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Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by melling on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @10:59PM (#24278638)
In 1900 the earth’s population was 1.6 billion. In 1903 the Wright Brothers built the first airplane. In 1947, humans flew at supersonic speed for the first time. That was in the span of 50 years. 22 years later, we were on the moon.

A lot can happen in 50-70 years.

We now have 7 billion people, with more of the world coming online to do R&D. China, specifically, has made it a goal to lead the world in AI by 2025.

India’s economy should grow over the next 2 decades and they will also become a world leader.

With so many resources, the world should easily advance more in the next 50 than it did in the last 100 years.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by nitwit005 on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:24PM (#24278784)
In the 50s and 60s aviation and space people often thought that things would keep improving exponentially, as they'd lived through such incredible advancements. Instead things slowed enormously, despite vast efforts put in.

We've lived through enormous computing advances, but it's been fairly obvious for some time that hardware improvements are slowing.

I'm sure there will be amazing advancements in the next 50 years, but I expect a lot of the progress to be in fields that are either currently unknown, or seem unimportant today. Those new fields will see better return on investment.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by fiblye on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @01:46AM (#24279519)
Funding for NASA also dropped off a cliff and no government really cared about going to space anymore, and there was zero company out there with the funds and motivation to go to space.

Now we have countless companies and several countries all competing and building off each other's work in the AI space. So long as people don't get bored or the global economy doesn't collapse, progress should keep chugging along. Another key difference is that it's basically free to get into. Anyone out there can download data sets, existing algorithms, and get to work on tweaking things. There's a strong foundation for any motivated person to build off of.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by api on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:42PM (#24278875)
> despite vast efforts put in.

I disagree with that part. Things slowed dramatically because we stopped putting extreme amounts of effort in, largely because there wasn't enough market demand for aviation or space flight beyond 1970s technology... for a while.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by nradov on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @02:40AM (#24279803)
The worldwide market for aviation and space launches is far larger now than in the 1970s.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by jjoonathan on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @11:30AM (#24283338)
> there wasn't enough market demand for aviation or space flight beyond 1970s technology
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by 6nf on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @06:57PM (#24288260)
We are putting lots of mass into space, and it's cheaper than ever. I think if you plot mass launched per year you'll see a different picture than what you are painting.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by Thorentis on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:25PM (#24278791)
Putting AGI in the same field as population growth and flight is disingenuous. They are entirely different things, and the rapid advancement of one means absolutely nothing about the advancement or even possibility of the other.

Overcoming physical limitations is one thing. An intelligent being creating something equally or more as intelligent as itself? And obviously I don't mean reproducing. Creating an entirely new class of thing which has intelligence equal to the creator is very different to using the forces of nature to give you an edge over gravity.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by melling on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:42PM (#24278872)
The point with the population is that we will have 7-9 billion people, with more people doing research, engineering, etc. how many scientists were there in 1900?

We will figure out how the brain works, make better transistors, develop better algorithms, etc

An AI “space race” between the US and China, for instance, will push the field forward over the next decade.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by TaylorAlexander on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @12:48AM (#24279209)
Collaboration also pushes this field forward. Lots of great AI research coming from China and the US and luckily lots of it is shared openly. IMO that’s how to maximize the rate of innovation.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by sheepdestroyer on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @01:05AM (#24279302)
Did you miss the news where average IQ is lowering across the board due to various poorly understood factors (increase of CO2 levels, endocrine disruptors, etc...). We are getting at a massive amount of dumb people ala idiocracy, not sure if that also means more smart scientists in total.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by lostmsu on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @01:33AM (#24279451)
If there's a drop in IQ, right now it is not even comparable to the population rise.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by thoughtstheseus on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:44PM (#24278889)
Comparing historical projections for a variety of topics seems like a decent point of reference. Population growth and flight seem vastly more tractable problems, in hindsight if not at the time then AGI does, yet estimates were way off by many.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by computerphage on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @03:30AM (#24280056)
> Indeed, eight years before Orville and Wilbur Wright took their home-built flyer to the sandy dunes of Kitty Hawk, cranked up the engine, and took off into the history books, Lord Kelvin, the President of the Royal Society of England made a forceful declaration. "Heavier than air flying machines are impossible," said this very powerful man of science....Rumor has it Lord Kelvin was slightly in error.

https://www.nasa.gov/audience/formedia/speeches/fg_kitty_haw...

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by zxwx on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @02:39AM (#24279798)
In 70 years of physics we went from the photoelectric effect to the Standard Model. But for the last 50ish, it remains the standard.

70 years from the first flight to the concorde and the saturn 5. But in the 50 years since, improvements in aerospace have been incremental.

In 75 years we went from ENIAC to TFLOPS in a laptop. But looks like that breakneck pace is slowing down sharply. We've been doing AI nearly as long, and have gone from say, Eliza to GPT-3. A huge advance, but not AGI.

A lot can happen in 50 years, but we've already had our first 70ish years with AI without an AGI breakthrough.

To the definition of AGI in the link, maybe a hundred million data scientists can hone a million models, one per "economically viable" task, and start chipping away at the 95% of the economy target, but till now I'd wager AI has put many more people to work than out of it.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by dwaltrip on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @02:46AM (#24279829)
You have a good point. However, to be a bit pedantic, fully reusable rockets, which we are very much knocking on the door of, are a major stepwise improvement.

It just goes to show that technological advancement can happen rather unpredictably.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by littlestymaar on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @02:21AM (#24279702)
> In 1903 the Wright Brothers built the first airplane. In 1947, humans flew at supersonic speed for the first time.

And since then, not much has changed. Commercial supersonic flight never took off, and nowadays planes still use turbofans (invented during WWII). Engineering fields commonly make many breakthrough in a really short time, and then settle down for a long period. We can't predict how far IA progress will go. In the 50s, having flying cars by 2000 didn't sound unrealistic given how much flight advanced during the first half of the century. Yet, I don't think anyone nowadays believes we'll have them by 2100.

Also, between Da Vinci's Codex of the flight of birds (1502) and the Wright brothers flight, there has been four centuries. And regarding AGI, we might be closer to Da Vinci then to the Wright.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by mempko on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:58PM (#24278967)
You forgot about global warming and that we are in the sixth mass extinction. Global civilization collapsing in 50 years seems as likely as AGI.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by 300bps on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:23PM (#24278777)
When I was 14, I was 6'5". Extrapolating that out, I should probably be 100' tall by now.
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by paulcole on Tuesday August 25, 2020 @11:29PM (#24278805)
brb writing a pointless think piece about why I am 90% sure that will happen by 2070
Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by loosetypes on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @12:07AM (#24279005)
Improving performance for a metric that we actually know how to quantify is fundamentally different than calling interesting but potentially one-off stabs as incremental progress.

Conflating them only demonstrates how far we have to go.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by unishark on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @01:05AM (#24279301)
We do know how to quantify intelligence (unless you're one of those who includes consciousness in the definition of AGI, which seems almost religious to me). I expect it will quickly switch to an argument of what deficiencies AGI candidates have and how smart they really are, much like ML models that supposedly beat humans at narrow tasks today, rather than possible versus impossible talk.

As for impossible talk, we have biological examples all around us of what needs to be built. We just need to imitate. Much like computer vision, algorithms sucked at it until they didn't (and all it took was someone scaling up an old design idea plus a lot of data). On the scale of gigantic ambitious goals it's pretty special in that regard. Curing cancer or death or mars colonies may indeed be impossible, by contrast.

I will agree that I trust no one's ability to predict anything. They are all just making almost-entirely-uneducated guess using a few variables out of some vast number of unknowns.

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by visarga on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @02:07AM (#24279635)
> unless you're one of those who includes consciousness in the definition of AGI

Why stick with this concept - consciousness - which is not well defined, instead of using a much more practical concept: embodiment. Embodiment is the missing link towards human level AI. Agents embodied in a world, like AlphaGO, already surpass humans (on the Go board or Dota 2), we just need to take that ability to real world. The source of meaning is in the game, not the brain. What we need is a better simulator of the world, or a neural technique for imagination in RL, which is under works [1].

1. https://arxiv.org/pdf/2005.05960.pdf

Re:My AI Timelines Have Sped Up by loosetypes on Wednesday August 26, 2020 @12:39PM (#24284171)
Thanks for the reply.

> We do know how to quantify intelligence (..).

But how exactly do we do that?