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Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by glaive123 on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:35AM (#25515054)
Isn't it one thing when a faceless corporation does this, and another thing when a startup is doing this to learn about why customers are churning so they can improve their product?
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by toast0 on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:04AM (#25515211)
It doesn't make much difference. It's still reprehensible to make it hard to cancel.

Let people cancel, confirm they've cancelled, and then ask for feedback. Put a feedback box on the confirmation page, imvite them to reply to the confirmation email. If you really must know, send a letter, and make one phone call (leave a message when they don't answer).

Anything else is abuse, and they're leaving you because you're abusive.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by commoner on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @03:15AM (#25515571)
Baremetrics is not just a startup anymore. Last month, they were sold to Xenon Partners, a private equity firm that applies the same aggressive sales strategy to all of the companies in its portfolio. That excuse no longer holds.

https://baremetrics.com/blog/i-sold-baremetrics

https://xenon.io

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by sandworm101 on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:47AM (#25515113)
Customers owe a service provider nothing, be them a massive corporation or a garage startup. ALL customers have the right to walk away without a word of feedback.
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by glaive123 on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:51AM (#25515134)
Yeah I agree. So are you saying the problem is with "call to cancel" itself or with the response the OP got from customer service rep when he emailed them?
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by joshmanders on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @10:23AM (#25518470)
The problem is the "We do not acknowledge any cancellation requests without a phone call"
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by loopz on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:43AM (#25515095)
Yes, the difference is the scale of abuse.
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by glaive123 on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:49AM (#25515122)
And also the intention?

Big companies like Comcast are just doing this to extract every penny.

A startup trying to survive and make their product better for customers--or fix something that went wrong--is completely different situation IMO.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by powersnail on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:22AM (#25515313)
I don't see how being a startup justifies making cancellation incredibly difficult. Whether it's a giant "extracting every penny", or a startup "trying to survive", it's just editorialization. They made it difficult, so less customers would cancel. Less customers cancel, more money retained.

I'm okay with an optional questionnaire, and I often fill them out when I cancel a service. But if it wants me to call to cancel, and especially if it deliberately makes the call longer and unbearable, I have all the reasons to be angry about it. I don't care if it's a struggling startup. A startup is an organization, not an actual life; I'm not going to pity it.

Obviously, an optional questionnaire is not as effective as forcing a call onto the customer. But it's the right thing to do.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by glaive123 on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:30AM (#25515361)
> I don't see how being a startup justifies making cancellation incredibly difficult.

True. I'm questioning where is the trade-off and balance between making it more difficult to cancel vs. trying to fix what's wrong.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by powersnail on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:46AM (#25515433)
For me, the line is an optional survey.
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by sethhochberg on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:55AM (#25515156)
I’ve dealt with companies where the “cancel” option really just meant contacting support.

If I need to do anything more than sending the message (on my own schedule - this part is important, I manage my personal life on nights and weekends) saying “hi, I’d like to cancel please” in order to actually have service cancelled and billing stopped, I’m likely to be frustrated and not give any feedback.

I’ve had very positive experiences with reps replying to confirm my service was cancelled, and then initiating a quick conversation about why I asked for that. I’m usually happy to offer at least some quick feedback, because I didn’t feel like I was being held hostage.

I’d still prefer virtually any other no-contact mechanism for ending an agreement for consumer services, though. Offer me winbacks if you want, add an optional exit interview to the process. But really, please don’t gate my ability to end an agreement I’m theoretically able to cancel at any time behind a manual process that’s any more difficult than my signup was. The intent is different but the end result is the same for the customer.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by Silhouette on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:09AM (#25515238)
If I need to do anything more than sending the message (on my own schedule - this part is important, I manage my personal life on nights and weekends) saying “hi, I’d like to cancel please” in order to actually have service cancelled and billing stopped, I’m likely to be frustrated and not give any feedback.

It's important to be reasonable about this, though. Email isn't secure, and anyone could send an email pretending to be you. If there are irreversible consequences to cancelling, such as deleting personal data held on the service, not only would it be irresponsible to accept an unverified email message as a cancellation request, it could actually be illegal in various places (under the GDPR, for example).

Not providing a straightforward cancellation option via a website where the customer's identity has already been confirmed using their normal credentials is a different matter entirely.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by powersnail on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:26AM (#25515343)
Email isn't secure, but neither are phone calls.

If a customer emails to cancel, just email back a cancellation link that requires signing in. I think that's a good middle ground.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by Silhouette on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:54AM (#25515473)
Sure, but you can exchange credentials over the phone with acceptable safety in most situations, after which it's reasonable to accept that the other person is who they claim to be.

Obviously if someone does email asking to cancel, a suitable method of cancellation should be explained to them.

Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by sethhochberg on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:23AM (#25515324)
For sure - that message should be via whatever the secure channel for support happens to be, if someone is going this route. I appreciate someone doing something a bit more robust than “tweet at us and promise you are you who say you are”
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by kjakm on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:52AM (#25515464)
Why should someone who wants to be an ex-customer care that you want to improve things for your customers? You’re not entitled to my time anymore than a big company.
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by mafuy on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @02:17AM (#25515286)
I thought we are doing this free market thing here ;) So just send them an offer of a large discount in return for feedback. Simple, not expensive, not intrusive - win win.
Re:Baremetrics required a phone call to cancel by rodgerd on Saturday December 26, 2020 @05:14AM (#25542501)
Startups are faceless corporations.