News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by dmschulman on Thursday May 24, 2018 @09:40AM (#17143839)
StumbleUpon was one of the first web services I came across that actually provided a new and exciting way to traverse the internet. I'll never forget the sense of discovery and wonder and amusement it provided, my only other sources for cool and interesting content were things my friends would share with me or sites I would find via an article/web page.

StumbleUpon took me out of my "filter bubble" if you will and introduced me to corners of the web I would have possibly never discovered on my own. It will be missed.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by marpstar on Thursday May 24, 2018 @09:54AM (#17143962)
Seconded. Many hours in college that I should've spent studying were spent "stumbling". Digg came along, and later Reddit and HN and I spent a lot less time using StumbleUpon, but it was AWESOME for its time.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jclos on Thursday May 24, 2018 @10:38AM (#17144363)
I was considering dropping Reddit and going back to StumbleUpon, because I realised that it is very hard to use reddit without making it another filter bubble, which defeats the purpose of information discovery. Plus, the fact that SU doesn't have a toxic comment section makes it better imho. I am sad that it is gone.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by tacostakohashi on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:24AM (#17144892)
Urgh, Reddit is indeed an addictive, toxic timesink of a filter bubble. It reminds me of Slashdot, but on a much larger scale.

I have been reflecting on ways to fix it lately. I was imagining something like reddit, but...

1) not completely anonymous / pseudonymous. Maybe a profile photo with you holding a sign with your username for verification (like certain subreddits do), first name, and SMS / phone number verification or something. That's all - not strong firstname / lastname identity like facebook, but also no throwaway accounts.

2) allow people to have a different alias for different subreddits, in a way that they stay separate and can't be easily linked. maybe that means one verification photo per subreddit, and all you really share across subreddits is your username / password. the thing of people looking through post history across different, unrelated subreddits and beating them up in response to their latest post is pretty toxic, and goes against real life where people tend to have a different persona in different contexts.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jadedhacker on Thursday May 24, 2018 @02:53PM (#17147105)
Hate to be that guy, but while people being somewhat shittier anonymously is a real thing, there are whole cadres of incredibly horrible people that will post horrible stuff under their real names and be proud of it. Losing anonymity means losing protections for actually vulnerable people. The shittiest people are often the ones with the most secure positions in society.

I think our online personas are just a reflection of our culture. Our culture sucks, so our online personas suck.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by krapp on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:00PM (#17147169)
> Losing anonymity means losing protections for actually vulnerable people. The shittiest people are often the ones with the most secure positions in society.

Case in point - Google forcibly merging Google+ comments into Youtube comments.

It didn't end trolling or harassment on the platform at all... people were are are perfectly willing to be vile under their real names, but it did expose a lot of people's personal information and real names to that cesspool against their will.

Also, Usenet. A lot of people posted with headers including their real name or an email containing their real name, yet it wasn't exactly a bastion of civility because of it.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by _csoz on Thursday May 24, 2018 @04:31PM (#17148128)
must be liberating how easy it is to be racist/troll etc under your real name in Youtube, because everybody else is doing it. Real name, fake name, pseudonymous or completely anonymous, it seems it doesn't matter - herd behaviour washes away everything.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by krapp on Thursday May 24, 2018 @04:52PM (#17148305)
The way I see it, the web being primarily text based makes empathy difficult, which makes irate and rude behavior easier. It's easy to forget that there are real people on the other side of these text boxes.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by kbenson on Thursday May 24, 2018 @10:28PM (#17150194)
Not just text, but temporal and geographic distance as well. There's plenty of Youtube reaction videos going back and forth of people just bashing each other, like any other flame war.

Also, let's not discount the effect an audience has. I would hazard that most negative public comments are actually crafted more for the benefit the author gets from the public reading it than the purported target. What's a little hurt feelings of one or a few when you get that buzz of doing something that shocks or amuses 20,000 people?

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by zerostar07 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @04:59PM (#17148362)
i guess text has always been harsher thats why books are so interesting
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by vkou on Thursday May 24, 2018 @05:42PM (#17148706)
This information does not have to be made visible to other posters - just to verify that you're a unique human at account creation.

You could still call yourself KatDude420.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by drb91 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @02:27PM (#17146861)
I hate to be that guy, but each subreddit is different. This is arguably the main selling point of reddit vs other link aggregators like facebook. Grouping all into the same toxic culture is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by darpa_escapee on Thursday May 24, 2018 @05:34PM (#17148640)
Unless a subreddit is heavily moderated, I've yet to see one that's gained popularity outside of its core users that didn't turn into a meme/clickbait/karma-motivated cesspool.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by drb91 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @06:16PM (#17148980)
> Unless a subreddit is heavily moderated, I've yet to see one that's gained popularity outside of its core users that didn't turn into a meme/clickbait/karma-motivated cesspool.

Well that's a weird condition given that all the good subreddits I know owe this entirely to moderators. Why are you looking for lightly moderated content?

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by darpa_escapee on Thursday May 24, 2018 @07:13PM (#17149333)
I'm very much in favor of heavy moderation. However, I realize that it's a difficult task when moderators aren't paid and users are joining exponentially.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by MaxBarraclough on Friday May 25, 2018 @07:36AM (#17152562)
There are also niche-topic subreddits, which don't face the overpopularity problem by definition.

But sure, the best subreddits tend to be heavily moderated and/or very niche. Is this really a problem?

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by muppetman on Thursday May 24, 2018 @05:10PM (#17148442)
Yea, the reddit I visit is wonderful. Full of helpful, technical people. I guess because I have zero interest in politics or anything even slightly political - I can't even describe what left wing vs right wing actually means, or which I am (I must be one, I suppose) I post/hangout in all technical forums (pfsense/proxmox/vim/android) and pretty much without exception people are lovely. Android gets a bit catty because people are very aligned to their favourite thing (Samsung etc) but I'd never call it a vile place.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by not_kurt_godel on Thursday May 24, 2018 @08:29PM (#17149705)
> I have zero interest in politics or anything even slightly political - I can't even describe what left wing vs right wing actually means

Political apathy is toxic. You don't have to be obsessed with politics but it's everyone's civic duty to understand the basic principles and players of our political system. Low voter turnout and low-information voters were major factors in Trump's win. You may think you don't care about politics but it's practically guaranteed you are or will be affected in some way (probably negative) as a result of his election - even if you don't live in the US.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by mdeg on Thursday May 24, 2018 @10:12PM (#17150120)
Most online discussion sites (reddit and HN, for example) focus overwhelmingly on US politics. This is significantly less relevant for the billion-odd people who use the English language internet but do not live in the USA.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by not_kurt_godel on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:55PM (#17150493)
He didn't say anything about US politics - he specifically said anything 'slightly political'. Trump is an example of what happens when a critical mass of people adopt that attitude, and it could just as well happen in any other country under the right circumstances (and indeed has many times in the past).
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by zerostar07 on Friday May 25, 2018 @05:02AM (#17151791)
tbh it's the anti-trump crowd who can't help themselves from turning everything to politics.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by cannonedhamster on Friday May 25, 2018 @10:53PM (#17159919)
Yeah because the Tea Party didn't exist under Pres. Obama. The Birth Certificate truthers exist, Alex Jones, Rush Limbaugh, Anti-Bush, and the No Blood For Oil crowds have existed forever across the spectrum. The only thing that's happened is that the internet has made everyone willing to turn everything into politics louder, less willing to listen, and easier to find an echo chamber. People talk about politics because it's the only thing that's literally relevant to everyone.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by muppetman on Thursday May 24, 2018 @09:45PM (#17150011)
I focus on being a good person (as best as I can) and I care about being happy. Worrying about what a bunch of quarreling children are doing, with very limited scope to impact or change any of it, is detrimental to being happy. I am under no illusion that the changes driven by Government affect me, in many ways. There's a decent chance ol' trumpy might let off a bomb, ruining hundreds of thousands of lives. Maybe, if it hits New Zealand, that of mine and my children too. But I still chose not to care/worry about it. I focus on enjoying the time I have with my family, trying to teach them to be happy. If they find an interest on politics makes them happy and excited, that's great! I'll encourage that 100%. But I don't care.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by not_kurt_godel on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:52PM (#17150481)
That's a convenient attitude to have until you don't have the privilege of being so carefree about the potential consequences. That's exactly how Trump got elected - people who were politically apathetic or ill-informed took the bait of a loud 'charismatic' celeb with a message that was perfectly tailored to appeal to those who couldn't be bothered to learn the basic facts.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by muppetman on Friday May 25, 2018 @12:22AM (#17150593)
I totally agree. But where do I draw the line. How heavily invested do I have to get into politics to get over this line you're alluding to, but haven't defined.

What about global warming? Space junk? Plant and Animal species becoming extinct etc. I expect you'll say those all tie back to politics and yes, they do to a degree. But having a strong political opinion doesn't suddenly change the world. We have limited time on this earth, I chose to invest my time into local things I can have some influence over. I agree I am extremely lucky to be in a privileged position to take this stance.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by not_kurt_godel on Friday May 25, 2018 @12:58AM (#17150737)
Here are my suggestions for a line:

1. One should participate in representational political processes as a matter of self-interest and civic obligation, even if it's just the absolute bare minimum of voting

2. Pursuant to that obligation, one should take the time to develop at least a basic understanding of the differences between the major political factions so that one's vote is not a completely random choice. Every adult should be able to write 2 gradeschool-level paragraphs comparing and contrasting the general principles and policies thereof.

3. Even if one does neither of the above, one should recognize that normalizing and rationalizing political non-participation is damaging to society if it influences others to do the same, and should thus be avoided.

Sound fair?

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jngreenlee on Thursday May 24, 2018 @09:28PM (#17149930)
That's a bad way to put things. You can disagree with the outcome of the 2016 election, but it was a _feature_ not a _bug_ of the system the US has in place. The voters who got their way are equal in their right to their preference as you are to yours.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by drb91 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @09:43PM (#17150004)
The feature/bug metaphor fails to take into account tradeoffs. Every political system has pros and cons, and which one you choose to describe the system reveals your politics.

For instance: the voters are not equal in their right to preference. Delegates are equal in their right to preference. This means the person with the popular vote lost. So, do you value the republican vote or the democratic vote (government, not party)? There’s no objectively better option; it’s a pick-your-poison type deal.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by not_kurt_godel on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:42PM (#17150441)
Sure, and I'm equally in my right to encourage people to take action to effect a different outcome. And, independent of the outcome, I feel quite comfortable in asserting the universal truth that people have a moral obligation to be involved in political processes that are tangibly in their direct self-interest and society's interest to participate in.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jclos on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:53AM (#17145198)
To me it's the random jumping from site to site via browser extension that really made SU worth it. I can discover stuff through reddit, but the presence of a comment section kind of ruins it since I am not disciplined enough to ignore it.

As to fixing reddit, I agree with your changes, but you'd run into the same issue all candidates for remplacement ran into: reddit delivers value through the network effect. You need users to get value. You need value to get users. Basically unless you can kickstart the replacement with a shitton of existing data, or unless reddit fucks up as much as digg did before, it's hard to compete.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by tacostakohashi on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:49PM (#17145862)
Oh, right, another radical thought of mine - something that users would pay for. Even if it were just $1/month, one account per credit card only, it would serve as another little barrier to all the right people, and prevent throwaways and constant account deletion.

Obviously for a commercial, advertiser-funded operation, it is all about more and more users and traffic and the quality of the content isn't a priority, but this eventually destroys everything. I'm imagining something much smaller, but potentially higher quality and self-sustaining. I guess I'm pretty much describing The Well, but hopefully cheaper and with more users, but not free and as many users as possible.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by brownbat on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:32PM (#17147453)
There used to be a mashup of random YouTube comments on one side, and random metafilter comments on the other testing, really validating, this theory.

The difference was pretty stark. I could only find breadcrumbs:

https://metatalk.metafilter.com/16003/Metafilter-comments-vs...

An example might be archived somewhere...

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by eli on Thursday May 24, 2018 @02:21PM (#17146808)
That's half of what makes the Metafilter discussions so good (the other half is aggressive behind-the-scenes moderation)
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by ythn on Thursday May 24, 2018 @02:37PM (#17146951)
Just unsubscribe all subreddits, and only opt-in to interesting, niche communities. My feed got 10000x less toxic after I unsubbed from /r/politics, /r/news, and the like
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jandrese on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:26PM (#17147386)
That's the opposite of solving the filter bubble problem though.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by dghughes on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:56AM (#17145228)
YouTube is as bad or worse as reddit. The more you look at one topic the more it is shown to you. You end up in a feedback loop the same thing.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by eropple on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:37PM (#17145721)
It's worse than that (and, I think, mendaciously so). YouTube tries to steer you towards the highest-viewed, most popular stuff on whatever very narrow vertical you're in...or a vertical that their algorithms have decided is nearby. Which is why you see people--mostly kids--going from videos about video games to videos about how the feminisms are taking away our video games to the feminisms are destroying Western society to straight-up white-supremacist agitprop.

Reddit is by no means clean; they just don't care about, as opposed to actively facilitate, this stuff. But you're right in that there are deep problems on YouTube, too.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by brownbat on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:38PM (#17147524)
Hmm, maybe it's bad in different ways for different viewers.

For me, it seems so ruthlessly risk averse that if I watch one video, it fills my queue with every single thing that person ever made, to the detriment of other interests.

Does YouTube assume all humanity is completely obsessive, based on some subset of frequent users who probably behave that way?

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jandrese on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:26PM (#17147380)
Youtube's suggestion system filters you towards the most extremist videos. It's a big problem and one that they don't seem interested at all in solving.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by eip on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:47PM (#17145838)
> I have been reflecting on ways to fix it lately.

Don't worry. They are pulling a Stumbleupon/Digg right now. Taking something that isn't broken and trying to fix it. The redesign is corporate suicide.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by jclos on Thursday May 24, 2018 @01:52PM (#17146483)
This is actually great. The only way a potentially viable alternative will succeed is if there is a mass migration from the main site, so I welcome their corporate suicide.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by brownbat on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:41PM (#17147559)
Digg is actually pretty good now that it's 100% curated.

Killing the community was one of the best moves they could have made.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by eip on Thursday May 24, 2018 @06:36PM (#17149110)
If their goal was to go from a top 50 website to a top 3000 website they certainly succeeded.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by brownbat on Friday May 25, 2018 @07:13PM (#17158926)
I wouldn't want to confuse popularity with quality.

Reality shows and daytime television are popular, that doesn't make them the best version of the art form.

HN flies a little under the radar. I don't think that's a failing.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by MaxBarraclough on Friday May 25, 2018 @07:28AM (#17152503)
If users are required to show their faces, it would be rather difficult to stop people connecting their various subreddit-specific accounts.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by zerostar07 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @04:27PM (#17148086)
ugggh no way jose. no "real names" - "real people"- "let me shit all over you with my ego"-maniacs. rather keep reddit where even the trolls are anonymous
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by Yhippa on Thursday May 24, 2018 @02:07PM (#17146665)
You know how there's a global NSFW tag that basically makes those posts not visible if you want? Would be cool if they had one for "memes".
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by foobarchu on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:47PM (#17147615)
Quite a few subreddits do have the 'shitpost' tag, but it would be nice if that could be applied in a global fashion instead of being per-sub styling.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by pavs on Thursday May 24, 2018 @02:07PM (#17146667)
how about a way to randomly visit Reddit/r/all links with the press of a button without having to deal with registration/participation/comments. or make comments optional. Similar to Stumbleupon iframe bar. Similar to Diggbar: http://blogoscoped.com/files/digg-bar-large.png
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by subpixel on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:34PM (#17145697)
I live in a particular neighborhood in a particular large US city, and our subreddit is a really useful source of local info.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by tacostakohashi on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:42PM (#17145784)
Yes! The subreddit for my large city is also pretty useful, by-and-large. It's things like that which are good about reddit, but could perhaps be improved upon - subreddits for cities, personalfinance, legaladvice, realestate, immigration - these serious topics could be even better by getting rid of the riff-raff.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by gitgud on Thursday May 24, 2018 @09:47PM (#17150015)
But StumbleUpon did have a comments section right? Could have sworn there was some kind of voting system, which allowed reviews...
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by qop on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:44PM (#17150451)
What makes you want to avoid your filter bubble?

Sorry, not trying to be funny here, I want to understand why there are some people who seem passionate about consuming their Internet methodically and sort of like egalitarian, and other people are just content to delve deeper into their own idiosyncratic impulses. I kind of think of like polarization in consumption habits as like recursion, almost. Ya know, because like it seems like people who make that connection that they like to consume content they already agree with and they can consume from some source to get that stimulus, that they end up recycling those behaviors into all the different media they consume until some point where they reach like an island in what content they engage with.

Anyways, do you have any idea? I'm just curious

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by dom96 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:45PM (#17145806)
Same. It's a real shame they are shutting it down. To be fair, I haven't used it in a long time.

I'm now wondering how do I rescue my data from StumbleUpon, I don't see any way to download it. I looked through the settings and my profile page. I even tried this new mix.com website and it didn't transfer any of my data from StumbleUpon. Anyone know whether I can export my data somehow?

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by gusanmaz on Wednesday May 30, 2018 @09:26AM (#17187446)
You could also check a tool I wrote that extracts page likes data as JSON file on https://github.com/gusanmaz/StumbleUponRescuer
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by Jonhoo on Tuesday May 29, 2018 @04:39PM (#17182746)
I wrote a tool that lets you do it here: https://github.com/jonhoo/su-extract :)
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by egfx on Thursday May 24, 2018 @11:35AM (#17145030)
Yep. Stumble Upon was great for that. Using it was like pressing buttons on a slot machine. I think Stumble Upon lost it's way soon after they dropped the Firefox toolbar in favor of the integrated iFrame. Only Yahoo! when it first came out, made me feel the way SU did.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by devnonymous on Thursday May 24, 2018 @12:44PM (#17145801)
Yep, this ! I stopped using StumbleUpon right after they decided to ditch the toolbar. The whole use case for StumbleUpon was to not visit a specific site but rather discover new ones. I used to absolutely love reading comments about the suggested pages as much as I liked the suggestions themselves. I also liked the tagging and searching through tags ..it was a bookmarking, social, reviewing, recommendation toolbar ...and then they went ahead and killed it trying to replicate arsebook or whatever.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by philipkglass on Thursday May 24, 2018 @03:00PM (#17147164)
StumbleUpon had a Firefox extension up until the last, but the original toolbar was a victim of Firefox's removal of XUL/XPCOM extensions in newer versions. Firefox has made a lot of improvements lately but I still miss the broader, more powerful variety of extensions that Firefox used to support.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by kregasaurusrex on Thursday May 24, 2018 @06:45PM (#17149179)
It was really great for finding new things, both in and outside your interests range! I'd tried it again once or twice in the past few years, and was annoyed at how often and how noticeable the 'sponsored stumbles' became. Felt more like watching a series of hyper-curated ads instead of a natural discovery engine.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by fuball63 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @10:34AM (#17144330)
I will still sometimes use it to break out of the humdrum of reddit/twitter/facebook.

The app had some UX issues, and some of the content could have used better curation, but overall I think the core idea is still relevant.

Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by kilroy123 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @05:18PM (#17148509)
Same here. I used it as recently as a month ago.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by antisocial on Thursday May 24, 2018 @10:00AM (#17144016)
Yes, it was my first tool of discovery too..
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by mergejoin on Thursday May 24, 2018 @10:12AM (#17144114)
Agreed, it was a great service.
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by aldoushuxley001 on Thursday May 24, 2018 @01:59PM (#17146555)
You had the opportunity to say you "stumbled upon" StumbleUpon!
Re:StumbleUpon closing after 16 years, accounts can be migra... by danieljohnson on Thursday May 24, 2018 @01:23PM (#17146225)
Amen. You speak for me too.