News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by dev_420 on Friday June 29, 2018 @02:23PM (#17426479)
Throwaway because obviously the stigma. But yes, it's very real. I am addicted to marijuana. I smoke nearly 3 grams a day; what has become a $1000+/month habit. I've always loved weed but the high salary has allowed me to lose control. I can't sleep or eat without it. Within 24 hours without weed I become an intolerable asshole who cannot eat or sleep. When I do sleep without it, it's full of nightmares and I wake up soaked in a puddle of sweat. I tell myself I am going to quit after every single joint, then I roll another. I know it could be broken with a few months of detox but it's too painful to deal with.

That being said I don't think it has anything intrinsically to do with weed. People are just as addicted to cheeseburgers or coffee. The problem is a combination of personal character flaw, and a society that forces people into self medication of all forms.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by zolthrowaway on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:44PM (#17427223)
I was able to quit after like a 5+ year pretty excessive habit. There were three steps that really helped me. 1) I removed all accessories from my home. I sold/gave away all of my pipes, vapes, e-nails, etc. 2) I started taking nootropics. For me personally, l-theanine, caffeine, and a multivitamin did wonders. Even if it's placebo (which I don't think it is) it really helped mitigate the appetite and fogginess issues for me. 3) Telling my friends I'm not smoking anymore. I established that I'm not smoking. A lot of them initially tried to get me to smoke. It's something they enjoy and I used to enjoy. I had to explain how I felt. The real friends stayed and others flaked out which is totally fine with me.

I do certainly understand the psychological addiction. It takes a toll. I definitely have unhealthy vices I'd like to cut back on, but for me personally, the steps above were enough to take me from waking up in the middle of the night to rip dabs to being totally sober. If you are interested in quitting, I would honestly recommend giving the above steps a try.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by naner on Saturday June 30, 2018 @01:25AM (#17429607)
L-theanine and caffeine are considered nootroopics? That's just a cup of tea...
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by HiroshiSan on Saturday June 30, 2018 @12:10PM (#17431324)
LOL love this comment. It's the 'starter-kit' if you will, recommended on /r/nootropics.

I've been doing it for a while though I'm not sure I really notice anything :/.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by wmccullough on Saturday June 30, 2018 @08:06AM (#17430542)
A lot of people who take L-Theanine with Caffeine are taking it at a higher dosage than what you can from even a few cups of tea.

I’ve read about this combination quite a bit and from my personal experience, you have to get the mixture just right. Even at high doses of caffeine, the right amount of L-Theanine can stop the jitters and give a calm focus. That all said, these dosages are so individualistic that it’s chasing a dragon.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by dev_420b on Friday June 29, 2018 @02:57PM (#17426792)
I had basically the same experience, though I think I was closer to a gram or so a day, and I never had trouble eating.

But yeah, to the people saying it’s not real, try a few days of insomnia. The feeling of being high is nice, but not terribly addictive or unquittable in itself. But going through the crappy parts of withdrawal, feeling irritable, etc., and on top of that, not being able to sleep? It’s torture.

In the end I couldn’t quit cold turkey. It took me maybe six months of weaning off before I could quit.

Good luck to you.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by merinowool on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:28PM (#17427604)
People have insomnia and are irritable without ever smoking. Maybe cannabis just masking your problem and what you feel as "withdrawals" is not caused by cannabis. People often attribute causal relationship if it fits their limited knowledge.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Jeremy1026 on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:33PM (#17427648)
You seem awfully defensive and are quick to tell people they are wrong (without citations) when they disparage marijuana.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by merinowool on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:43PM (#17427708)
They can Google that themselves.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by nazgul17 on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:32AM (#17429759)
The burden of proof, in science, is on who makes the statement. And science is the best set of procedures we know to get to the truth.

So you should at least accept the critic if you can't be bothered to search something that supports your claims.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by topmonk on Saturday June 30, 2018 @07:43PM (#17433295)
I agree, maybe he should try another strain
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by randomsearch on Saturday June 30, 2018 @04:52AM (#17430055)
I’ve read a bit about addiction recently, particularly wrt social media’s manipulation of users, but the books I’ve read are full of references to other types of addiction.

One very effective piece of advice appears to be that the addiction and your environment become intertwined. If you’re serious about giving up, then a change of location, job, friends seems to greatly increase your chances of being successful.

It’s not just “don’t hang around pubs”, but also “live in a new apartment where you don’t have that fridge with the shelf you use for alcohol, that comfy chair where you drink at night.” Etc. Your environment becomes full of cues to continue your addiction, because you’ve associated it with the drug (or video games, etc.)

I think it’s easier for some people to be addicted than others, so don’t be too hard on yourself for being in that situation, and keep trying. Get professional help. Sincerely, good luck.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by bcheung on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:57PM (#17427378)
People don't wake up with nightmares and covered in sweat if they don't have a cheeseburger in the last 24 hours.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by whb07 on Friday June 29, 2018 @09:24PM (#17429007)
I’d beg to differ. Go ask any XXXL wearing guy what happens if they clean up their diets.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by RickS on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:03AM (#17429695)
Nah. Have you been one of these guys? I'm a XXL cleaning my act up and it feels great the whole time. All you realize is how fucked up you felt BEFORE. I've never known of anyone that went through that brand of withdrawl.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by bbeonx on Saturday June 30, 2018 @03:02AM (#17429838)
Symptoms of addiction vary. Food addiction is real.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hutzlibu on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:13PM (#17427489)
There are phases in my life, when I smoke a lot (but never nearly as much as you) and phases with nothing at all. So I regulary start and stop smoking. The trick for me is, not just not do anything anymore - you rather start doing something different. Because your mind is used to the reward of the ganja - if you miss that, there needs to be something else. Other pleasant experiences.

Physical activitys help a lot, or starting to travel. But just stopping ... I believe is very hard on your own. In general, when I smoke a lot, I tend to isolate myself more and more. And when I stop, I socialice again. So that works for me (mostly, transition phase can still be hard, though). If you lack people who could help you, think about professional help...

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by chaosbutters314 on Friday June 29, 2018 @05:15PM (#17427921)
Sour patch kids are wayyyy more addictive than cheeseburgers and coffee. When you grab 4-5 of them and put them on your gum and suck down their sour goodness before getting that enjoyable gummy chew, it is heaven. I'd eat them till gums bled from all the acid.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by chillingeffect on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:41PM (#17427186)
weed before bed inhibits rem/dream sleep. when you stop, the brain gives you the saved up rem sleep and vivid dreams.

the rest are classic anxiety symptoms. i wouldn't focus as much on the weed as on what is troubling you underneath.

Seriously, working with a therapist to address the stress, abuse, trauma or whatever else will help quite a bit and the weed use will take care of itself. good luck and trust that your issues are resolvable!!!

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by ASalazarMX on Friday June 29, 2018 @07:46PM (#17428713)
> a society that forces people into self medication of all forms

From personal experience, I believe it's not society forcing anything, but a character flaw that encourages self-gratification in the short term. That flaw can be bypassed, don't give up if you're not happy about it.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by robdachshund on Sunday July 01, 2018 @10:42AM (#17435766)
Hmm or perhaps it's because the legal medicines available for chronic illnesses, autoimmune disorders, severe IBS, seizures, and depression/anxiety, etc don't actually work and give you horrendous side effects.

Please stop speaking on behalf of others if you have no clue what you are talking about.

There are people with MS that smoke and are able to walk and move around and not be in constant unbearabke pain. People with chronic back pain do not have to take opioids loaded with toxic nsaids that will destroy their kidneys and get them hooked on narcotics. People and even children with untreatable seizures can live completely oridnary lives. People with depression, PTSD, and anxiety do not have to rely on dangerous antidepressants that can actually increase suicidal thoughts and have resulted in numerous suicides.

People are self medicating because weed is the only real medicine for many of these illnesses.

To call those people cowards is downright awful and completely unwarranted.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by ASalazarMX on Monday July 02, 2018 @02:28PM (#17444216)
I was talking specifically about Marijuana addiction, OP's topic.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by JumpCrisscross on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:29PM (#17427082)
Were there any distinct early warning signs that could have flagged others to what was going on? I have friends who, post-legalization, are naturally enthusiastic. Want to know the warning signs unique to cannabis addiction I can keep an eye out for.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by nine_k on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:37PM (#17427157)
I heard a rule of thumb along the line of "don't do it three days in a row; if you have trouble stopping on the thirds day, start worrying".
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by fhood on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:42PM (#17427205)
Can't speak for marijuana addiction, but I know an addict or two, and problems seem to develop most prominently if the substance is used heavily and for self-medication.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by mrbgty on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:43PM (#17427216)
If you haven't seen this, I recommend watching it as it explains the nightmares.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwaWilO_Pig

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by merinowool on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:24PM (#17427572)
Cannabis is non toxic, so what are you going to detox?

Do you roll with tobacco? People often say they are "addicted" to cannabis, but that is in fact tobacco they use.

You clearly have a problem nevertheless. It looks like your body is not compatible with what you smoke. Have you tried CBT therapy, to find out why do you need this?

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by jasonkostempski on Saturday June 30, 2018 @07:56AM (#17430520)
Have you tried weaning off?
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:33PM (#17427130)
That you experience significant physical withdrawal symptoms from marijuana certainty calls into question the street wisdom that pot isn’t (physically) addicting.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:40PM (#17427171)
There is one important difference: withdrawal from something like alcohol can actually kill you. Withdrawal from marijuana makes you an irritable asshole for a week or two.

The hardest part is understanding and coping with the issue that drives the user to use marijuana so heavily in the first place. If it can be understood what need the marijuana use is providing for, changing use patterns becomes possible.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by zyxwvu on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:04PM (#17427441)
Marijuana abused to self medicate is frankly cheaper than paying for mental health medication and therapy. It's also fast acting and has only minor negative side effects as opposed to taking several weeks to take effect and for any negative side effects (these can be rather bothersome or bad) to go away. Not to mention that's if that particular medication works for you. Going through several types, change in doses, etc can go on for a year or more easily.

In my experience however, withdrawal only takes a few days, I don't recall being any more irritable than before except that marijuana makes me less prone to irritations to begin with, and the thing that's the worst is the boredom.

It's what do you do with your time? Work can keep you occupied and busy, but at home the activities you are likely going to do you did with marijuana. Video games and television/movies are harder to 'feel' interested in. Eating high is just really enjoyable. And trying to sleep is difficult especially when you know you could just smoke some pot and drift off instead of being too bored and restless to sleep.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by RickS on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:05AM (#17429700)
>Marijuana abused to self medicate is frankly cheaper than paying for mental health medication and therapy.

This implies that self medication has an outcome comparable to paying for mental health medication and therapy.

I would assert that it does not.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by njarboe on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:20PM (#17431992)
Mental health medication and therapy cost more?
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by davymac on Saturday June 30, 2018 @03:24PM (#17432315)
Without health insurance, yeah, it’s way cheaper.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by lightbyte on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:44PM (#17427227)
>withdrawal from opiates ... can actually kill you

Opioid withdrawal is actually not fatal at all barring potential dehydration from excessive diarrhea/vomiting.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:48PM (#17427269)
I edited that out. Apparently most opiate related deaths during withdrawal are due to a person wanting 'one last hit', but choosing a dose that they no longer have the tolerance for.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by bonesss on Friday June 29, 2018 @05:47PM (#17428098)
A potent argument for legalization of opiates, IMO.

Something as simple as concentration percentages on packaging, as we have with booze, and smart usage pamphlets could save a lot of lives.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Friday June 29, 2018 @06:11PM (#17428231)
I don't disagree. I think Portugal's experiment has proven that decriminalization is the best path forward pretty conclusively.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by mimimihaha on Saturday June 30, 2018 @01:47PM (#17431803)
This is a genuine question but legalization but still making kind of difficult to get or just all out legalization and selling it wherever?
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Sunday July 01, 2018 @02:49AM (#17434453)
Legalization along the lines of what we're currently doing with alcohol and tobacco.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by trentlott on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:31AM (#17429757)
That's why we differentiate between addiction and dependence.

Alcohol dependence prevents cold turkey for some people.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by kimbojimbo33 on Friday June 29, 2018 @09:02PM (#17428954)
What do you think of Cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome?
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:42PM (#17427202)
Pot destroys lives in part by being so apparently benign.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:46PM (#17427246)
Whatever problems drive a person to use pot as a crutch are the source issue. Pot abuse itself (or any maladaptive behavior) is best thought of as a symptom, not a cause.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by DanBC on Saturday June 30, 2018 @03:19AM (#17429866)
This just isn't true.

Please stop denying that cannabis itself cannot ever be a cause of severe harm.

I strongly support legalisation, but for that to happen we must accept that some cannabis users are going to be caused harm.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Sunday July 01, 2018 @04:48AM (#17434726)
I did not claim that cannabis doesn't have the ability to cause harm, nor would I. My point is only that drug abuse should be taken as a symptom of a deeper cause.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:50PM (#17427304)
If someone is self medicating with pot, and pot is making their lives worse (which is the case for some users), the pot is a problem in and of itself.

Drug culture itself is riddled with such booby traps. Fallaious street wisdom backed by egos and peer pressure are powerful tools to indoctrinate a child into an unexpected lifetime of addiction to substances such as pot.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:53PM (#17427789)
>Fallaious street wisdom backed by egos and peer pressure

That's what I am trying to get at- problems stem from earlier sources. Whether someone eventually gets hooked on something is a consequence of earlier failure. Whatever drug/habit is ultimately picked up in the aftermath is a genuine negative, which will have its own particulars. But it is not the initial causative agent. This is an important distinction to make, because otherwise we're just rearranging deck chairs instead of managing the fundamental issue.

To expand context, when considering appropriate drug policy at a governmental level I think Portugal's experience is important to study:

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radic...

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @05:53PM (#17428134)
No, drug use isn’t consistently picked up in the aftermath of disaster. It’s often near the beginning, and lubricates destructive behavior, even pot.

Pot absolutely catalyzes issues in people’s lives. Many would be far better off not using it at all.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Friday June 29, 2018 @06:10PM (#17428225)
>It’s often near the beginning, and lubricates destructive behavior, even pot

I think we are talking past each other. I fully agree that many would be better off never using anything at all.

My point is that by the time someone gets to the point where drugs/gambling/addiction can act as a destructive catalyst, they're already well on their way to a negative future due to earlier causes.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by DanBC on Saturday June 30, 2018 @03:20AM (#17429868)
> My point is that by the time someone gets to the point where drugs/gambling/addiction can act as a destructive catalyst, they're already well on their way to a negative future due to earlier causes.

Do you have anything at all to support this?

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by Baeocystin on Sunday July 01, 2018 @03:02AM (#17434478)
Sure. Start here and follow the sources. Portugal's results from their drug law shift in particular are strong evidence.

(the first bit of the linked article is, well, clearly written for the huff post. But the meat of it well worth the read)

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6506936

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:18PM (#17431969)
A child with an undeveloped mind gets stoned and is profoundly impacted by it. The act of getting into pot in the first place is the divergent event that led to the deteriorated life path in some cases. The pot use itself is a root cause for the child, and they would have been better off never having got into it at all.

As for destructive catalysts, no, not all people are well on their way to a negative future when they take up such habits. The drugs/gambling etc are the destructive behaviors that should be avoided altogether or stopped as a priority.

Considering the well documented effects of high grade pot, it’s fairly easy to see that a normal child can be profoundly impacted by pot. Their entire lives get off track after getting into weed. So, no, not all people that mess up their lives on pot were well on their way to a negative future.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:44PM (#17427222)
Or it's a combination of mental addiction and the placebo effect. The ritual has become such an important part of their life, that when they remove it their anxiety causes a physical reaction based on their concept of withdrawl.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by badloginagain on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:47PM (#17427263)
I read that the use of marijuana actually inhibits dreams, and that people who quit temporarily experience intense dreams.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by opportune on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:56PM (#17427811)
This is called REM rebound. The reason is that in this case the psychoactive drugs in cannabis act as sedatives. Similar to alcohol and other depressants, this makes it easier to fall asleep, but harder to enter the "deeper" stages of sleep like REM. So when you quit ingesting cannabis, your body tries to make up for your ongoing REM sleep deficit, and you have more/stronger dreams as a result

This what is happening to the top level commenter. I don't know if the nightmares in particular are a result of REM rebound, but it could be that the person is simply prone to nightmares, and part of their addiction could be self-medication for their innately nightmarish dreams.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by trentlott on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:41AM (#17429786)
Is there research for that?

I would imagine that people report fewer dreams due to cannabinoids' memory effects, rather than an impact on REM sleep. Failing to remember dreams does not mean an absence of them.

An increase in nightmares could easily be due to increased stress/amygdala function depressed by cannabinoids.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Saturday June 30, 2018 @07:26AM (#17430445)
There is research[1] and I have already established that the nightmares come from an unrelated source such as PTSD.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18313952

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Friday June 29, 2018 @08:55PM (#17428928)
The latter, many people with PTSD suffer basically flashback dreams. So they may smoke as a self medication, but the fear of an REM rebound causes physical symptoms when they don't smoke.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by robdachshund on Sunday July 01, 2018 @10:29AM (#17435721)
PTSD weed smoker here. Not the case whatsoever. If I don't smoke I don't suddenly have intense nightmares about my near death experience nor do I have a physical impetus to keep smoking. If I run out of weed I don't slip into the worst stages of PTSD.

It seems that there ate a ton of people speaking on behalf of both actual smokers and people with chronic illnesses and disorders.

If you don't have PTSD, you can't comprehend it, nor should you try to.

Top commenters issue is that they lack self control. Their "addiction" to weed is self imposed and akin to overeating or being addicted to masturbation.

When you stop smoking, you don't have withdrawals. You simply begin experiencing the chronic illnesses that you have been self medicating against.

I'd also like to add that for mental issues like anxiety, PTSD, and depression, weed acts like a mild antidepressant that is extremely manageable compared to the prescription options that typically make people even more unstable. Every antidepressant in America comes with a warning that it can increase suicidal tendencies, and I can tell you from experience that it is very true.

Those kinds of "medicines" work by making you numb, not treating the actual problems. You don't feel normal at all; you don't care about anything, become very reckless and unstable, and many kids end up killing themselves because of this mental state when they had taken the medicine to quell suicidal thoughts in the first place.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Sunday July 01, 2018 @06:12PM (#17437945)
First and foremost, you are one person. Your experience does not represent the full range of experience, nor do anecdotes from people you've met.

Next, PTSD can cause flashbacks in several forms. Many people with the illness never have harmful flashback dreams.

I said that this is causing a mental addiction. So on top of everything effecting people differently, these require particular forms of thinking. If you don't know that marijuana can suppress dreams or use it for that purpose, you won't develop this addiction.

A mental addiction isn't a "lack of self control" or "self imposed" as you say. It works by a similar means to the placebo effect, where your belief that something has an effect leads to the effect.

>It seems that there ate a ton of people speaking on behalf of both actual smokers and people with chronic illnesses and disorders.If you don't have PTSD, you can't comprehend it, nor should you try to.

Seems to me that you shouldn't assume what diseases other people have suffered from. As you aren't the only one with first hand experience.

>Those kinds of "medicines" work by making you numb, not treating the actual problems

Though it's true that the prescribed alternatives are not cures, neither is marijuana. Both help you manage symptoms, but can lead to other problems. Therapy has been the only thing shown to be effective as a cure.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:56PM (#17427361)
Yes. This isn't physical addiction. It can cause a mental addiction if you use it for that purpose, and the anxiety over going without can keep you awake. You see it in people with PTSD.

edit Curious why people are objecting to this as I have personal experience in the area. Vivid dreams are common any time you go without dreaming for a while, it's not a sign of a physical addiction.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by DanBC on Saturday June 30, 2018 @03:44AM (#17429917)
Because you're pushing a distinction (physical vs psychological addiction) that is mostly irrelevant but also untrue.

There are many drugs that aren't strongly physically addictive, but most people recognise that the misuse of those drugs can cause severe harm. Cannabis should be in this category.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Saturday June 30, 2018 @07:20AM (#17430418)
At no point do I suggest a mental addiction is less harmful, just that a distinction exists.

With a physical addiction, the substance itself becomes necessary to the body. A psychological addiction involves becoming reliant on a perceived effect of some other stimulus. If you give a brain dead person a physically addictive substance and then stop, they will suffer withdrawals while they can't develop a psychological addiction as there is no perception.

Generally, the two will develop together and both are harmful.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by jonhendry18 on Saturday June 30, 2018 @08:04PM (#17433356)
Misuse of Tylenol (acetaminophen) can cause severe harm. Doesn't mean it's addictive.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by robdachshund on Sunday July 01, 2018 @10:35AM (#17435736)
This is BS. Define the "severe harm" or stop making this argument.

There are a lot of people here speaking on behalf of smokers and people with chronic illnesses and disorders.

I happen to fall in both categories and self medicate.

I can and do stop smoking so the time. It is not physically addictive, and you can become mentally addicted to anything that gives you a dopamine release, like eating junk food.

I have never had "withdrawals," nor do I recognize weed "addiction" as anything other than excess, overindulgence, and a lack of self control.

People claiming that they are addicted to weed are simply looking to blame a bad habit for their lack of self control.

The only severe harm you can get from smoking too much weed is to your wallet.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:47PM (#17427266)
This isn’t the reality for all. Not everyone remains productive like Seth Rogen when perpetually stoned.

Many people waste away their lives stoned and the problem seems to be getting worse while the quality of pot skyrockets to all time highs.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:00PM (#17427410)
Many people waste their lives away with a wide variety of things, that doesn't make them physically addictive. Mentally addictive yes, but that's a separate thing.

The country is going through a mental health problem, there are numerous signs of this. Marijuana is one of the poor ways that people deal with this, but it's not the cause of the issue.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:24PM (#17427573)
I bet with further research done properly (which will take decades starting now) we will find that pot use from an early age is not only correlated to diminished quality of life for some, but is a contributing underlying factor enough to tip scales for some.

Michael Phelps can down McDonald’s but some are better off limiting their fast food intake. Everyone reacts differently to different arrangements of chemicals in different quantities.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:39PM (#17427686)
None of this makes it physically addictive, which is the only issue I'm making. Mental addiction can also be terrible, and can cause the issues described.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by DanBC on Saturday June 30, 2018 @03:42AM (#17429911)
WHy are you pushing the physical addiction point? Cocaine isn't physically addictive. Cocaine can be terribly harmful.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Saturday June 30, 2018 @07:33AM (#17430462)
I was replying to this post

>That you experience significant physical withdrawal symptoms from marijuana certainty calls into question the street wisdom that pot isn’t (physically) addicting.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by robdachshund on Sunday July 01, 2018 @10:16AM (#17435680)
How is weed harmful? Any mental and physical effects subside with cessation of use.

My buddy just quit for a month. The only issues he had were having to deal with his terrible IBS without what had effectively become medicine for him.

I smoke for similar reasons and for anti anxiety. It is FAR less harmful than brain melting benzos like xanax and Klonopin.

Wanna talk about harm? When I was prescribed Klonopin, I essentially blacked out for a month of my life. I didn't "wake up" from that until I missed a dose and promptly tossed it in the trash.

If you are so concerned with some nitpicky level of subjective "harm," maybe we should talk about all the harm prescription drugs can cause. When you have chronic illnesses and the medicine only makes you worse, self medication becomes an enticing prospect.

What about kids with severe seizures, etc? We've seen some of the most conservative states allow cbd oil because it is the only thing that works.

If you have an open mind, you should look into the endocannabinoid system that resides in every human being. We have a massive network of receptors that rely on cannabinoids to mediate chronic illnesses and reduce inflammation in our bodies.

It is thought that we have this system and relationship with cannabinoids because humans have been cultivating and consuming marijuana for thousands of years. Weed and humans have developed alongside each other over time in a kind of symbiotic relationship. To simply pretend that weed is some sort of harmful narcotic is so far from the truth.

Excess is the issue. A person who let's weed run their life is no different than someone that overeats or procrastinates constantly. If you have bad habits and no self control you can take anything to excess.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @05:58PM (#17428168)
Well, the pot physical addiction debate is where we started.

If people experience significant physical withdrawal symptoms from cessation of pot use (which seems to be the case for some), then for those people, it absolutely is physically addicting.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by boomboomsubban on Friday June 29, 2018 @08:46PM (#17428898)
It still isn't physically addicting as at no point does the body need it to function. Physical withdrawal symptoms don't change that, and it's unlikely that science will find new evidence changing this position.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by trentlott on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:37AM (#17429775)
Addiction and dependence are different.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by kimbojimbo33 on Friday June 29, 2018 @09:06PM (#17428964)
Cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome seems to not be that well known. CHS appears to suggest that for certain segments of the population there is a physical component to marijuana addiction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabinoid_hyperemesis_syndro...

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by fhood on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:40PM (#17427172)
Sure, but nearly anything that causes a chemical change can be physically addicting right? Once your brain starts equalizing for whatever imbalances are being created.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by beat on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:56PM (#17427368)
By that definition, hydration is addiction.

Refined carbohydrates (sugar, flour) are definitely addictive. If you have the normal modern diet full of sugar and flour and you quit them cold turkey, you will be sick and miserable for a few days, while your body adjusts. And if you quit carbs enough to go into ketosis, and then "cheat", you'll be right back on the insulin-spike bandwagon. (This is not to be construed as an argument in favor of keto diets, or against carbs!) And unlike water, your body does not need refined sugar or grains. You can live just fine on meats and vegetables.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hutzlibu on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:21PM (#17427545)
It is not, "only" psychological addictive. But since our mind controls our body, the symptoms can be indeed severe, if the use, or abuse, like in this case, is extreme. Smoking 3g a day is the rough equivavlent of constantly drinking wodka instead of water.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by programmarchy on Saturday June 30, 2018 @12:29AM (#17429477)
Pot does produce physical changes in the brain, though. Heavy pot usage can dramatically increase the amount of anandamide receptors in the brain, which regulate hunger, motivation, pleasure and mood among other things. So quitting and having a neurotransmitter deficit until the brain returns to homeostasis causes hormonal and physical effects on the body... How is that “only” psychological?
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by trentlott on Saturday June 30, 2018 @02:44AM (#17429792)
Because organs won't start shutting down without it.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by chimeracoder on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:41PM (#17427184)
> certainty calls into question the street wisdom that pot isn’t (physically) addicting.

This isn't "street wisdom"; there's a massive body of clinical research that's gone into marijuana and investigating its effects on the body and brain.

Marijuana is one of the most-studied drugs in existence, far more so than most prescription medication on the market.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:43PM (#17427220)
Actually, the notion that pot isn’t addictive is the street wisdom, or was when I was growing up. This is in contradiction to the reality.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by chimeracoder on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:55PM (#17427348)
> Actually, the notion that pot isn’t addictive is the street wisdom, or was when I was growing up. This is in contradiction to the reality.

No, it's not in contradiction to reality; it's the results of clinical research. To the extent that "addiction" is a relevant term in colloquial use (it's neither a DSM-IV diagnostic criterion nor a formal pharmacological term), marijuana is not known to induce practically significant symptoms of physical dependence.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by hsienmaneja on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:03PM (#17427431)
Copy that. Getting into semantics, from the descriptions here, one could describe the withdrawal symptoms to be physically/practically significant for some cowards.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by JeremyBanks on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:07PM (#17427451)
Such research is probably improperly generalized or otherwise misinterpreted. I’ve known lots of people who smoked too much weed, and “withdrawal” symptoms were pretty consistent among people who really smoked to excess (multiple grams per day). Judging from this and similar threads, many people will attest to the same. It’s not plausible to me that this is an illusion.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by iamnothere on Saturday June 30, 2018 @07:37AM (#17430476)
> Such research is probably improperly generalized or otherwise misinterpreted.

A great deal of it is, and some of it has more fundamental problems. I forget his name -- this was quite a while ago -- but there was one scientist in particular who had published a wealth of anti-cannabis studies, most of which were obviously flawed or biased in some way. Furthermore, at the time he was one of the only people allowed to do the research, since access to "official" MJ was heavily restricted, and the supply he used was a small batch of plants grown specifically for research, hardly representative of real-world crops. Most of his work was federally funded, and this was during the Bush II era, so you can imagine the pressure to back up the government's anti-MJ stance. Wish I could remember more details, this was a while ago!

When I first learned about this, it was really an eye-opener on how the funding -> research -> policy treadmill works when it is successfully subverted by powerful interests. Fortunately it's hard to keep the process going forever. Science works in the long run, but sometimes it moves too slowly for people facing real injustice.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by ggggtez on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:41PM (#17427192)
>Within 24 hours without weed I become an intolerable asshole

I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest the underlying problem might not be the weed.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by fhood on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:46PM (#17427242)
If the implication here is that the intolerable asshole part is a personality problem, that doesn't seem like a fair accusation. Caffeine and sugar withdrawal cause much the same symptoms. It is hard to be nice when you have a headache and feel crappy.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by beat on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:02PM (#17427428)
"24 hours without antipsychotics and I become schizophrenic".

"I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest the underlying problem might not be the antipsychotics".

See the problem with your phrasing?

Lots of people deal with anxiety, anger management, and other relatively mild psychological malfunctions by self-medicating (or prescription medicating) with THC. That's why it gets prescribed as medication for these things. THC is effective in many cases, with very few side effects, relative to other medications.

I have friends who are "marijuana addicts", who are pretty horrible to be around when they're not stoned, but fine when they are. They can be social and do their jobs. So, um, what's wrong with that? I am quite happy for them.

edit: I should add that there's this Puritan tendency to treat things like anger management issues as a moral failing rather than a medical problem. So medicating rather than moralizing is seen as a character flaw. Personally, I deal with ADD. I've been formally diagnosed, and it's measurable and measured. I don't medicate for it and I pay a price for that - it puts limits on my activities and decisions, to shield my life from the problems ADD can cause. I don't medicate because the medication has caused side effects that were worse than the condition, for me. If I thought THC would help me deal with my ADD (it doesn't), I'd be out fighting for a prescription.

Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by sysalphUS on Friday June 29, 2018 @10:14PM (#17429139)
“I have friends who are "marijuana addicts", who are pretty horrible to be around when they're not stoned, but fine when they are.” Change the word “stoned” to “have-had-coffee-at-least-in-the-morning” and you would be describing a large percentage of the population. It’s interesting which addictions are stigmatized and which ones are normalized.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by beat on Saturday June 30, 2018 @04:43PM (#17432654)
Oh, exactly. I mean, we make jokes about how bad we are without coffee and no one says boo about how coffee should be banned.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by ggggtez on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:14PM (#17427499)
Being an asshole isn't a medical condition.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by beat on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:23PM (#17427562)
Being an asshole can be a symptom of a medical condition.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by cabaalis on Friday June 29, 2018 @03:47PM (#17427260)
It might be, though. I have heard this exact thing from a friend about her husband. She may divorce him over it. It is very specifically when he is out. It is worth looking into the effects of prolonged drug use (even mj) on the brain and personality.
Re:Marijuana addiction is real, and rising by psalminen on Friday June 29, 2018 @04:40PM (#17427688)
All addiction issues are just the surface of an underlying problem.