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Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by gjsman-1000 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:08PM (#27619632)
If anything, Amazon knows this will really incentivize updating your Android app on the Amazon App Store, or bringing it there if you haven't.

And that's good for us because, should the Amazon App Store become more viable for manufacturers, Google might find themselves increasingly losing control of Android, and increasingly forced to make the Play Store more competitive.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by kumarvvr on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:33PM (#27619997)
This is an absolute win-win for Microsoft and Amazon.

Microsoft gets Android Apps, Amazon expands its app store and Google is shunted out of the Microsoft eco-system.

I see this as an absolute brilliant thing to happen to the app ecosystem.

I really hope innovation accelerates on the Amazon App store.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by ocdtrekkie on Thursday June 24, 2021 @02:50PM (#27622205)
> Google is shunted out of the Microsoft eco-system

We'll see about this one. Last I checked, half of Microsoft's own apps couldn't run on Android if Play Services was disabled.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by wilsonnb3 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @04:13PM (#27623191)
Microsoft brought the office suite to Amazon's app store pretty recently, when Amazon launched their latest 10 inch tablet with a keyboard attachment.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by ocdtrekkie on Thursday June 24, 2021 @04:18PM (#27623238)
That's good to know. One of the things that pushed me completely off Android was discovering how few even Microsoft apps I could use without Play Services' malware being installed as well.

And it's very likely Google will find ways to retaliate against Microsoft for working with the Amazon Appstore here. They are pretty aggressive against forks. Honestly, I would suspect the next Duo won't be able to run Play Services, because Microsoft dared to work with a competing Android app store.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by zeusk on Thursday June 24, 2021 @11:36PM (#27626879)
Wouldn't that Duo2 then be the perfect point for Kindle and Surface to join forces?

Just speculating - I know nothing about Android support at Microsoft.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by maliker on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:58PM (#27620445)
Plus it counters Apple, which recently made iOS apps available on macOS.

Seems like all the major OS are betting that mobile is going to be the focus of future native app development and don't want desktop users to miss out.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by zamadatix on Thursday June 24, 2021 @02:55PM (#27622267)
I don't think it says quite that much rather they've given up on the idea of a universal native app platform being realistic.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by mekster on Thursday June 24, 2021 @11:34PM (#27626865)
Apple being vertically integrated with its own ecosystem versus third parties integrating it on non native CPU platform sounds like a very different level of integrity.

No one can match the level of integration Apple had made on Windows and Android platform.

We'll see what kind of limitations and bugs to show up.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by zeusk on Thursday June 24, 2021 @11:37PM (#27626887)
Windows runs on ARM too, just that non-Apple ARM chips aren't as competitive in terms of pure performance.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by tomComb on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:07PM (#27620627)
This could be good for competition, but it's hard to see it as being about innovation.

Same as Microsoft copying Chrome and calling it Edge, users have another browser, now with MS telemetry etc. instead of Google. Good for user choice but hardly innovation.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by jacob019 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:29PM (#27620990)
Firefox user here. If I had to choose between MS and Google telemetry, which I don't, I would choose MS any day.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by tomComb on Thursday June 24, 2021 @03:45PM (#27622886)
Ok, great, so now there is one more option that addresses your preference) but it still isn't really innovation.

(I don't really follow how your comment related to the issue.)

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by mike_d on Thursday June 24, 2021 @03:42PM (#27622847)
> Google is shunted out of the Microsoft eco-system

iOS is 54.33% of all tablets, Android is 45.57%. Microsoft, Amazon, and everyone else combined account for 0.1%

It doesn't seem like an ecosystem Google has the time to worry about.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by thekyle on Thursday June 24, 2021 @11:50PM (#27626972)
I wonder if they are counting Surface tablets in those numbers. I don't think they sell very many, but 0.1% seems too low.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by zuminator on Thursday June 24, 2021 @04:35PM (#27623418)
I expect Amazon would be included under Android in those numbers.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by slim on Thursday June 24, 2021 @04:19PM (#27623242)
54% of all tablets in USA maybe? It's more like 5.4% of all tablets in reality
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by mike_d on Thursday June 24, 2021 @04:22PM (#27623273)
Worldwide. In the US it is slightly higher. https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/tablet/worldwide
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by slim on Friday June 25, 2021 @01:39AM (#27627484)
That's the market share, not the number of tablets
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by ksec on Friday June 25, 2021 @02:49AM (#27627852)
What is number of tablets? The total number of shipped Tablet? Why would it matter if those tablet are not in use? Which is what the stats from Stats-counter are showing.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by slim on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:41AM (#27628783)
Market share is how much money you make. So for example if apple sells 1M ipads for $500 and android tablets cost $50, at 45.57% it would mean there are 9M android tablets sold. Which makes the proportions more like 11% ipad / 89% android.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by mike_d on Friday June 25, 2021 @04:12PM (#27635665)
Wrong kind of market share. Statscounter is based on unique devices seen across a few million websites, not sales.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by madeofpalk on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:26PM (#27619882)
Will it?

Has the iOS apps on M1 Macs incentivised developers to do anything, apart from just opt out of the program?

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by dharma1 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @06:38PM (#27624822)
Yeah I don’t think it’s really taken off. The iOS apps that I would actually like to use on my M1 Mac have just opted out - not sure why.

For MS I think this could be a modest low risk win, even if it doesn’t massively take off. It gets them at least some tablet apps, and some popular social apps for desktop, without having to incentive developers to port them.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by collaborative on Thursday June 24, 2021 @08:46PM (#27625828)
Initially all ios apps were automatically included. But the latest version of xcode requires building with macOS as a destination which in my experience just doesn't compile. And I don't have the time to find out why (neither does my dev community). So for example, my app was available on m1 for a while, and as soon as I updated from new xcode, got opted out
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by NelsonMinar on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:30PM (#27619952)
Amazon's App store as it stands now is a bit of a ghost town. If apps are on there at all they're often outdated versions. I assume Google won't agree to cooperate with Microsoft and let the Play Store be supported. Anti-trust should help with that kind of monopolistic play but lol.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by ohyeshedid on Thursday June 24, 2021 @08:38PM (#27625782)
It's always been a ghost town for a large amount of popular apps. Last I checked, they didn't even have alternate browsers.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by handrous on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:14PM (#27619709)
Google's well on their way to replacing Android, no? I thought a lot of their announcements at events the last couple years had been about their from-scratch Android replacement.

Maybe another big company will pick it up, but if not, I don't see much benefit to the hobbyist community over the current status quo if Android gets "opened up" more but also loses 99+% of total corporate backing toward its development. Even if Amazon or MS run with it (and maybe that's what this is the beginning of?) that seems more like an on-life-support scenario than one with a bright future for Android.

Could go totally differently if major phone and tablet manufacturers ignore the New Shiny Thing and stick with Android so developing commercial software for it remains viable, I guess.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by 015a on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:30PM (#27619942)
I don't think Google is in a position to "replace" Android. They simply don't control the hardware; they can ship Fuchsia to their Home assistants and thermostats, but when it comes to phones and personal computing devices, they don't have many cards to play (beyond Pixel, like 0.5% of the Android market). The power lies with hardware manufacturers and developers.

Their new wearables partnership with Samsung may help here. Maybe Samsung would play along with a new Fuchsia phone OS. But there's still the developer issue; any new OS like this would need Android-backward compatibility support exactly similar to what Microsoft is doing here. "Android" in this sense doesn't mean "the OS"; its the application system.

What's happening in the Android world right now is so healthy and excellent, I almost can't believe its the product of Big Tech. Google is already pushing Android apps on ChromeOS, now Microsoft has them on Windows, through the Amazon app store, and nowhere in any of this is the actual Android Operating System. The comparison here isn't Android vs iOS vs Windows; its Android vs Flutter vs Web. Its a new way of writing "native"-adjacent multiplatform applications; the OS doesn't matter anymore.

Sure the touch-friendly UI will suck in some applications, on some deployments of Windows. That's not Android's fault; its on the developer to recognize the input method and canvas size, and adjust accordingly. I hope more do!

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by handrous on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:51PM (#27620300)
Right, but if no-one picks up the torch of maintaining and developing Android and giving it away to device manufacturers, I'd imagine going with the new Google OS that they are going to do that for, would be very tempting. Most phone manufacturers haven't shown an interest in putting a ton of work into the Android, themselves, even just to customize it beyond adding some shovel-ware and maybe a theme (notable exception: Samsung)

Possibly the app ecosystem will survive, even if the OS itself withers into obscurity, provided Fuscia can run Android apps (seems likely, but I haven't kept up with news on that sort of thing)

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by gman83 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:42PM (#27621228)
If Google were to ditch Android for Fuchsia, I could see this Microsoft/Amazon alliance stepping in and saying they'll build Android moving forward.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by Grazester on Thursday June 24, 2021 @03:48PM (#27622927)
When/if Google ditches Android you think they will give up the echo system? You think suddenly Android apps wouldn't run on Fuchsia? It would be a seamless transition(look at how they did it on the Nest Hub).

All the "cool" new Google features and performance upgrades may be Fuchsia only. I wouldn't bank much on Amazon. They just need an OS to run their readily disposable devices. I don't see them putting too much effort into this.

Google is going the hold the hand of manufacturers and ease them into it.

At least if Google had any sense this is how it would be done.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by leucineleprec0n on Thursday June 24, 2021 @03:10PM (#27622473)
I think that's exactly what this is; it functions as insurance of sorts for the mobile world - such that they aren't totally locked out of a feasible platform (see tablets especially for both ) and also a "why not" for MS & Amazon both. It gives MS a starting point for an Android SDK + existing Amazon Android apps - and Amazon can bolster their offerings which currently are fairly barebones.

It could amount to little, of course. Even iOS apps on MacOS as a concept and practice has not remotely the luster ardent Apple acolytes predicted, certainly not yet even 7 months in.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by miohtama on Thursday June 24, 2021 @05:07PM (#27623776)
Fuchsia is a kernel, not operating system. Google intends to swap Linux under Android to Fuchsia. One reason is the bad track record of Linux supporting device drivers.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by fbkr on Thursday June 24, 2021 @06:13PM (#27624529)
I thought Zircon is the kernel and Fuchsia is the operating system. Though that wouldn't prevent Google from building Android on top of Fuchsia.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by WastingMyTime89 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:54PM (#27620366)
> Its a new way of writing "native"-adjacent multiplatform applications; the OS doesn't matter anymore.

If only someone had thought about that before: a language targeting a bytecode interpreter and an ecosystem of library sitting on top of the operating system in order to be able to run programs on any operating system. In a way we could call it a virtual machine as it makes the OS insignificant. Written like this it sounds like 1994 tech. A shame we had to wait so long...

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by lmm on Thursday June 24, 2021 @10:26PM (#27626529)
It's a great idea, but it will only work if it comes with a UI library that doesn't suck and a software distribution mechanism that doesn't suck. No-one wants to install "an app to run an app", so you need to distribute these applications as either native executables or something equally convenient, and it needs to be completely trivial for application developers to do that or they won't bother. That's the reason Electron is winning at the moment.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by anfilt on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:02PM (#27620528)
Byte Code and VMs are are older than just 90's tech but okay. I still honestly prefer native code, but it does not work well for non-open source software unless the developer also compiles for other systems. Also windows is really the only major non-*nix OS these days. Although apples GUI software stack is still a pain port for when porting.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by 015a on Thursday June 24, 2021 @02:11PM (#27621659)
Sure, its 20s tech (WASM), 10s tech (Web/PWA), 00s tech (Java), 90s tech (Java), 80s tech (Erlang/BEAM), jeeze even 50s tech (Lisp)...

There are people who complain about how the industry is moving in cycles and how what's old is new again and how functional languages did that back in 1922. These people don't change the world; they just complain about how other people are changing it.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by anfilt on Thursday June 24, 2021 @02:23PM (#27621830)
Huh? I don't see how what I was saying was complaining? Sure things sometimes happen in cycles, I did not even mention that, but it is not necessarily a bad thing. VMs, and byte codes are a tool, and have their place. However, they do have their limitations compared to natively compiled code.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by pjmlp on Friday June 25, 2021 @02:27AM (#27627724)
Like?

Just because it is bytecode it doesn't mean it is interpreted.

> Unlike some other virtual-machine architectures in which the virtual instructions are interpreted at run time, TIMI instructions are never interpreted. They constitute an intermediate compile time step and are translated into the processor's instruction set as the final compilation step. The TIMI instructions are stored within the final program object, in addition to the executable machine instructions. This is how application objects compiled on one processor family (e.g., the original CISC AS/400 48-bit processors) could be moved to a new processor (e.g., PowerPC 64-bit) without re-compilation. An application saved from the older 48-bit platform can simply be restored onto the new 64-bit platform where the operating system discards the old machine instructions and re-translates the TIMI instructions into 64-bit instructions for the new processor.

From https://handwiki.org/wiki/IBM_System_i

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by robotresearcher on Thursday June 24, 2021 @02:17PM (#27621751)
Also LISP in 1958. It's a great idea that will always be around.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by ForHackernews on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:27PM (#27620947)
I thought Samsung had their own OS[0] that they were using for watches/smart TVs, and also keeping in their back pocket as a hedge against Google's influence? Are they giving that up?

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tizen

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by mike_d on Thursday June 24, 2021 @03:52PM (#27622964)
Tizen is used for Smart TVs, refrigerators, and cameras. Targeting devices that need to be "smart" but have a relatively low CPU budget and at best embedded GPUs.

The most recent phone that shipped with Tizen had a 480 x 800 pixel display.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by jrm4 on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:48PM (#27620242)
I hope they try, and I suspect it would end up the same way that OS/2 ended up for IBM, i.e. failure. Not that I love or hate any particular company; but I do believe in (real) competition and I think this would help foster that. (Strong enemy of my enemy vibes here though.)
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by pjmlp on Friday June 25, 2021 @02:22AM (#27627703)
Java was there first, and SavaJe OS could have been Android, but then Sun was screwed by Google.

And then there was this Pascal VM available across all 16 bit home computers, starting at the UCSD.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by tomComb on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:10PM (#27620687)
They might use Fuschia to replace the Linux kernel in Android, but Android would remain the same from an end user or app developer perspective.

They aren't just going to turf Android.

Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by wvenable on Thursday June 24, 2021 @12:32PM (#27619971)
Google replacing Android might end up like when Intel tried to replace x86. AMD came along with AMD64 and forced Intel back into making compatible chips. It might end up being an even brighter future for Android.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by partiallypro on Thursday June 24, 2021 @01:34PM (#27621083)
Google has about as much power to replace Android as Microsoft has the power to replace Windows. The ecosystem is too big now to go back.
Re:Microsoft is bringing Android apps to Windows 11 by dartharva on Thursday June 24, 2021 @11:54PM (#27626987)
Can they try going the Apple way and banning alternate app stores and sideloading in subsequent versions of Android? What then?