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Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by Reedx on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:34PM (#18771382)
> ...has popularized the battle royale category — think Lord of the Flies meets Hunger Games — almost single-handedly...

Almost single-handedly? This is a bizarre claim and it's like rewriting history.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by alexeldeib on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:44PM (#18771473)
Besides PUBG, who else has done this in a successful way? Fortnite wasn’t the original but it blows the success of PUBG out of the water at this point. I’m okay with “PUBG + Fortnite” ~= “almost single handedly”.

I think the key word in that quote is popularized — even if earlier games did it, these are the two to demonstrate widespread appeal.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by ehsankia on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:07PM (#18771672)
The order in video games, as far as I can make it was:

Minecraft (hunger game mod) > DayZ/H1Z1 > PUBG > Fortnite

At each step, the genre grew by 1 or 2 orders or magnitude. So while Fortnite is by far the largest BR game now, if you look at the log-graph, they each had an almost equal impact on getting to where we are today and are an important part of the genre's history.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by vanattab on Thursday December 27, 2018 @03:13PM (#18772235)
I am pretty sure there was an Arma mod that directly inspired pubg in there somewhere. Maybe even older then then hunger games mod.

Edit: Oh I just looked it up. The mod was PUBG. I just realized it was the same guy who made it. It was released as a mod for Arma in 2015 by a player who went by the handle "PlayerUnknown". So I guess it was after the minecraft mod.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by zhoujianfu on Friday December 28, 2018 @02:01AM (#18775260)
Don’t forget super bomberman 2!
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by Reedx on Thursday December 27, 2018 @03:48PM (#18772515)
Right, the problem is they didn't say PUBG + Fortnite. That's not single-handedly.

PUBG proved out the incredible appeal and potential of Battle Royale. Despite being a technical mess, it was a massive success and a game changer for the industry. It was the key catalyst and why Fortnite (and many others) added the mode.

This is not to take anything away from Fortnite though! They absolutely took it to the next level of awareness.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by TAForObvReasons on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:06PM (#18771655)
Also worth pointing out that PUBG uses unreal, so Epic Games makes money off the royalties AND gets visibility into the PUBG sales data. It's very likely that seeing those numbers made Epic Games shift focus.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by jsnell on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:11PM (#18771705)
The PUBG sales numbers were visible to everyone in realtime: during the heyday of PUBG Steamspy was still accurate, and the game was only being sold on Steam. Any visibility Epic got from the licensing revenue would have been irrelevant.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by andyfleming on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:16PM (#18771741)
Plenty of games have had elimination modes for a long time. This is really just an evolution of that adding the mechanic of the map edges closing in.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by ehsankia on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:19PM (#18771768)
Elimination mode is more generic. The battle royale subgenre started with the Minecraft hunger game mode, and grew more popular by H1Z1: King of the Hill, and then by PUBG.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by cthalupa on Thursday December 27, 2018 @04:45PM (#18772888)
>The battle royale subgenre started with the Minecraft hunger game mode, and grew more popular by H1Z1: King of the Hill, and then by PUBG.

Minecraft had nothing to do with it. PU was inspired by the Battle Royale novel/movie and The Running Man. He forked the Day Z ARMA2 mod and made DayZ: Battle Royale, and that predates H1Z1 KotH by 3 years.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by bpicolo on Thursday December 27, 2018 @04:01PM (#18772597)
> but it blows the success of PUBG out of the water at this point

That's really downplaying the success of PUBG though. It was the #1 most watched game on Twitch before Fortnite overtook it. Sure, Fortnite is more popular now, but PUBG was literally the most popular game at the reveleant time.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by pssflops on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:53PM (#18771549)
Is it even more odd that I can't figure why they did not reference the literal movie 'Battle Royale' that the concept was roughly based on?
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by megaremote on Thursday December 27, 2018 @05:48PM (#18773339)
Battle Royale is not a game. They are talking about the game category. Battle Royale wasn't even a huge film, more a cult film.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by badpun on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:00PM (#18771615)
I always saw it as inspired by the Hunger Games, which in turn captured the zeitgeist of the post-2001 and post-2008 society.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by twunde on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:08PM (#18771678)
It's almost certainly the other way around since Battle Royale was published in 1999 and the Battle Royale film came out in 2000. Both probably take some inspiration from Lord of the Flies
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by badpun on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:17PM (#18771745)
But why did the genre blow up only now? I think that the mass culture projects massive amount of anxiety present in todays societies, and it is also visible in video games. I don't see how a bleak and dystopian game of dog-eat-dog, everyone on its own, 1 player wins and the 99 others lose, would be so popular in say 1995.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by yqh on Thursday December 27, 2018 @03:07PM (#18772178)
I think you're looking for a deep meaning that is not there. Video games are fun, period. The 12-yos that play Fortnite couldn't care less about dystopias.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by user5994461 on Thursday December 27, 2018 @08:21PM (#18774153)
There might be meaning in the timeline actually.

Internet was hardly available in the year 2000. It takes a lot of bandwidth (and probably CPU too) to run a 100 players FPS. It wouldn't do well before broadband got ubiquitous, almost a decade later.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by chillacy on Friday December 28, 2018 @02:48AM (#18775381)
> But why did it blow up only now

That doesn’t change the fact that BR predates the hunger games (though the author claims to not have heard about BR when she wrote the hunger games).

BR is supposedly about how the old of japan are metaphorically sacrificing the youth. The hunger games was (according to an interview) about reality tv meets the war in Iraq.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:58PM (#18771600)
I don't think you're appreciating the penetration that Fortnite has. PUBG may have come first, but Fortnite has 10x the players.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by techopoly on Thursday December 27, 2018 @03:42PM (#18772479)
Not sure what Lord of the Flies has to do with battle royale...
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by minimaxir on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:41PM (#18771448)
This can be debated. Although Rust/H1Z1/PUBG were certainly popular battle royale games before Fortnite, Fortnite was the only one that brought it mainstream, outside the hardcore gamer ecosystem.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by chc4 on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:44PM (#18771480)
I'm sorry? PUBG sold 50 million copies. It is the 5th highest selling game in history. You can't honestly claim that's not mainstream.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by jasode on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:13PM (#18771716)
>You can't honestly claim that's not mainstream.

I see that minimaxir has been downvoted so it seems "mainstream" has different meanings.

I don't play video games and don't keep up with them. I've never heard of PUBG. But nevertheless, I did hear about Fortnite. Why? Because a business analyst on Youtube did a business case study[0] about Epic Games and the development history of Fortnite. That was unusual because he typically analyzes non-game companies[1] like Amazon, Uber, Stripe, GoPro, Theranos, etc.

My point is that there must have been a noticeable step change in popularity level between PUBG and Fortnite such that it entered his consciousness and justified a business case study from him -- which in turn entered my consciousness. If "mainstream" isn't the right word to use to describe Fortnite's greater reach to non-gamers, I don't know what a substitute word would be.

Also, I know what the "floss dance" is and that it's in Fortnite. If PUBG or other video games have named dances, I don't even know of their existence.

[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDlFLBEUqWk

[1] https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=biz+doc

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by megaremote on Thursday December 27, 2018 @05:54PM (#18773387)
So your idea of mainstream is whatever videos you happen to run across?

Now, I do agree with you, but more to do with your point about the flossy dance, since seeing stuff from games leak into real life consistently is pretty mainstream.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by minimaxir on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:57PM (#18771588)
That's why I added "outside the hardcore gamer ecosystem". PUBG was incredibly big yes, but parents weren't asking questions about their children's addiction to PUBG and talk shows didn't have long segments about PUBG.

Fortnite became a place for people to hang out: https://twitter.com/anoopr/status/1071921080485457920

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:09PM (#18771686)
I think it's hard for gamers to really appreciate what Fortnite is. It's a whole new thing, that's never happened before. It's bigger than Pacman, Pokemon, Mario, Tetris, Angry Birds, etc.

My brother, a college football player, plays it. My sister, an Instagram addict and high schooler, plays it on her phone while shopping at, I dunno, Forever 21 I guess.

This is new, and worth paying attention to.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by sharpneli on Thursday December 27, 2018 @04:20PM (#18772739)
Minecraft. Pokemon Go. These things come and go. There is always some new fad.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Friday December 28, 2018 @12:13PM (#18777987)
This is the biggest, by an order of magnitude.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:59PM (#18771603)
Compared to Fortnite, 50 million isn't that much.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by theresistor on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:05PM (#18771646)
50 million copies, not $50 million. Assuming an average selling price of $30 and a 30% storefront cut, that’s about $1 billion in revenue.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:07PM (#18771665)
Sorry you're right, but 50 million copies is not much either, when compared to Fortnite.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by kels on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:18PM (#18771767)
Maybe not compared to a free game like Fortnite, but 50 million copies is huge when it comes to video game sales. The 50 million number is from Xbox and PC only.

GTA V is the top grossing game of all time and sold 90 million copies on 3 platforms. Minecraft has sold 150 across way more platforms and has been around way longer.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:34PM (#18771881)
That's my point, Fortnite is bigger than a "video game". It's a legitimate cultural phenomenon.

This isn't about video games anymore, it's about tapping into something bigger. Even Minecraft couldn't crack into the market segments Fortnite has.

Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by chii on Thursday December 27, 2018 @04:12PM (#18772672)
Conversely, neither fortnite (nor any other game) has cracked the Minecraft market segment.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by diminoten on Friday December 28, 2018 @12:13PM (#18777992)
Fortnite is much bigger, both in terms of players and in terms of cultural impact, than Minecraft.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by andyfleming on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:12PM (#18771706)
They're different pricing models. Fortnite is free to play and PUBG has an up-front cost. Copies sold/downloaded or peak active player-base is probably a more relevant comparison.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by chii on Thursday December 27, 2018 @04:12PM (#18772677)
Why not just computer revenue directly?
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by brianwawok on Thursday December 27, 2018 @02:05PM (#18771645)
copies not dollars
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by jVinc on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:44PM (#18771474)
Battle royal was already popular enough for Epic to drop everything they had and shift focus to the genere without any doubt that it was the correct thing to do. To give them credit for the popularity of the genre is to rewrite history.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by thedaemon on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:46PM (#18771488)
This is exactly it! Fortnite was a team based fps/rts before it saw the cash cow that is the Battle Royale.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by ethbro on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:51PM (#18771524)
Wasn't the iPhone the first smartphone? /s
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by earenndil on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:44PM (#18771477)
I disagree. PUBG was _insanely_ popular well before fortnite showed up.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by justwalt on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:52PM (#18771533)
Right. PUBG is still immensely popular with hundreds of thousands of steam players daily, and I believe it saw player growth in a recent month.
Re:Epic Games banked a $3B profit in 2018 by subway on Thursday December 27, 2018 @01:46PM (#18771492)
You can even trace it back even earlier to Arma2 and DayZ (mod).