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Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by mywittyname on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @10:09AM (#21258494)
There are plenty of 90s era car electronics that are going fine. The sensors are going to be maintenance items after 20 years, but there's no reason to think the solid state components won't normally last 25+ years.

Spare (electronic) parts shouldn't be an issue with major brands. I've seen the same sensor used on a dozen models from several manufactures produced over 10+ years. As Takata exposed, there aren't that many parts suppliers around the globe, so a lot of commodity components are shared across the industry.

For long-term part replacement, I'd be far more concerned with construction techniques like plasma-transferred wire arc sprays used for creating cylinder linings. This technique cannot be replicated outside of the factory, thus, they kind of make engine blocks disposable (they can be sleeved, but they won't perform the same and will require different piston heads).

Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by slg on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @10:22AM (#21258661)
> but there's no reason to think the solid state components won't normally last 25+ years.

Except this article is specifically about solid state components failing in a much shorter timeframe.

Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by myself248 on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @10:50AM (#21259013)
Except most cars don't rewrite their flash every few seconds.

Most modules with flash in 'em are programmed once at the manufacturer, reflashed once or twice during assembly, maybe reflashed once more at the dealer before delivery, and that's it. Maybe again post-sale if there's a recall or TSB or something that can be fixed in software.

Flash quite happily lasts 25+ years if you don't abuse it far beyond any flash manufacturer's wearout specs. Go figure!

Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by t34543 on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @10:54AM (#21259066)
Airbag control modules do constantly write data. The last 5 seconds or so of sensor and input data is recorded for crash investigations.
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by cat199 on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @11:25AM (#21259426)
is this actually written to flash?

concievably a big capacitor or watch battery could keep a 4 or 8k RAM going for quite a long time.

Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by xfitm3 on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @11:36AM (#21259576)
If you look at airbag module teardowns there is a giant capacitor, but this is used to fire airbags in the event the vehicle's power system is rendered inoperable prior to deployment.
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by leoedin on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @01:14PM (#21260970)
Flash isn't the only game in town. I wouldn't be surprised if airbags use FRAM - capable of more than 1 trillion write cycles
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by cat199 on Wednesday October 16, 2019 @01:45PM (#21273134)
thanks - learning things :)
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by beerandt on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @11:34AM (#21259540)
It's got to survive a wreck, so I suspect power reliant memory is out.
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by dfox on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @02:18PM (#21261814)
Most manufacturers’ datasheets specify 20 or less years of data retention (even when powered on). This might seem like random sufficiently large number, but there really are devices made in mid-90’s (notably early FastEthernet cards) that do not work because they lost contents of their configuration EEPROMs.
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by mywittyname on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @11:01AM (#21259133)
Telsa having trouble building reliable cars is not evidence of an industry-wide issue. There are tens of millions of cars on the road with decades old solid state components that are in perfect operation.
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by anon73044 on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @01:15PM (#21260980)
"tens of millions" and "in perfect operation" doesn't quite jive with me but the numbers are mostly there.

For Toyota ~57 million vehicles from '02-'09 https://www.toyota-global.com/company/history_of_toyota/75ye...

For Honda ~23 million from '02-09 https://www.statista.com/statistics/267276/worldwide-automob...

Volkswagen group looked to be in between the two.

Didn't look for Ford or GM.

Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by mywittyname on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @01:30PM (#21261179)
There were 16 million new vehicles are sold last year in the US and there's 260 million registered vehicles on the road with a median age of nearly 12 years old.

To say that there's "tens of millions" of perfectly operational cars on the road in the US is really an understatement.

Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by wasdfff on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @01:09PM (#21260884)
If you have a used audi and the mechanic comes back and tells you its the wiring harness, thats probably it for the car. Unless you like spending 3k to fix a 4k car.
Re:Flash Memory Wear Killing Older Teslas Due to Excessive D... by brokenmachine on Tuesday October 15, 2019 @11:32PM (#21266817)
Why is a wiring harness so expensive?