That's exactly what I have been telling folks about Apple vs. other laptops. Apple only has a handful of laptop models for sale and they don't even change that much across generations. Furthermore they seem to exhibit hardly any manufacturing variations within each generation. That means that if there is a problem (and yes, there were a few big ones), everyone is affected the same, everyone is screaming about it, the majority of customers are not corporate customers, and eventually a class action lawsuit is set up and Apple will often (grudgingly) offer to fix/replace broken units for free, like what happened with Staingate or the Butterfly switches.

Now compare that to buying a model from Dell or Lenovo, where the current product lineup is already 2-3x the size, the models are sometimes discontinued, sometimes changed significantly between refreshes, often refreshed annually, oftentimes configurable in a meaningful way (1080p non-glossy vs. 1080p privacy screen vs. 4k glossy vs. 4k touch screen), sometimes just available in certain geographical locations and they exhibit more intra-generation manufacturing differences. The chances of finding other folks with your exact same permutation (and same day of the week it was manufactured) of these options are much smaller, so you stand less of a chance of getting something recognized as a fundamental manufacturing issue which should be covered for free by the vendor. Plus, even if you can get repair/replacement for free, you still fear that your specific model has a flaw, so you might only get lucky after having it replaced 2-3 times.

I've seen it happen with Dell and Lenovo where folks sent back brand-new units repeatedly because the first one had overheating issues with the SSD, the second one had really noisy capacitors and the third one had a display cable that wasn't seated correctly. At least with Apple I know that if I'm getting screwed, I'm in the same boat with everyone else ;)

That last paragraph is indicative of terribly quality and quality control.

Fortunately that hasn't been my experience with the recent Dell, Asus, Lenovo and HP laptops I've purchased. Each have been without any issues at all.

But my point here is that... it sounds like you're arguing against consumer choice. You can have your Model T in any color as long as it is black. And this is Apple's model. You can have your product in any configuration as long as it's the one configuration Apple offers. Apple tried this, actually, for a long time. The iPhone started out with extremely limited configurations and only more recently branched out beyond 2. In a way, I agree with the confusion, because I know now I can't just say "Macbook" because there is at least one Macbook without suffix, at least one Air, and the Macbook Pro has a myriad of configurations - different sizes, with or without touch bar, etc.

Why did Apple start offering more options? Because that's what consumers want. Dell exists exactly because they were the first big PC manufacturer to accept configuration orders, and then (relatively) quickly manufacturer and deliver those custom configurations to users. Consumers want this. As Apple's share of the market grows, they will have to meet the consumers where they are - or their market share will be limited by the limitations they place upon themselves.

Now, I agree that, for example, the variety of models between different geographic locations is - if nothing else - annoying. Especially when nicer options aren't offered in your location! But I don't agree with the offered example of getting bad replacements. Maybe buying one laptop a year isn't enough to experience these issues.

Actually from what I've heard from Linux distro maintainers (mainly from Fedora) it seems like Apple actually does quite substantial hardware revisions internally without telling anyone as users report that their MacBook 20XX does not work with a Linux distro while another users report that on the paper the same device of the same model year works fine. IIRC the estimate was about 4 hardware revisions per year.

This really complicates the already limited attempts to run Linux distros on the Mac hardware as users simply can't reliably tell if their hardware will be compatible beforehand.

On the MacOS side they likely paper over the differences, quirks and bugs in firmware and drivers, so the user does not native anything and they can change the hardware underneath as needed.

Consumer choice only means anything if the consumers can choose something they know about.

If the choice is between "you can know about it" xor "you can buy it", there's no real choice.

Apple has it's fair share of issues, and it's often a pain to diagnose them remotely without the user looking up the specific model code which isn't all to easy to identify. They often don't change any visual appearance and certainly don't distinguish between different models in their marketing. It's easy for me to look up what common issues Lenovo's had with a specific T series model, but if I'm buying a used MacBook, it's hard to know what I should be searching for until the seller has told me the exact model number. And even still, there's variance between machines of the same model because sometimes different panels and SSDs are used for the same model number.

> without the user looking up the specific model code which isn't all to easy to identify

My 7 year old macbook has "A1465" written in perfectly legible text on the bottom. "About this mac" has the serial number two clicks away, which is convertable online to exact specifications.

My old laptop from 2006 had nc8430 written close to the screen hinges. The new one from 2014 has ZBook at the bottom left of the keyboard. Maybe it's one of the differences between $300 laptops and $1000+ ones.

Except what you said is not at all true. Dell, hp, and Lenovo have a whole bunch of different models for different laptops. They're also very customizable, so the model may be slightly different if you want different hardware. But you're arguing for less consumer choice. Dell, hp, and Lenovo do not swap models around to try to fool consumers. Quite the contrary; you can search a very old model number and find exactly what you're looking for on their site.

They all cater a different need. I donated few laptops to a school in India. These were some of the cheapest models Lenovo had to offer. Lenovo Dell etc. cater to a much wider range of market that apple does not even bother to target. You are basically comparing Tesla with Camry and upset that Camry is not as good.

On other hand Lenovo X1 carbon is a pretty solid high end laptop along with LG gram. Former specifically is far more customizable, repairable, upgradable and also around 30% cheap while being more powerful.

You think that’s bad, just wait till Apple starts selling cars.

And scooters.

and revamping the US highway system with assisted driving beacons/lines etc - because they're the only ones with enough money to do so.

That raises a very interesting point: The highway system. Who owns it? Who can “attach” to it? What you said made me think about line access and comcast using its mass to keep out Google Fiber etc. I really, REALLY do not want that battle to take place over roads.

Apple had a lot of problems with overheating. The i9 version of MacBook especially, it throttles under slight load.

And you have said literally nothing against the deeper point the parent is making.

The geo-locking of model numbers is one of the vilest practices I've seen. I don't see it going away for any reason, it'll only be possible to combat by intl. legislation... but how do you even legislate that?

I don't see it going away as there are valid reasons for doing so for small but important market differences.

If you're making some device (for example, washing machine) which has a power cord and a knob for some mode selection with writing on it, then for the exact same internals you need different models where the power cords are different (USA, UK, Germany and Japan each require different plugs) and the writing on the device is printed in different language and with customizations such as Celsius vs Fahrenheit. You can't sell the exact same laptop model in every market because the keyboard layouts are different. Etc.

Just append the region identifier to the model number. Internally they clearly need to track the products separately, and you don’t want people getting the wrong product accidentally.

> then for the exact same internals you need different models where the power cords are different

The IEC 60320 connectors were specified for exactly that reason. Honestly, I don't get why these were not made mandatory for all kinds of appliances. There are even locking variants available if vibration is of concern.

> The IEC 60320 connectors were specified for exactly that reason. Honestly, I don't get why these were not made mandatory for all kinds of appliances. There are even locking variants available if vibration is of concern.

I'm not sure what you mean by the second sentence but you can't use most appliances made for Europe in America and vice versa. Most electronic appliances depend on the input voltage and supplying 240V can easily cause a fire. That is true for almost all electronic appliances (water heater, fan, washing machine, etc) but not true most "computer related devices" such as a monitor, PSU, charger. Since those devices already operate on a much lower DC Voltage, they often have transformers (not sure if that's the right word), that can scale down the current from either 120 or 240. [0]

That being said, a mandatory IEC connector (and it's variances) would help a lot to cut down unnecessary e-waste. Instead of throwing away a device because the cable is damaged, you can easily order a replacement that is around $2 and high quality, instead of relying third party cords that might have bad wiring from a non reputable brand. The reason they are not mandatory, though, is that most companies like to have their own connectors so that you either overpay for it or just buy a new device.

[0]: You should still always read the specs on the input current for the device though. It is dangerous to rely on the fact that similar devices can operate at 120V/240V because yours might not. You can usually see the specs on the website/packaging or usually near the input plug.

> I'm not sure what you mean by the second sentence but you can't use most appliances made for Europe in America and vice versa. Most electronic appliances depend on the input voltage and supplying 240V can easily cause a fire.

Here in America "electronic appliances" would imply the tech/gadget category like TVs or computers where "electrical appliances" would be the big household equipment. Just to clarify in case that confuses anyone else like it did me, it kind of reverses the meaning of what you're trying to say.

Anyways, at least with relatively modern gear you can generally assume that anything with batteries or USB ports runs off a switch-mode power supply, and all but the cheapest of those will happily accept pretty much anything resembling residential power.

Anything with a large motor or any kind of resistive element (lighting, heating) on the other hand is almost certainly built for a specific variety of electrical service and will likely require modification to accept anything else without releasing the magic smoke.

The stuff in between those categories, well, RTFLabel. Outside of audio and ham radio gear I'd imagine most DC stuff runs on switch mode power supplies these days.

I wonder if there are regulatory reasons that prevent IEC connectors being used in e.g. washing machines. I guess getting a water ingress protection IP rating might be harder if you have an IEC connector. The lack of an IP rating might prevent you from then installing the appliance in, say, a bathroom (depends presumably on country-specific regulation). This in turn might limit your sales.

Even if that's the case, the appliances should be easy to repair for a competent person and if necessary allow the cable be replaced.

My cheap hair drier has a switch to select the input voltage (you need to turn the dial with a screwdriver). For many devices it shouldn't be too hard to make it possible to use them both with 110V and 230V, even more so for already complex and expensive machines like a washing machine.

The biggest problem might be the amount of power a device can draw. Half the voltage gives you half the power, which is the reason why e.g. kettles are much less useful in the US.

For resistive loads (like the heating element in a kettle), half the voltage gives you a quarter of the power. (Electric kettles work just fine on 110/120; they just haven't been a thing in the US. They've been ubiquitous in Canada, although they've been pushed aside somewhat by drip coffee makers. You just need a lower-resistance heating element than would be practical with 220/240.)

Electric kettles in the US typically are 1000W-1500W, while in Europe any kettle is 2000W-2800W. This is simply because houses are typically wired with outlets for 10A-16A everywhere, regardless of grid voltage.

That ofc makes electric kettles much less useful in countries with 110V grid. It also keeps stovetop kettles relevant in these counties, since stoves don't suffer power limitations.

Houses in the US are typically wired with 240v split phase, so nothing is stopping a mad lad from installing a 240v outlet in their kitchen, and running a kettle from it.

This just seems so crazy, to think of 120V. I haven't seen a house here with 120V in my entire lifetime. It sounds like a relic from the past, like the kind of thing people used back when they rode horses.

Hmm, I'm having trouble understanding what you mean. 120V is the standard household plug in North America. If you're in, say Europe, I don't imagine you'd see a house with 120V as IIRC, 220V is the standard, and you generally have to connect to your local grid. I think the parent's post about 120V was about international devices that may have to work in North America, for instance.

> you need different models where the power cords are different

That should only affec the power brick, and hence the overall SKU, not the notebook itself.

> the writing on the device is printed in different language and with customizations such as Celsius vs Fahrenheit.

What writing is there on notebooks except for keyboard labeling and the product name? The certification label on the back already shows all labels for all countries.

> You can't sell the exact same laptop model in every market because the keyboard layouts are different.

Keyboard layouts are somewhat orthogonal to regions. I'm German, but use US-layout keyboards.

Japan uses the same power plugs as the USA.

Legislation can mandate the conspicuous publication of a clear indication of the difference between models.

Now, companies can of course lie about this, in theory, but that's a bit like car manufacturers lying w.r.t. emission tests - possible, but you tend to get caught (cf. the recent Volkswagen case) so it's probably not worth it.

Here’s my lazy take: the best governing body to start petitioning about this is probably the EU. If I remember correctly, they already have some of the most consumer-friendly laws on the planet, e.g. w.r.t. planned obsolescence.

Eben Apple sells different iPhone versions on different countries. It’s mostly frequency bands but Chinese iPhones have a second sim slot instead of an eSim as far as I remember.

Unfortunately, regional market segmentation is something that international trade agreements have encouraged, not prevented.

Meh. It's easy for a reviewer to research online to see comparable models.

It also makes it possible for big electronic stores to give price guarantees as the webshop undercutting them has monitors with a different product number.

It becomes even more unawesome when the same product identifier actually has different parts in it.

When looking for a nice display a couple of years ago I clearly remember reading about some that were promising yet getting confoundingly variable reports, until some tore their hardware apart and revealed that the internals were different.