News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by CapriciousCptl on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:07PM (#26297963)
In 2008 an app charging $1,000 that told people you were rich was censored. In 2021 we celebrate non-fungible tokens, 6-figure digital basketball cards and million dollar memes.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by zxcvbn4038 on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:49PM (#26298255)
We did that in 2008 also, I think the only reason Apple pulled that app is they expected the sales to be charged back and they were wanting to avoid the possible media circus going on around it. I am betting that in 2021 the story might have a different ending. If I wanted to have a service that would certify someone uber wealthy or old money and display an icon, I bet it could be done.

Nothing stops people from gold plating their iPhones or putting it in a jewel encrusted case - if you drop it better then gems take the blow then your phone, right? I’ve heard stories of überrich kids dropping $36k so they can rule on Clash of Clans, and grade school kids blowing their college funds on smurfberries to get ahead in whatever game uses those, and for the most part Apple is happy to let that happen but will step in with refunds to head off any media frenzy.

Has anyone tried to play Blackjack on an iPhone recently? It is almost impossible to find an app that lets you play any casino games without -buying chips- to play. Who is spending $99.99, $19.99, or $9.99 of real money to gamble X amount of fake money with real reward except being on a scoreboard for a day? If you just want to play just for fun you have to go onto web sites.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by the_local_host on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:04PM (#26298326)
> If I wanted to have a service that would certify someone uber wealthy or old money and display an icon, I bet it could be done.

$1000 isn't enough to charge to establish that someone is meaningfully wealthy; the app should have cost $10 million.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by ohgodplsno on Monday March 01, 2021 @02:48AM (#26300534)
If you've got $1000 to blow on a joke, you are more than reasonably comfortable and entering wealthy territory.

$1000 is rent for many people, it's one half to one third of their salary.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by chrischen on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:17PM (#26298404)
I think this is the same concept of establishing wealth as, say, wiping one's own ass with $1 bills.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by zxcvbn4038 on Monday March 01, 2021 @12:39PM (#26305519)
What was that Steve Martain movie where he is trying to take a woman to a fancy restaurant, so he is having a meeting with the head chef and the banker, and they keep asking him what he will order from the menu "The Duck!? On your salary?"

Yeah, 1000 is going to weed out a number of people but its not unreachable, should be more for 1000 we'll examine your financial situation and then grant you the ability to display the icon.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by SllX on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:51PM (#26299535)
IIRC the the highest price an app could set at the App Store launch in 2008 was $999 or $999.99.

This was someone putting a drawing in an iPhone app bundle with a funny name and charging the highest price that Apple allowed developers to set.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by JKCalhoun on Sunday February 28, 2021 @11:56PM (#26299871)
In other words, art.

It was brilliant. Made even more brilliant when the people who had actually paid for the app went on line, backpedalling, to explain how they had bought it on accident.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by trissylegs on Monday March 01, 2021 @12:34AM (#26300030)
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by koolba on Sunday February 28, 2021 @08:31PM (#26298836)
> Has anyone tried to play Blackjack on an iPhone recently? It is almost impossible to find an app that lets you play any casino games without -buying chips- to play.

Why would someone spend the time and money to develop an app that is not monetized?

You’d need a server to manage state and that’s an ongoing cost as well. It doesn’t exist because it’s not economical to do so.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by xkeysc0re on Sunday February 28, 2021 @08:50PM (#26298918)
You realize you can run code on the iPhone right? There's nothing inherent to blackjack - or any casino game whatsoever - that would necessitate holding remote state (Multiplayer obviously a different story).
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by zaphirplane on Monday March 01, 2021 @12:55AM (#26300101)
I think the chips have to have some value, pressing a reload 10m wallet button will make a pointless gambling game, loose win who care just get more free chips Gambling Games devolve to everyone all in, everyone bluffing
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by alsetmusic on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:20PM (#26298067)
> In 2008 an app charging $1,000 that told people you were rich was censored.

That’s not censorship. It’s protecting customers from being duped into buying something they don’t understand and getting ripped off.

TFA quotes an app review where someone felt scammed. The dev is quoted as saying he didn’t want people to buy it by accident and then feel cheated:

> "I don't want to collect money from people who did this by accident and I am glad that Apple returned the money for two orders," Heinrich said.

It sounds like he had good intent, was following the rules. It still wasn’t a good app to be in the App Store.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by blunte on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:12PM (#26298362)
If someone chooses to drop 1k to buy any app, one must assume they made some consideration before buying.

Conversely, there are countless free apps (Facebook-owned included) which extract far more value than 1,000usd from their users... and the users are completely unaware because the price of the app didn't give them pause.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by 2muchcoffeeman on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:09PM (#26299317)
> If someone chooses to drop 1k to buy any app, one must assume they made some consideration before buying.

The first iPhone was released in 2007. In 2008 people had only just begun writing apps and publishing to the app store. It's probably fair to say that people were still finding their way around the app store and some people were just curious.

Kids have sometimes ended up dropping thousands of dollars on stupid in-app purchases in games. I'm pretty sure they spent zero time considering the consequences.

Generally I think consumer protections are a good thing.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by SllX on Sunday February 28, 2021 @11:03PM (#26299589)
App Store launch was late 2008, something like 15 months after the iPhone launched, which is to reinforce your point. At the time the ground rules were not at all well established, only what was in that first policy document developers had to sign and Apple hadn’t yet accounted for any of the edge cases developers would come to discover.

App Store descriptions were also more prominent at launch than they are today. The developer did nothing to obfuscate what it was nor to try and cheat anyone. The price was there, the description was there. It was exactly what he advertised.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by kube-system on Sunday February 28, 2021 @08:16PM (#26298767)
That might be true, if we assume the buyers are adults who are using their own phone and paying with their own money. I don't think there were many spending controls at the time.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by blunte on Sunday February 28, 2021 @09:40PM (#26299165)
probably not; but the early adopters of that technology were probably upper class people who could survive with and deal with a financial snafu of 1000$.

what really got people (and apple) worked up was the idea that someone could create a "nothing" and make a lot of money with that. now we laugh because we can all create crypto tokens and sell them to naive investors.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by chipotle_coyote on Sunday February 28, 2021 @11:34PM (#26299781)
> the early adopters of that technology were probably upper class people who could survive with and deal with a financial snafu of 1000$

While there's undoubtedly an intersection between the set "tech geeks who want to be early adapters" and "people for whom losing $1K is no big deal", they're not identical. Remember that the original iPhone was $399[1]; losing 2.5x the cost of the phone to somebody's dumb software joke would not have just been an "oopsie, I guess we'll have to get a slightly cheaper jar of caviar for afternoon tea, Lovey" moment for a lot of us.

[1]: Technically, it was $599 for the 8GB model, but that initial price only lasted 3 months, and early buyers got a $100 credit in partial offset.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by interpol_p on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:30PM (#26299416)
But if they didn't make any considerations before buying, we should still encourage them to return the app and reverse the transaction

There's no point punishing people for accidentally spending money on a digital product they don't want when the tech involved to reverse that decision is available, ready to use, and won't hurt any parties involved

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by Lammy on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:13PM (#26298371)
> It still wasn’t a good app to be in the App Store.

aka it was bad PR for Apple, so it was removed.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by chrischen on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:16PM (#26298394)
Not sure if duping would be a good reason. Most people would easily be able to get a refund from the App store.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by shireboy on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:02PM (#26298310)
Overpriced collectibles were around in 2008 and well before. Beanie Babies anyone? Tulips? A fool and his money are soon parted. Only difference here is “digital”.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by blunte on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:21PM (#26298422)
The tulip reference is worn out and simply not fitting with the modern scenarios it is compared to.

In the 1600s, if you bought anything that didn't come from your village or region, that was a big deal. Tulips were an exotic distant foreign luxury (as frankly any flower would be if you could not grow it in your garden already).

People who bought them were not average, they were privileged and wealthy. Surely no peasant was duped into investing their half-month's worth life savings into tulip futures.

Also, Amsterdam was the first stock and commodities exchange in the world as far a we know (or at least in the west, as written by westerners). So peculiar investments should have been more likely.

Ironically, we now live in a world where non-physical creations with non-physical provenance fetch huge sums because... ? (because there is a lot of excess wealth accumulated by a few people who can piss it away without consequence, or because they can buy it with un-tax-reported currency).

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by megameter on Sunday February 28, 2021 @08:03PM (#26298690)
I think the key difference is exactly what you're getting at - there isn't a physical scarcity to be had here, so a digital token primarily expresses speculative value by default. Speculation always comes and goes with the hype of a bubble.

Lasting value beyond speculation appears when there is use value. But how do you apply a use value to a token? Well, you can't do it by locking down the nominally encoded asset - that's just a sticker pasted on it. These things do not gatekeep well. The use value comes from someone declaring that the bearer of the token is now entitled to something - a song, a poem, a noble rank. Anyone can do that for any token at any time. That is a thing that a unique, uncensored digital asset could be very relevant towards.

So the interesting part has not really come yet.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by adfjalkfja on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:35PM (#26298174)
got to love the $200,000 csgo weapon skins too
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by blunte on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:22PM (#26298426)
cough money laundering
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by foobar33333 on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:25PM (#26298442)
How does this work via csgo skins? Genuinely curios how it works.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by blunte on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:42PM (#26298554)
I can't speak for cargo skins specifically, but when some "asset" sells for an abnormally high price, there is usually something else going on. It's like when a condo which would normally be worth 200k sells for 380k, it can be a way to turn dirty money into a "reasonable" sale. Sure the seller has to pay taxes and such on it, but if there's no strict know-your-customer requirement, you can accept money from any source.

The usual arrangement is that the seller inflates their price a lot, and then the seller provides the product plus a kickback to the person who wants to launder the money. Now the launderer has a real, valid asset, plus optionally some of the overpaid amount in cash. As long as the buyer reports the income and pays taxes, now the seller has laundered the money. I am oversimplifying somewhat, but that's the idea.

A lot of properties have been sold by a certain high profile American politician that way in the last decade. That's a fascinating place to start studying the scheme.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by robkop on Sunday February 28, 2021 @08:08PM (#26298721)
CSGO skins and steam keys work in similar ways, the scheme generally looks like this (or atleast it used to, haven't looked in a few years).

1. Buy/ obtain stolen credit card details.

2. Buy CSGO skins / Purchase steam game as a gift with stolen CC.

3. Sell skins/ game keys through a 3rd party, online marketplace.

4. Collect profits.

Congratulation, you've converted dirty money (used to buy stolen CCs) and potentially dirty money (charges put on stolen CCs) in clean, washed money!

Of course you can do this scheme without the stolen CCs (just buy steam games/ skins) but the CCs have a nice multiplicative effect and they add more obfuscation.

Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by jobigoud on Monday March 01, 2021 @03:34AM (#26300707)
This doesn't explain why anyone would pay 200K for a csgo skin.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by eyelidlessness on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:56PM (#26299558)
“Censored”
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by m463 on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:12PM (#26299330)
Hey, some startup stock options end up being worth something. :)
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by chickenmonkey on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:33PM (#26299436)
I'm curious - what do you mean by million dollar memes?
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by Consultant32452 on Sunday February 28, 2021 @10:34PM (#26299440)
I assumed doge coin.
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by 0_____0 on Sunday February 28, 2021 @06:16PM (#26298030)
who is this 'we' you speak of
Re:Apple removes $1k featureless iPhone application (2008) by giaset on Sunday February 28, 2021 @07:51PM (#26298609)
I was one of the buyers of the $208k LeBron, and we bought it because it was cool, not because we wanted to tell people we were rich ¯\_(ツ)_/¯