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Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by sreeramb93 on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:09PM (#28846673)
How do two engineers affect an entire company project?
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by ashtonkem on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:32PM (#28846824)
I have no insider knowledge, but my guess is that nobody wants to work on this project. Best to avoid any project that might get you hauled in front of the senate, which has already happened to Libra.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by davidgerard on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @03:30AM (#28849311)
Libra is a zombie project. It was effectively killed as of the July 2019 House and Senate hearings; it's just taken years to stop twitching.

A pile of Libra/Diem/Novi people have left. I think it's less fear of being hauled up in front of the Senate, and just being sick of spending their lives in development hell. Even the original instigator of Libra, Morgan Beller, left in late 2020.

The last attempt to get permission to do Diem was earlier this year, when they wanted to do a US dollar stablecoin with an actual bank (Silvergate) holding the backing. But a consumer stablecoin that's meant to serve as money in society was still too much to allow, particularly from Facebook. So Novi is now scouting around for other stablecoins to use in its wallet software.

This is assuming a significant number of users of Facebook-owned apps want to use Facebook for payments, which is unclear. Messenger Pay/Facebook Pay has existed since 2015 and still has negligible volume as a percentage of the FB userbase.

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by asdfman123 on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @10:00PM (#28847397)
Hell, dude. That's hard to imagine. Maybe it's hard for them to recruit world leading experts on crypto, but Facebook still has a ton of top talent and a ton of hungry people willing to make a name for themselves within the company.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by hnbad on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @04:30AM (#28849689)
Sure but justifying working for Facebook or in crypto currencies to yourself takes enough cognitive dissonance, I can't imagine the lengths you have to got to to justify working on Facebook's crypto currency projects.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by asdfman123 on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @12:31PM (#28854266)
It's easy if you actually believe the libertarian crypto gospel like many do.

Or just believe that technology is inevitable, and you might as well be the one building it.

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by rabuse on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @02:08PM (#28855428)
This mindset is not as abundant as the older days, as a lot of us developers are now becoming more "morally" aware of how our code affects society on international scales.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by asdfman123 on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @02:37PM (#28855730)
Yeah, but my point is not everyone thinks the same.

You might think that way, and consciousness about the greater effects of technology on the world are coming into focus, but there are still plenty of people who don't see it that way at all. Or they don't care so much and just want a paycheck.

It's harder to get young liberals in oil, finance and defense, yet those industries still have plenty of talented people working for them.

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by nuclearnice1 on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @09:16PM (#28847127)
Is some 2 years at Facebook developer going to end up in front of the senate?

Well, possible, I guess. It could be exciting!

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by AlbertCory on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @09:35PM (#28847234)
Maybe not as "a 2-year developer" but if they make VP of Novi, then yeah, they'd better lawyer up.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by ashtonkem on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @09:26PM (#28847181)
Theoretically it’s possible! But unlikely, I’ll admit.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by programmarchy on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:11PM (#28846685)
Crypto talent is scarce, for one. And the intersection of crypto developers who would work at Facebook is vanishingly small.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by bobsil1 on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:26PM (#28846789)
Privacy freak ∩ surveillance biz model
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by sirclueless on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @12:02AM (#28848104)
These things really aren't so far apart.

                    --> solve the problem
                  /
    see a problem
                  \
                    --> exploit the problem
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by post_from_work on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @01:26AM (#28848529)
Learn the tactics, techniques, and procedures employed by large corporate/state surveillance adversaries, identify gaps in their capabilities, secure your PERSONAL privacy based on your insider knowledge, anonymously distribute similar protection methods to the privacy-conscious, and get paid to do it? Sounds like a no-brainer to me...
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by stavros on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @09:22PM (#28847163)
Well this hits the nail on the head...
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by HarryHirsch on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:20PM (#28846742)
It's supposed to be the technology of the future that everyone uses. It's not supposed to be like direct methods in crystallography, which are understood by a dozen people, of which half are over 50 years old.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by rabuse on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:38PM (#28846861)
It's not like that by design. It's still very niche from a dev perspective, and constantly evolving with so many different protocols released on the regular (most are shit), but you still have to sift through it to stay in the "know".
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by 1vuio0pswjnm7 on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @03:59AM (#28849514)
By comparison, crypto really just isn't that useful or interesting. What will humanity learn from crypto.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by seibelj on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:25PM (#28846777)
Right but a bunch of nobodies on HN actively disparage the entire sector for whatever reason, which requires a pretty deep knowledge that the average REST slinger doesn’t possess, so the market is tight for competent devs let alone top-tier.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by bostonsre on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @11:11PM (#28847836)
Yea, it's disparaged constantly for no good reason and if you know about crypto you are a God and everyone else is shit.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by knownjorbist on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @11:52PM (#28848047)
Could be somewhere in-between. There are very intelligent people focusing on the crypto, defi, decentralization and "metaverse" space. It's colloquially referred to as web3, but after "Web 2.0" people here have skepticism of such a term. Why would they be spending their time on this? Are they all just, as another poster said, "ideologically delusional and/or pathologically greedy"?
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by nucleogenesis on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:37PM (#28846859)
> for whatever reason

Gimme a break

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by vmception on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @09:52PM (#28847346)
and also 2 years at a FAANG is normal and non-news
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by rising-sky on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @10:01PM (#28847404)
This article is a bit sensational / hyperbole, Morgan Beller, who's is mentioned as instrumental also left the team a while ago and it was still moving along, albeit slowed due to external pressures
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by random314 on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @01:46AM (#28848620)
They look like junior engineers from LinkedIn profiles. I don't think this matters to Facebook.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by bryanrasmussen on Wednesday October 13, 2021 @03:58AM (#28849510)
well if X10 engineers exist, and these two are them, it's like 20 engineers just left.

Or also if the project has 10 engineers, and the first is the lead who knows everything and the second one is the one who knows deeply about some real important dependency it could suck - losing 20% of your engineers on a project is bad enough, but the two most important ones comprising that 20% could derail a project.

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by ffhhj on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:19PM (#28846733)
Crypto is the new COBOL.
Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by pavlov on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @08:49PM (#28846939)
At least COBOL in its time was a major breakthrough that resulted in immediate productivity improvements.

Crypto is more like a honeypot for the incompetent, ideologically delusional and/or pathologically greedy. (Which explains why certain FB executives are still running this doomed Libra/Diem/whatever project. They might do more harm somewhere else.)

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by Animats on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @11:33PM (#28847952)
I'm not impressed with the crypto crowd. I've read too many "white papers" full of bullshit. In the newer rounds, most of the creativity is applied to escaping fraud charges. If the DAO controlled by the governance token controls the payments to the people behind the scheme, and they give up control of the governance token, then those people are just subcontractors of the DAO. So they're not responsible for fraud losses, right?

All you really need to secure a blockchain is a number of parties who are not likely to collude. The original idea was huge numbers of miners using spare CPU time. There's a famous picture of the top 5 Bitcoin mine owners in China, who together had well over 51% of the hash power, all on the same stage, talking about what they, as a group, intended to do. That was not the plan.

The "smart contract" system was botched. Smart contracts should have been something like decision tables, which can be checked exhaustively. But no, they had to put in a bytecode interpreter, become Turing complete, and dig themselves into an expensively bug-ridden hole.

Incidentally, I suspect that the SEC's hammer is about to come down on the "metaverse" NFT people. Back in 2018, the SEC brought the hammer down on the ICO people, by prosecuting the worst of the worst and sending the rest of them letters saying "please explain to them why this isn't a security offering". Suddenly most of the ICOs disappeared.

What we're seeing now are schemes where people are selling NFTs which represent virtual land in virtual worlds not yet built. I've seen three of those in the last week. That's a security offering under the Howey test. If you sell an NFT for something that already exists, that's one thing. If you use NFT sales to fund the creation of something, you're selling shares in a common enterprise run by someone else. That's a security.

This metaverse stuff irks me because I'm into virtual world technology, and the make-money-fast crowd is giving metaverses a bad name by not actually building good virtual worlds. (Go visit Decentraland, which, by the way, only has 200-300 concurrent users. It makes Facebook Horizon look good.) Or, in too many case, building anything at all beyond the money-collection NFT system.

Re:Facebook's Novi wallet hits trouble as two top engineers ... by knownjorbist on Tuesday October 12, 2021 @11:46PM (#28848019)
How on earth is this a take on HN, of all places? I have a feeling people with this opinion stopped paying attention in 2017.