There is nothing specific to the "Pro" line of Apple products that couldn't be applied to the rest of the line. However, I'll keep my comment specific to MacOS on notebooks.

Every Windows flagship laptop I've tried to adopt since I made the switch has left me wanting to go back to Apple. I've become addicted to the trackpad. Everything else feels sluggish and gross. Even on devices with glass trackpads, I can't get the responsiveness that I feel like I get with Apple. Combine that with the battery life, and it's really tough for me to give in to what has now become comfortable.

Couple that with iTerm 2 and homebrew, and Apple has be deep in their clutches. Though honestly, I think I app switch far faster in Windows.

I hate that I can't find satisfaction elsewhere. I'm excited to see the next iteration of WSL and the new terminal interface. Maybe then, Windows will finally be able to give my brain some much needed competition.

Bought the ThinkPad x1 carbon as a replacement for my 2015 MBP a few days back and the experience has been really disappointing.

It took me a couple of hours just to install all the latest updates/drivers/bios updates. The Lenovo provided "updater" software is just horrible. The windows UX actually feels nice for me, just need to get used to it. Setting up development environment has been a struggle though. Linux subsystem feels super slow and the lack of good terminal makes it even worse. Upcoming WSL 2 update and the new terminal should improve this though but I wouldn't hold my breath.

In conclusion - I'm not recommending switching to windows. There's basically nothing that feels better than on Macs, except that the laptop itself was a lot cheaper.

EDIT: + I'm really impressed that I can still sell the old macbook for like 600€. The ThinkPad will probably depreciate in value a lot more.

If you'd like a pretty reasonable terminal right now you can look at ConEmu or cmder (which is a further customised version of ConEmu). You get tabs and reasonable key shortcuts etc.

I'm also looking forward to the new terminal though, I hope it'll be a lot nicer.

Installing cmder, which runs over ConEmu, gives you a really nice terminal with lots of configurability.

If you are a Mac power-user and have gotten used to all the conventions (e.g. window behavior, shortcuts, UI interactions), you won't be able to last 5 minutes on Windows. Every once in a while I have to logon to a Windows computer for work and just fiddling with the Start Menu frustrates me. To me, the Windows UX experience is horrible enough to keep me on Mac despite all the growing issues with Macbook hardware.

I've been switching back and forth between Windows and OS X since 10.2 and honestly, I really like the Windows 10 UX as a pretty keyboard friendly UX out of the box, hell I even prefer it to the Mac these days. Launching my pinned apps are bound to win+[1-9], All my setting and systems menus are under win+X, win+arrow keys for tiling windows, win+ctrl+left/right arrow switches virtual desktops, and for everything else I just hit the win key and start typing whatever I'm searching for.

My only real complaint is that the file explorer hasn't really been updated in ages and isn't exactly great.

I've been using a Surface Go after failing to get use from an iPad Pro. I find I use the Surface more than any of my other machines. Nearly perfect. Makes me plan on getting the next gen Surface Pro instead of a MacBook where the only hard requirement was for Xcode which can be relegated to any other old machine.

I used to use a Macbook, in fact I had two of them. I used the as my daily driver from 2008-2014.

I have also used Linux on my workstation, (development machine) that doubled as a Windows gaming workstation and on my servers.

When it came to buying a new laptop I decided to go with a XPS 13" 9370. Hardware support has been great. The touchpad (Elantech) is also excellent and very similar to what I had on my Macbook.

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Dell_XPS_13_(9370)

Looking back now, I always preferred open source software, vim, firefox, libreoffice, LaTeX, etc regardless of platform.

If I was to compare my efficiency with either Windows or MacOS, I'd have to say I prefer a tiling window manager now (I use i3wm https://i3wm.org) and am really looking forward to the drop-in replacement https://swaywm.org for Wayland.

Wanting to use Wayland will certainly influence me to buy one of the upcoming AMD Navi GPUs, due to be released soon over a NVIDIA one.

PS: btw i use arch, I do also use Debian too in some cases.

I wouldn't necessarily agree with that.

- Hitting the windows key on the keyboard gets you to a search that is similar enough to spotlight that you don't have to even mess with the start menu. - Once you understand windows are document, not application based, switching becomes easier.

I'm not sure what other interactions you would have trouble with. For the most part, it's just the difference between the button you hit on the keyboard for everything.

The reverse is also true: On windows i do everything on keyboard (i usually work with desktop / external kbd & mouse). It's possible to navigate everything in windows with the kbd, while that s not true in macs, which frustrates me about them. They have crippled the start menu with spam, that is true, but all you need is win key and start searching just like spotlight.

> while that s not true in macs

If you're talking about Alt-Tab vs Command-Tab, you can rotate through windows within a single app using Command-Backquote. It took me forever to figure that out but it made a world of difference.

Thanks for the comment, I've been using macs since 10.2 and didn't know that. I guess today is my lucky day.

You can also create new bindings to arbitrary menu items. I used to bind maximize to Cmd + Ñ.

For me, in Ubuntu, I used multiple workspaces. Moving applications between the workspaces was a breeze and was keyboard only. Mac requires a mouse to move between workspaces. Now that I'm on a Mac, I had to abandon multiple workspaces.

I use both, usually Windows during the day at the client site and macos at home and for side projects. I use the same tools, like vscode with vim keybindings, and work almost entirely from the keyboard, using the win key or cmd-spbr for app launching. Switching isn't much of a problem when you are writing software.

I used only Windows until ~5 years ago, and I still have a Windows desktop at home for gaming/casual computing, so I'm not really averse to Windows on UX grounds (especially since it's improved window management so much recently).

The 2015 MacBook Pro is fantastic.

Excellent keyboard, hdmi port, sane size trackpad, beautiful display you can open and close as many times as you want. No touchbar, so all keys are finger-find-able. Excellent durability. More than fast enough. Oh, and MagSafe.

No dongles, no humiliation.

After you use the 2016+, the 2015 feels like a ton of lead

I have both. I waited the longest time to switch because I wanted Linux which is what the 2015 can do

2015 also has the old shitty ports and only 2 usb

I do not have a dongle but at my desk I have a 10-port usba for legacy hardware. usba was deprecated in 2017. for me since 2016, it's all usbc

but really, 2015 is big and heavy and the fan runs a lot and top it off has the old shitty keyboard

So on the other side, if anyone is reading.

I LOVE the dongle. Instead of unplugging multiple cables each time I go to a meeting, I take one out and that's it. When I return I plug it back in. Humiliation? No one cares tbh.

Keyboard was strange the first week to two but now I don't mind it at all.

Trackpad size, no problems there. It's bigger, so what?

Let's see about the display.

Touchbar is pretty good. I use it mostly for volume and brightness tbh, same as I did with the keys. The sliding mechanics of the touchbar allows me to adjust them better imo.

Magsafe is something I thought I would miss a lot, but I don't. The USB C cable is so easy to take out anyway, so I think if someone trips over it it might work as well as the magsafe. Let's see (never happened in 7 years so far).

I was handed a 2015 Pro when I started this current job and they were apologetic they didn't have a 2018 Pro available for me like the other members of my team. I told them to cancel the order.

Agreed. Pinnacle of the laptops. I am riding mine 'til it is dead, then I'm worried what I'll do.

You will send it to Louis Rossman, and he’ll fix it :)

Yes, and it feels like a silver lining of the end of Moore's Law that I get to keep using it.

I use a 2015 MBP as my daily machine.

I actually _upgraded_ to a 2017 MBP 13" without trackpad for 13 days. It was _OK_ but not enough of an upgrade to justify an upgrade. Dongletown wasn't fun either. I returned it for a refund.

I want to upgrade at the moment (8GB of RAM isn't ideal for my uses), but I can't justify the upgrade just yet. I'll really miss MagSafe and a HDMI cord slot.

I moved from a MacBook Pro to a high-end PixelBook (Google's Chromebook), and I love it. ChromeOS now has Crostini, which is a Debian container running inside (and well-integrated with) ChromeOS. I run lots of IntelliJ tools (Webstorm, PyCharm, Datagrip), Node.js servers, python servers, Postgres, MySQL, docker, etc. from the Linux instance and it works great. Lots of info and conversation is available on the Crostini subreddit.

Do you know how straightforward it is to totally strip all Google software from the thing and run Linux directly? The PixelBook looks like a nice piece of hardware, but I don't trust Google.

Last I checked it was still a pain to get everything working.

Speaking of, the original Pixel laptop was the best laptop I've ever used that wasn't a Mac. I wish they would update it and give a clean path to Debian.

There is no alternative for MacBook Pro

It's not ideology for me but hardware performance It ties you to macOS, though

Other brands do not put the hardware ports on or use fossil hdmi usba or all sorts of garbage. They also do not have the hardware life of a mac. Who but Apple put 4 TB in a laptop? Apple use the silicon two years before anybody else

Who but Apple gives you 160 Gb/s of Thunderbolt? It's just amazingly great. And check their ssd speeds, they are so fast you don't believe the numbers at first

The butterfly is for me, as measured, the fastest keyboard I have ever used

Apple still has some shit going on like magSafe firewire lightning but mbpro does not suffer from that. Just no Linux since 2016

And Apple has the genius bar. In nine years they have never failed. In all cases but two on the sport (ie. hours), once in a day, once in 5 days. You do not have to troubleshoot hardware poopy, Apple does that for you. For free.

So max RAM 1 TB disk is like $3,200 these days Get one if you can afford it, everything else is misery

I dont think there is an MBP equivalent in hardware. That said , i wonder why do developers work in laptops, which are extremely anti-ergonomic and generally terrible for working long hours. My solution is a good thinkpad + a docking station with a big screen, mechanical kbd & vertical mouse.

For me personally:

- A trackpad is much faster and more ergonomic than a separate mouse

- Being able to just pick up your workstation and take it to a meeting, a colleague's desk, or home is extremely convenient

- As you say, you can always hook them up to a dock if you need a different arrangement for long hours

Agreed. I usually am at my desk and use an external monitor and keyboard/mouse. But when I am away from my desk, the laptop matters.

I prefer using the built-in keyboard and trackpad even at my desk (2015 MBP). I plug in an external monitor, but I mostly use the laptop as a laptop.

I've just switched from a MacBook Pro 2011 15" to a Thinkpad X1 Extreme 15". I've been putting off making a decision for quite a while, hoping Apple would sort out the horrifying keyboard issues.

The difference in price between macs and windows back in 2011 wasn't as great as it is now and that really made my toes curl when I spec'd out the next machine. I've 32GB of memory in the X1 and I can boost that later to 64GB which, as a software developer, lets me run a lot of VMs and Docker containers. The trackpad may be no match but the keyboard is much better. The X1 is really quite sleek so I don't feel I'm losing too much of the great Apple design aesthetic.

I'd still prefer a mac but right now I can't wait around for them to sort out their issues.

I've been thinking the same. Furthermore speccing out a desktop box with big specs is just so expensive with Apple.

That said, my "travel laptop" is my old 2015 MacBook Pro and I absolutely love it. If it breaks though... I just can't imagine I can justify OSX anymore.

My main concern is the operating system, honestly. I really enjoy OSX, and I hate dealing with random things breaking. OSX is really stable for me, especially if I don't upgrade to new versions right away (lol). I don't know what I can do about the OS..

I really really wish someone would make a pay-only, detailed linux OS. Nail the hardware, drivers, etc. Make the OS pretty, but don't try and reinvent every app under the sun - be sustainable. I'd happily pay $100-200 (yearly for new versions too) for an OS experience on Linux that tried hard to fight those time consuming issues and gave me an OSX experience. Argh.

On the Dell XPS 13 you can get Ubuntu preinstalled, officially-supported drivers and everything. From what I hear it's a pretty good setup. My main hangup is that it's only on the 13, not the 15-inch.

Mine is a bit of a controversial opinion but, personally, after having tried it for a week, I find the keyboard extremely bad for a power user which works on it for long hours. Just because of that I would not consider the recent design of macbooks pro good for a developer

Work got me a new mbp recently and it is glitchy, overpriced, bad to type or trackpad on, and has the insulting Touch Bar. Supposedly the processor is faster but even with 2 extra cores it’s unnoticeable. The only improved area vs my personal 2013 mbp is the weight is about 10% less, which is noticeable. There’s a reason I haven’t upgraded my personal machine.

switched some time ago from OSX (15" MPB 2013) to Linux (13" Zenbook UX32LN), and recently to Windows + WSL (15" Surface Book 2 - damn, this piece of hardware is great)- I think I'm gonna never miss any other system - WSL is what I've been missing all these years on Windows.

I got a new MacBook Pro after my last job change and it’s been a major pain point. I used the pre-2016 MacBook pros for the last few years with no problems, but the usb-c ones have trouble with external monitors, logging in, etc.

I moved from a 2015 MBP to a ThinkPad T470s. I am very happy with the hardware and even get along with Windows, now that WSL is a thing. I was using Homebrew for package management and its so much nicer to have apt.

1) How's the trackpad? I think that's one of the hardest things to match in a non-Apple laptop. I hear they've gotten much better, but they used to be really really bad so I'm not sure how they compare now.

2) It's unclear to me exactly how WSL would affect workflow. Are you able to basically pretend that Windows has native bash, or are there caveats like there are in Cygwin?

I've used a post-2016 MBP Trackpad only in passing and found it infuriating how many phantom touches it registered. With the ThinkPad I mainly use the Trackpoint and sometimes the Trackpad for gestures. No complaints however it was nicer to click anywhere on the MBP Trackpad whereas you have to aim your clicks more on the ThinkPad.

WSL is not Cygwin, it is so much better its not funny.

I’ve had a good experience with the 2016 and now the 2018. Didn’t have any keyboard issues, fortunately.

I work with Macbooks but I've always had Windows PCs at home.

Try the keyboard on the new MBP. If you agree with me that its literally the worst keyboard in the history of PCs, and you don't want to deal with the hassle of using a bluetooth keyboard to replace it, then you might want to switch to a Windows laptop. If you like the keyboard (and while I struggle to understand it many people actually love it), then its still one of the better options on the market for high end hardware.

I use Win/Linux/Mac OS on a daily basis for work. Each OS has its benefits.

I'm not sure why, but the way a mouse works in Windows is so much better than MacOS that it renders mice almost unusable on Macs. Best case scenario you manage to get mouse acceleration kind of disabled, so its just unpleasant instead of unusable. I think the way mice handle very badly on Macs may be why mac users are so in love with the Mac's touchpad. I've tried the magic mouse and a bunch of Logitech/Microsoft mice and no matter what I do it isn't smooth or accurate. For a long time, I felt Windows' command line / powershell were a huge drawback. However, the Linux subsystem, while not a perfect solution, has done a lot to even the playing field.

Mac OS is great for a few reasons. Once again I'm not sure why but Apple's touchpad is so much better than Windows' that 99.99% of Windows touchpads seem borderline unusable. I would still prefer using a mouse if it weren't for the issues described above, but Mac's touchpad is still very pleasant to use and the gestures are great.

The second thing I love about Macs is how easy it is to run every platform on a Mac. VMWare fusion is affordable and amazing. Windows, Linux, and Mac VMs run as flawlessly as can be expected. In comparison, on Windows' version of VMWare you have to jump through a bunch of hoops to even get a Mac OS VM working, let alone running smoothly. Linux VMs are hit or miss. Sometimes they work great out of the box, sometimes they require a lot of tweaking. For a more anecdotal comment, for a dev environment, I really enjoy the workflow of Mac more than Windows or Linux.

Linux's biggest selling point is the amount of freedom and power you have within the OS, combined with a proper unix command line system. Its a great dev environment. However, I think it still isn't ready for the desktop for most people. Even the easiest Linux distro still takes more work than it should. Every once in a while I have to spend half a day troubleshooting something that broke when I either installed or updated it.

If I had to pick one for home use, I would pick Windows all day long because proper mouse support is important to me and I am somewhat of a gamer. I just wish Windows actually was a Unix clone instead of having to settle for the Unix subsystem.

If I had to pick one for work, MacOS would hands-down be my top pick if it weren't for the fact that they refuse to admit that they designed a defective keyboard and remove it from future models. I currently have a 2017 model. I was using a 2013 model until it died. I tried to trade the new one for a 2015 with the good keyboard, but I'm stuck with it for now. Another thing to consider is that I had my 2017 MBP for 2 months before the logic board had to be replaced due to a faulty sensor. If they don't improve things considerably, my next work machine will probably be Windows.

> If you agree with me that its literally the worst keyboard in the history of PCs

I'm not picky about keyboards; as long as it isn't mushy I'm happy. Of course, if it literally breaks that's a separate problem.

> the way a mouse works in Windows is so much better than MacOS that it renders mice almost unusable on Macs.

Definitely agree here, though I prefer touchpads either way so it's moot for me.

> Even the easiest Linux distro still takes more work than it should. Every once in a while I have to spend half a day troubleshooting something that broke when I either installed or updated it.

Yeah, this the main reason I'm hesitant to use it for real work. I don't want to pull mental resources away from what I'm actually working on just to keep things running. I do wonder how the preinstalled, officially-supported Linux laptops compare though.

> I had my 2017 MBP for 2 months before the logic board had to be replaced due to a faulty sensor

Did they fix this for free, like the keyboards? If they fix all the problematic hardware at no cost to me then I think I can live with it. What I can't justify is spending $2,4000 on a laptop which soon after requires expensive repairs.

>Did they fix this for free, like the keyboards?

They did fix it and return in in just a few days. They offered to give me a loaner, but my company had already taken care of that. Customer service was very good. It sucks that they are so busy you have to make an appointment, but other than that the personnel were friendly, professional, and good at their jobs.