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Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by xg15 on Thursday January 03, 2019 @10:49AM (#18815953)
I wonder if Fuchsia will really become a consumer brand though. If I understood it right, the original motivation was a desire to get rid of the Linux/GNU heritage in Android.

If that is the case I could imagine that Fuchsia might not become a separate "product" for consumers at all - instead, Google could replace Android's implementation "under the hood" with it but still present it as just another Android version brand/UI wise.

If they managed to do the same with Chrome OS, the'd actually have archieved consolidation on a technical level without causing consumer confusion. (Well, more than there already is)

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by steelframe on Thursday January 03, 2019 @11:04AM (#18816097)
Google still needs to replace literally millions of LoC in the Linux kernel from hardware vendors like Qualcomm before they can actually ship a real functional phone.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by xg15 on Thursday January 03, 2019 @01:35PM (#18817725)
Weren't they working on a sort of unified "hardware abstraction layer" for Android anyways? - Which would put all the vendor-specific code "below" the kernel and would allow them to reuse the same OS image on different devices.

In that case, the Fuchsia kernel could just be another "client" to that layer.

(just speculating here, no idea if that is in any way what they're planning)

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by mda on Thursday January 03, 2019 @11:26AM (#18816291)
If they limit their hardware choices (like Apple) it is actually not -that- difficult.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by Bombthecat on Thursday January 03, 2019 @12:33PM (#18817016)
Wasn't there a rumor that Google wants to build there own CPU?
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by Redoubts on Thursday January 03, 2019 @01:07PM (#18817401)
It would be surprising if Fuchsia followed linux by not having a stable ABI for drivers. Setting up a stable interface would make it easier for Google to label that "not my problem."
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pjmlp on Thursday January 03, 2019 @02:43PM (#18818495)
Android has a stable ABI for drivers since Treble, which kind of forced Linux into a pseudo-microkernel architecture, allowing for user space drivers written in either Java or C++, communicating over the HIDL messages/shared mem.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by izacus on Thursday January 03, 2019 @02:28PM (#18818345)
Why would they? Since 8.0, Android is fully separate from Linux kernel through its so-called Treble layer (see https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2017/05/here-comes... ) and doesn't really need Linux or POSIX sematics for its functionality.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pjmlp on Thursday January 03, 2019 @02:40PM (#18818474)
Since Treble's adoption was rather low, given that it was optional when updating from Android 7, one of the decisions on Android 9 was to make it even more independent with the introduction of Generic System Image.

https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2018/11/an-update-...

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by izacus on Thursday January 03, 2019 @03:55PM (#18819193)
What do you mean by low adoption? Every device launching with 8 has to support it.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pjmlp on Thursday January 03, 2019 @04:20PM (#18819400)
About 12% worldwide adoption, about when Android 9 got released.

OEMs got around Treble certification by releasing mostly devices with Android 7 on them.

And given that OEMs were the ones supposed to push Treble updates not Google, even those that released devices with 8 weren't that active pushing them.

Which has finally made Google include some update requirements on the Play Services access.

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by derefr on Thursday January 03, 2019 @12:56PM (#18817263)
Maybe Fuchsia uses a lobotomized Linux kernel, together with such firmware blobs, as a (likely sandboxed) monolithic multi-driver?
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pkaye on Thursday January 03, 2019 @02:29PM (#18818355)
The code for the Fuchsia kernel is available. It doesn't seem derived from Linux.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pm90 on Thursday January 03, 2019 @01:33PM (#18817701)
How hard is it to rewrite drivers? Or is the problem that companies do not write others write these drivers?
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by simcop2387 on Thursday January 03, 2019 @02:05PM (#18818102)
Pretty hard, not only is it nearly impossible to get documentation for some of the hardware, even if you get it it'll usually be under some kind of NDA which means you can publish the driver. Then there's all kinds of errata and hardware quirks that aren't going to be in the documentation (maybe in future updates to the documentation) it ends up a full time job for multiple people to maintain just a single driver for a few products.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by hermitdev on Thursday January 03, 2019 @03:19PM (#18818896)
> it'll usually be under some kind of NDA which means you can publish the driver.

Did you mean cannot publish?

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by simcop2387 on Thursday January 03, 2019 @06:43PM (#18820537)
Yep, missed that when reviewing the comment and it's now too late to edit.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by hermitdev on Thursday January 03, 2019 @08:35PM (#18821242)
No worries. Seemed like that's what you meant, but just wanted to clarify.
Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by newnewpdro on Thursday January 03, 2019 @03:31PM (#18818997)
> get rid of the Linux/GNU heritage in Android

What GNU heritage? Android has only ever used the Linux kernel to get a leg up on hardware support in the early days. AFAIK there has never been any GNU userspace of any sort in anything Android related, much to the chagrin of the Linux community.

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pjmlp on Friday January 04, 2019 @02:01AM (#18822455)
Many never read beyond the headlines.

The NDK is constrained in what it can do, as per security concerns.

There is termux as port of GNU on Android, but only applications that rely on plain ISO C, ISO C++ can be ported.

Syscalls support is hit and miss per devices, as it isn't part of official NDKs APIs.

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by neolefty on Thursday January 03, 2019 @04:45PM (#18819605)
I gathered (from the outside — no inside knowledge) it was two big things:

* A response to Java lawsuits

* Something to work on that is interesting

But you raise a good point — why let go of Linux? Seems like a risky case of rewrite-from-scratch.

What are the odds it works out? It's not a sure thing. And what would the benefits be?

Re:Google’s Fuchsia OS Confirmed to Have Android App Support... by pjmlp on Friday January 04, 2019 @01:56AM (#18822440)
MIT license and microkernel design.