.su - Hackdot

Re:.su by charles_f on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:33AM (#21005830)

Reminds me of my 9th grade teacher who was refusing to call it USSR like everyone else and was insisting on saying "usre" (pronounced like a word). To this day still wondering if it was militant, or if she just read that on a map and thought it was a word.

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Re:.su by input_sh on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @08:55AM (#21004855)

I hope you keep it too. It's been like a decade and I still feel sad that .yu is gone.

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Re:.su by whoopdedo on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:12AM (#21005630)

Biggest tragedy of the early internet was losing .oz (Which was resurrected in the OpenNIC alternate DNS.)

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Re:.su by reaperducer on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:26PM (#21006979)

I strongly agree. When I take notes and put files in geographic directories, I still use .oz.

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Re:.su by joombaga on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:37PM (#21007833)

How was it used?

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Re:.su by twic on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @02:12PM (#21008250)

I'm guessing that's Australia.

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Re:.su by zizee on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @05:33PM (#21010465)

Correct. Fun fact: For many years after the rest of Melbourne University moved to unimelb.edu.au the computer science department kept the domain cs.mu.oz as a nod to that history (and that they were one of the first institutions in the world to be part of the fledgling internet). I was a little sad to see that quirky disappear.

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Re:.su by EugeneOZ on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:17AM (#21005669)

Golden words

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Re:.su by abeppu on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:08PM (#21007466)

_But_ when Yugoslavia broke up, we got Montenegro with .me, which makes me smile.

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Re:.su by necovek on Friday September 20, 2019 @03:08AM (#21023940)

And I am sure Rust folks are happy there is a place to call their own (.rs for Republic of Serbia, since .s[erb] was taken long ago :).

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:23AM (#21005723)

I hope we will NOT keep it. It reminds me how my country was occupied and annexed by Soviet Union.

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Re:.su by mciancia on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:29AM (#21005791)

Maybe remove history books, they also remind people about this.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:44AM (#21005939)

Removing .su != burning books. I will tell you opposite: we should write in history books the truth about what in realty USSR was and teach children with it so tragedies like USSR never happen again.

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Re:.su by johnisgood on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:56AM (#21006678)

He is not saying that "removing .su == burning books", even though both actions lead to permanent destruction of something, I suppose.

> I hope we will NOT keep it. It reminds me how my country was occupied and annexed by Soviet Union.

Replace "it" with "history books". You hope that we will not "keep" anything that: "reminds you how your country was occupied and annexed by Soviet Union". By this reasoning alone we should not keep a lot of things (including history books) because a lot of things may remind people of something horrible. If you ask me, this is not a good basis of or justification for not keeping that something, which could be ".su", or "history books", or anything else.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:07PM (#21007445)

>Replace "it" with "history books".

I am against even burning history books from USSR that glorify USSR. BUT we should not use those books to teach history now.

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Re:.su by johnisgood on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:15PM (#21007571)

In which case it essentially boils down to: X reminds me of something bad, but I am personally OK with keeping it around. Y reminds me of something bad, too, but I am personally not OK with keeping it. All you did was being selective about it, but the underlying reason is essentially the same, you just apply it selectively based on your own values without considering anyone else's.

Although, this does not seem to meet the seemingly only criterion: "reminds me how my country was occupied and annexed by Soviet Union". History books do that, but you do not seem to want to NOT keep them. So perhaps this is not the only criterion, there is something else. What is it? Could it be subjective value? If so, I still think that it is not a good reason to get rid of something because you have not found it valuable AND reminds you of something horrible.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:35PM (#21007802)

I am not asking to remove based on that I personally dislike it. This is just my personal feelings and position.

But USSR does not exists and there is no reason to keep it. Using it is a kind of propaganda. Its place is in history books and not in the modern internet.

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Re:.su by johnisgood on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:54PM (#21008025)

> I am not asking to remove based on that I personally dislike it.

> I hope we will NOT keep it. It reminds me how my country was occupied and annexed by Soviet Union.

It seems contradictory to me. According to the dictionary, "hope" = "to want something to happen or be true". Asking for something is "to want something to happen" as well. Is this incorrect?

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @02:10PM (#21008232)

I am not asking to remove based on that I personally dislike it. I am asking to remove it based on:

>But USSR does not exists and there is no reason to keep it. Using it is a kind of propaganda. Its place is in history books and not in the modern internet.

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Re:.su by johnisgood on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @02:29PM (#21008440)

I understand that, but you initially said:

> I hope we will NOT keep it. It reminds me how my country was occupied and annexed by Soviet Union.

You mentioned nothing of the sort that you are NOW mentioning as a reason. I am glad that you are not asking for or wanting its removal because it reminds you of bad things. Perhaps it was an innocent omission, or you changed your mind. Either way, glad we could get to the bottom of it.

---

That being said, I disagree with its removal.

---

> But USSR does not exists and there is no reason to keep it. Using it is a kind of propaganda. Its place is in history books and not in the modern internet.

>> USSR does not exist

Why is its existence a prerequisite for having a TLD for it? It does not necessarily have to exist in the present (or at all).

>> There is no reason to keep it

There are many reasons. One of them could be not taking people's domains away from them.

>> Using it is a kind of propaganda

Not necessarily. One might just use it for fun, for example: sudo.su.

Plus, all TLDs could be used for "propaganda".

>> Its place is in history books and not in the modern internet.

Such domains could point to valuable resources, they might be an online equivalent of a history book, for all we know. Why should information regarding USSR not be on the Internet, under this TLD? Seems like a good fit.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @03:28PM (#21009058)

>I am glad that you are not asking for or wanting its removal because it reminds you of bad things.

I am glad you are glad.

.su was made because of USSR. USSR collapsed. .su should be removed because the reason it was made does not exists any more. Logic is simple.

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Re:.su by nobodyshere on Thursday September 19, 2019 @09:27AM (#21015927)

Its reasons for today's existence can easily change. Luckily your hate won't win this battle.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Friday September 20, 2019 @09:08AM (#21026253)

USSR collapsed. I already won.

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Re:.su by nobodyshere on Monday September 23, 2019 @09:08AM (#21048547)

Nope. They've won as long as you still hate and remember them.

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Re:.su by RobertRoberts on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:01PM (#21006748)

Every country has done something terrible to another country. There is not getting around that.

And deleting something permanently is very similar to burning something permanently.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:10PM (#21007488)

.su is for country USSR. That country does not exists any more. And that country have done many bad things to humankind. There are no reason to use it as like USSR exist now too. USSR is a history and lets keep it in the history.

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Re:.su by endtime on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:02PM (#21006754)

I agree with you about the horrors of the Soviet Union, but if you want people to know what happened, why remove a bunch of highly accessible primary sources?

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:16PM (#21007580)

>why remove a bunch of highly accessible primary sources

I agree with you that we should not remove "a bunch of highly accessible primary sources" .su is not that kind of source. .su "was assigned as the country code top-level domain" and that country does not exists. It is not like picture, book or building. Why should we use it now?

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Re:.su by endtime on Thursday September 26, 2019 @08:15PM (#21087125)

In what sense is it not like a picture?

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Re:.su by 9dl on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @07:03PM (#21011402)

In that domain literally zero sources of information

And that domain online just because of his owners greed

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Re:.su by scarmig on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:20PM (#21006929)

If there were a .nazi TLD, would there be debate about how proper it is?

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Re:.su by reaperducer on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:23PM (#21006950)

Depends on how it was used.

Holocaust museum? OK.

Michigan Militia. Nope.

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Re:.su by mopsi on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @05:49PM (#21010616)

Imagine if the Confederate states had had a TLD. What do you think, what kind of people would be using it nowadays?

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:18PM (#21007611)

At the moment .su is not used fro museums. You can use it for everything and it is not right.

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Re:.su by amalcon on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:46AM (#21006569)

My usual response to this is "keep it, but turn it into / put it in a museum". However, that seems impractical here. .su can't go in a museum any more than pi can go in a museum.

It could be a museum, but it would by nature be the only one of its kind on this topic -- so, who would get to decide what goes in the museum? The history there is too recent and too global to really find an impartial administrator anywhere.

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Re:.su by johnmulaney on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:02AM (#21006126)

There are many things that remind people of bad things. That's not an appropriate reason to remove them.

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Re:.su by gadders on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:25PM (#21006968)

I'm reminded of the confederate general statues in the USA.

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Re:.su by rabidrat on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:39AM (#21006501)

Can you imagine if there were a .nazi TLD? Would you think it appropriate to discontinue its use, despite its historical significance?

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Re:.su by yuft on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:00PM (#21006733)

Joke: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.ss

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Re:.su by johnisgood on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:11PM (#21006841)

That is not the point. There are a lot of things in the world that may remind someone of something bad. Take a look at history books. Should we not keep them either because they remind people of bad things? Of course we could use a zillion other things besides "history books" or ".su", the point is the reason behind not keeping or removing them.

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Re:.su by rabidrat on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:31PM (#21007037)

"History books" have value in aggregating and presenting information with historical context. TLDs are artifacts without context. A history book that covered the 20th century and blandly mentioned that the Soviet Union was a collection of communist states, without mentioning any other events or context, would be similarly irrelevant, and should be relegated to the trash heap. Same with the .su TLD. We should definitely keep the historical records that it existed, but there is no reason to continue its actual existence at this point.

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Re:.su by johnisgood on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:01PM (#21007366)

Those domains have value, too, to the owners, for one, and perhaps to its visitors.

> there is no reason to continue its actual existence at this point.

I might as well just reply: there is no reason to not continue. Why should we take away people's domains just because you think there is no reason to continue its actual existence? Put yourself in other people's shoes, please. Imagine if someone used this reasoning to get rid of or take away whatever you are fond of.

Perhaps these domains have no value to you, which is fine, but we should not get rid of anything just because they have no value to you.

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Re:.su by Z-T-T on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:49PM (#21007231)

Thousands of people own .su domains (I'm not one of them, FWIW). That's the reason for its actual existence at this point.

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Re:.su by gattilorenz on Thursday September 19, 2019 @02:34AM (#21013844)

A few years ago a friend found binaries of GCC and gzip for Xenix on a .su domain: https://virtuallyfun.com/wordpress/2010/03/20/gzip-for-xenix...

We were looking into Xenix as retrocomputing enthusiasts and we didn't have any compiler, so that had plenty of value for us.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:23AM (#21006359)

Demonstrating symbol of ex "country" in which there was dictatorship, occupation, annexation and genocide is act of glorification/act of paying respect of/to that "country" and its behavior.

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Re:.su by niij on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:56AM (#21006680)

What are your thoughts on the North Korean TLD https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.kp ?

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Re:.su by shitgoose on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:11PM (#21012564)

if it offends you personally, just look the other way. do not preach to others, they may have different opinion, which is just as good as yours.

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Re:.su by lucian1900 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @03:03PM (#21008779)

By that logic, we should certainly get rid of .uk and .us. Even the extremely biased accounts of the USSR that you seem to believe don’t match the continuing brutality of Anglo imperialism.

Read some history, perhaps.

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Re:.su by nobodyshere on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:53AM (#21006034)

Which one was that?

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Re:.su by egorfine on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:35AM (#21006466)

I believe he is speaking of Ukraine. It is trendy today to say things like that in Ukraine.

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Re:.su by ulzeraj on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:40AM (#21006522)

Maybe because it was trendy to starve Ukrainians when the Soviet Union existed?

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Re:.su by ethelward on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:52AM (#21006635)

They also numbered three out of nine PCUS general secretary.

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Re:.su by nobodyshere on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @12:18PM (#21006908)

Ukrainians were not the only ones to suffer from the famines back then. Multiple parts of the USSR actually did. It doesn't seem like a targeted action on behalf of the govt.

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Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:31PM (#21007752)

>Multiple parts of the USSR actually did.

Yes but not like in Ukraine.

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Re:.su by nobodyshere on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @06:16PM (#21010917)

Yeah, sure.

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Re:.su by blfr on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:04PM (#21007400)

Communism was such a disaster you can barely tell whether its genocides were intentional!

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Re:.su by Nasreddin_Hodja on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @11:56AM (#21006684)

Poland I guess...

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[dead]

Re:.su by vasili111 on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:30PM (#21007735)

I am from Georgia, not Ukraine. First of all they are Nationalists, not Nazists. I am not supporting nationalist too but anyway that is very different terms even if they can sound similarly. Second I am pretty sure you can find hundreds of real nazist in any country. But even if we suppose that people on video are nazist making inference about country based on minority is very big mistake.

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Re:.su by shitgoose on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:25PM (#21012656)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion

their commander Biletskij is MP in Ukrainian parlament. they are still a legitimate force in Ukraine.

wolfsangel on their flag - google it who doesn't know. nationalists, my ass. you cannot find that in "any" country.

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Re:.su by 9dl on Friday September 20, 2019 @10:36PM (#21033145)

>wolfsangel on their flag

nope

It is just abbreviation

And u can find people which like nazis in any country.

Btw when u find them in ur country check who in ruSSian federation curate them

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Re:.su by aatharuv on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @04:08PM (#21009526)

The "Neonazi" country you refer to simultaneously had a head of state and a head of government who were Jewish until a couple of months back.

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Re:.su by toyg on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @06:28PM (#21011064)

Unfortunate lack of comma - do you mean they converted to another religion now? /s

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Re:.su by shitgoose on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:14PM (#21012583)

i heard that Zelenski is jewish, isn't he?

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Re:.su by Sommer_Son on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @01:28PM (#21007720)

No,the usual suspects - Russian Nazi March in Moscow: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AP2o13mxRpo

Or https://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la-fg-russia-neonazi-20...

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Re:.su by shitgoose on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @10:32PM (#21012700)

Russian nazis are not sitting in the Russian parliament and do not have their own battalions, like their Ukrainian peers (see Azov battalion).

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Re:.su by gdy on Wednesday September 18, 2019 @05:56PM (#21010682)

That was in 2011. Since that time Putin has been cracking down on Russian nationalists - some got jailed for real crimes they committed, the number of participants in so called "Russian Marches" went down from 10000 to less than 500, number of hate crimes has been similarly reduced.

The Ukraine is moving in the opposite direction.

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