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @09:14AM (#29484894)
We indeed had a hard time finding a good name, especially with the situation around domain names nowadays. An infinite amount of time can be spent on these things. However, we decided that we would rather focus on things which are more likely to determine the overall success of FerretDB - the vision and the execution. We quite like ferrets, though!
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by patpending on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @09:45AM (#29485278)
The idiom "ferret away" means to store something in a secret place, and the idiom "ferret out" means to find something by careful searching. Seems like a pretty good name for a database.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by peterfarkas on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @09:57AM (#29485455)
This is exactly why we considered the name after all.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by PeterZaitsev on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @09:55AM (#29485423)
Also Ferrets are smart and nimble and make great pets :)
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by pmdulaney on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @12:47PM (#29487910)
But in California they are illegal to own without a permit.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by cmrdporcupine on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @09:54AM (#29485408)
Fun little critters. They're cute, but stink even with their scent glands removed. Vicious even when domesticated, too. Our 60lb Rhodesian Ridgeback cross was scared of ours, while it tried to "play" with her. Bloodthirsty. One day my brother's pet ferret escaped from the house and went over to the neighbours garage and killed 8 or 9 kittens with a bite to the back of the neck and then just left them. Eventually it escaped one last time... when an owl caught it. Cycle of life.

How's that for off topic?!

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by PeterZaitsev on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @09:58AM (#29485476)
Databases always stink There is no way around it! So why not to embrace it ? :)
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by SilasX on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @11:46AM (#29487038)
At least it’s better than cockroach.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by aigo on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @10:58AM (#29486312)
Don't forget clients too - looking at you DBeaver
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by danielvaughn on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @10:08AM (#29485614)
Now we have FerretDB, CockroachDB. I wonder what animal they'll name a DB after next.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by jamil7 on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @11:37AM (#29486889)
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by rapnie on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @01:54PM (#29488772)
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by codetrotter on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @08:55AM (#29484689)
MongoDB is an even more terrible name in my country. I know they named it that because it’s humongous but in my country, “mongo” is a derogatory term that is equally offensive as calling someone a retard and is derived from the word “mongolid”.

I remember when I grew up we used to call each other mongo as a joke and not meaning anything bad about it, but then on one occasion a teacher overheard us and told us that she was sad to hear people use the word that way because she had a grandchild with Down’s syndrome. I think this was one of the first times I learned that words said to one person can be hurtful to someone else even if they were not the person you said it to. And after that I’ve tried to be more conscious about which words I use in public.

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by Minor49er on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @02:14PM (#29489020)
Frankly, I'd be less offended by someone calling me a retard than I would if someone suggested that I use MongoDB
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by pmdulaney on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @02:48PM (#29489508)
Dang, what a quick wit!
[dead]
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by zxcvbn4038 on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @01:02PM (#29488120)
Every time I hear “mongodb” I think of that guy from Blazing Saddles that punches horses.

My employer thought it would be cheaper to use Mongodb then hiring people who understood SQL - then free turned into a subscription, and a support plan got added in, now it’s a six figure expense per year. Plus it turns out that developers who don’t understand SQL are really unbelievably bad at everything else database related, so all the Mongodb queries end up being linear scans, and the apps fall over when the dataset grows beyond core memory size - because the app developers like to read the entire collection into ram then iterate through manually and pick the records they want.

It’s a huge rewrite when they can no longer do that.

[dead]
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by dangerbird2 on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @10:30AM (#29485924)
"spaz" is indeed short for "spastic", but it's not typically seen as an ableist slur like it is in the UK. Presumably, the word had been out of use as a term for people with cerebral palsy long enough in the US that it passed through the "Euphemism treadmill"[1], and is no longer associated with actual disability (similar to "imbecile" or "moron").

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euphemism#Lifespan

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by hnbad on Friday December 10, 2021 @07:13AM (#29508969)
BTW I find it telling, that the entire thread has been flagged and killed. If you tell someone in Germany unfamiliar with the NoSQL space that you plan on using "MongoDB" they'll look at you like you said you plan to use "R*tardDB".

It's a genuine real-life problem and the general category of problems is especially well-known in the marketing space. It's probably more widely known in Europe than the US (where English-only is historically the norm) but there are a few examples that occasionally get brought up on HN (e.g. the island "Laputa" being named differently in Spanish editions of works featuring it, although the unfortunate implication possibly being intentional in that case).

Outside the database space there's also Wix, who after problems getting traction in Germany tried to "own" the implication of their name by using "Ich wixe" ("I jerk off" but misspelled) or "Ich bin ein Wixer" ("I'm a wanker" but misspelled) in their German ads. I don't see any company being able to pull this off with a name that sounds like an ableist slur though.

I'm not saying Americans are (intentionally) ableist when they say "spaz" but it's definitely a word that can provoke very different reactions when used in an international context. I don't know enough about the etymology to say whether it's like "fanny" (which refers to two very different body parts depending on which country you're from) or "c*nt" (which pretty much means the same thing regardless of where you're from but can either be a friendly taunt or extreme insult because of cultural differences) but it's certainly something to be aware of.

This isn't the kind of problem you'd want to have with the name of your product is all I'm saying. I guess I'm just happy FerretDB didn't go with SpazDB.

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by Medox on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @10:52AM (#29486217)
Explaining the Throttle option to my german colleagues is sometimes awkwardly funny (in german trottel = stupid)
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by pmdulaney on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @12:44PM (#29487877)
Is "th" pronounced like a "t" in German? (Or is the German "t" pronounced like the English "th"?)
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by hnbad on Friday December 10, 2021 @07:20AM (#29509009)
German doesn't have a "th" sound (okay, technically it's more correct to say German has neither of the two "th" sounds as this is an important difference when pointing out that English only has one of the two German "ch" sounds and only in some variants of English and almost exclusively in Scottish words but I digress).

But based on my experience it's a coin toss whether German speakers who don't know enough English to be able to make an attempt at pronouncing it will go for "trottel" or "srottel" in that case, with the latter being even more likely if they go by ear rather than reading the word spelled out.

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by scns on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @02:16PM (#29489066)
The first.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by dotancohen on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @01:03PM (#29488127)

  > “mongo” is a derogatory term that is equally offensive as calling someone a retard
Git and the Gimp are just as bad in English.
Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by hnbad on Friday December 10, 2021 @08:29AM (#29509580)
Those aren't really comparable, though. "Git" is just an insult:

> git, noun. British Slang. a foolish or contemptible person.

"Gimp" can be an ableist slur for someone with a walking impairment in US and Canadian English but also to someone engaging in BDSM (hence "gimp suit"). The GIMP project has also seen a fork in part due to conflicting opinions about whether the name should be changed (tho I think more people were aware of the BDSM meaning and felt uncomfortable with having sexual innuendos in professional software).

"Mongo" (in German, and presumably Dutch also, anyway) specifically is used to mock cognitive disability and is derived from the historical medical term "mongoloid" which in itself was already racist. Unlike git and GIMP it's also extremely likely none of the people involved in picking the name were aware of its unfortunate meaning since the name sounds innocuous in English.

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by chrisseaton on Friday December 10, 2021 @07:14PM (#29517097)
> "Gimp" can be an ableist slur for someone with a walking impairment in US and Canadian English but also to someone engaging in BDSM (hence "gimp suit").

The sexual term's etymology is the ableist slur. The gimp suit gimps you. It's the same thing.

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by hnbad on Monday December 13, 2021 @09:22AM (#29539784)
Sure but that's one layer removed. The adjective/verb is ableist, the noun refers to a specific sexual fetish but derives from the former, the product name is (in my experience) mostly understood as a reference to the noun. So ableism -> sexual reference -> product name.

Whereas in countries where "mongo" or some version thereof is a slur, for MongoDB it's racism -> ableism -> product name or even racism + ableism -> product name

The difference is subtle but IMO what makes it worse is that while "gimping" is a dismissive reference to disability, "mongo" is a slur directly mocking a person with a (real or alleged) disability. As I said, you wouldn't want to call your product "Ret*rdDB" either.

But I think arguing over which is worse misses the point: it's a good idea to check for foreign language implications when picking a name and you should avoid relying on juvenile puns.

Re:FerretDB: A truly open-source MongoDB alternative by philote on Wednesday December 08, 2021 @11:44AM (#29486997)
Hah, I wasn't taking FerretDB seriously because it mentioned it was previously MangoDB. I was only familiar with https://github.com/dcramer/mangodb.