News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by bayindirh on Friday April 23, 2021 @11:51AM (#26915992)
I use an M1 powered 16GB MacBook Air and I've never seen any freezing, even under heavy load. I don't use Google Chrome though.

Also, system is writing to the SSD with the same rate of my Linux machines: 4TB/year.

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by sillysaurusx on Friday April 23, 2021 @12:25PM (#26916334)
Heavy load in my case is a few dozen terminal tabs, six of which are running TPU training jobs, 40 chrome tabs, a few of which are playing twitch streams and YouTube videos, a half dozen instances of pycharm, one webstorm, one clion, around 35 macvim windows, and a few dozen PDFs open in Preview. I’m not exactly representative, but I think the stddev of usage patterns is high across developers.

The unfortunate part is, when it freezes, it does the beachball for a full minute before I successfully execute a “switch to activity monitor / s click topmost process / force quit / confirm” sequence. Each step takes around 45 seconds to complete. I assume Apple QA never tested the extreme edges of workloads.

One poor guy on Twitter is already up to 18% of his SSD lifetime, in the first three months of having an M1. We had a heart to heart about how silly it was that the drive will die within a year, that Apple better replace it under warranty, and so on. But it’s a coin toss whether he’ll just have to eat the cost and buy a new one: https://twitter.com/_wli/status/1364934834229977090?s=21

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by bayindirh on Friday April 23, 2021 @12:48PM (#26916611)
This is heavy load for any machine unless it's configured as a bona fide workstation. Any machine, any OS (with M1 MacBook Air's HW configuration) would trash its SSD while swapping in that case, IMHO.

> I’m not exactly representative, but I think the stddev of usage patterns is high across developers.

When I'm in development mode with all cylinders firing, I have a single Eclipse window in CDT perspective, a couple of terminal tabs, Zeal (or Dash) for documentation and a couple of firefox tabs for documentation not available in Zeal.

Music is either supplied by a single YouTube tab or Spotify, and that's it.

The most unfortunate component is CPU in my case. I try to ooze every single bit of performance from it while running the application. Memory controller comes the second due to transfer operations but, I neither max out the RAM or cause system to do heavy swapping.

I'm always kind of conscious about the hardware resources of the system and minimize my resource usage habitually, without killing productivity.

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by msie on Friday April 23, 2021 @02:04PM (#26917420)
This guy seems to have pinpointed the problem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyMCoQmsv-I

The problem is unoptimized apps running on Rosetta2.

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by sillysaurusx on Friday April 23, 2021 @03:20PM (#26918175)
Thank you for finding this!

Unfortunately, and somewhat sadly, and melanchololy, I must report that I've been at OS version 11.2.3 (the latest) and run almost zero Rosetta apps: KeepassX, Beyond Compare, and Optimal Layout; of those, Optimal Layout has read 100GB, which is almost nothing.

In comparison, my kernel_task process is at 43TB bytes written, and WindowServer is at 8TB read.

So, as with cancer, there are multiple contributing factors, and hopefully Apple will ship an update to fix it... someday.

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by ngcc_hk on Saturday April 24, 2021 @07:23AM (#26924086)
Surprise. I bought the rose... theory. Sigh.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by rjzzleep on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:03PM (#26916776)
Well on Linux my 16GB thinkpad would thrash for more than 60 seconds unless I sysrq.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by neycoda on Saturday April 24, 2021 @11:41AM (#26925694)
Thrash is an odd word for an SSD... I mean, there's no moving parts, so I can't imagine how it's thrashing about.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by bayindirh on Saturday April 24, 2021 @11:47AM (#26925765)
Swamping an SSD with write requests and forcing it to write-level aggressively is trashing an SSD IMHO. Since it both silently grinds to fulfill the requests and loses a lot of lifespan during the process.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by smt88 on Saturday April 24, 2021 @10:19AM (#26924993)
Apple doesn't and shouldn't care about optimizing for your use-case. At some point, the user should be responsible for stopping processes when they're not using them anymore.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by airstrike on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:47PM (#26917246)
> 40 chrome tabs, a few of which are playing twitch streams and YouTube videos

> around 35 macvim windows

You do you, but I'd wager you could probably trim some of that low hanging fat

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by nexuist on Saturday April 24, 2021 @03:08AM (#26922907)
I was going to say, there's no humanely possible way you can watch and absorb the content from 5+ videos at the same time right? Like what's even the point? (I presume tabs with videos on them that aren't playing still perform around the same as tabs without videos at all, since there's no need to re-paint frames.)
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by cesarvarela on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:43PM (#26917202)
And here I am, thinking that heavy load is one node instance running webpack, a sql server, vscode, Figma and a few chrome tabs.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by reaperducer on Friday April 23, 2021 @05:49PM (#26919627)
a few of which are playing twitch streams and YouTube videos

How many eyes do you have?

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by exikyut on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:24PM (#26916989)
I am genuinely curious how you keep track of all that. Presumably this is all spread out over maybe a dozen workspaces?
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by lostlogin on Friday April 23, 2021 @02:56PM (#26917932)
I’m reminded of the podcast ATP and the great episode ‘The Windows of Siracusa County’. John’s window management system is both baffling and amazing. It’s a good listen.

https://atp.fm/96

Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by bayindirh on Friday April 23, 2021 @01:47PM (#26917249)
Possibly multiple desktops.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by snambi on Friday April 23, 2021 @12:41PM (#26916534)
If I do the same in my intel Mac book pro, it not only screams, burns but also slows down. honestly intel chips are overrated and overpriced.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by oriolid on Friday April 23, 2021 @02:37PM (#26917710)
The surprising part is that you have attention to spare for all those distractions.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by m-p-3 on Saturday April 24, 2021 @10:41AM (#26925177)
I understand the idea of integrating everything to reduce the electronic footprint, but some stuff like RAM and storage should be serviceable outside of replacing the entire board..
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by astrange on Friday April 23, 2021 @05:55PM (#26919668)
Sounds like you should report it in Feedback Assistant since you have an unusual workload.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by markphip on Friday April 23, 2021 @12:49PM (#26916616)
Same here, zero freezing and amazing performance. I use Safari though and have not even installed Chrome.
Re:Apple’s M1 Positioning Mocks the Entire x86 Business Model by bayindirh on Friday April 23, 2021 @12:56PM (#26916698)
I consider Chrome harmful TBH. I use Safari and Firefox (and I sync it with my other, non-apple computers).