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Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by skookumchuck on Saturday March 10, 2018 @08:47PM (#16561249)
I'd be very careful about applying lessons from a game to the real world. Lots of games designed by economists, for example, tend to validate the pet theories of the economists, despite not working in the real world.

Real world economics is infinitely more complex than the handful of rules in a game.

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by Retric on Saturday March 10, 2018 @09:09PM (#16561331)
I think the biggest difference is most games tend to have anything not dead + positive resource stream = a win. People tend to build city's / county's / etc that go through a major such phase to maximize resource collection.

In reality you generally don't want to have 40 years of suck to get to some long term gain, because you need to live those 40 years.

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by lione on Sunday March 11, 2018 @12:44PM (#16563659)
You mean some sort of great leap forward produces negative results for your citizens until it's completed? I swear I heard a story similar to that in reality.
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by Retric on Sunday March 11, 2018 @08:59PM (#16565570)
The thing is relative to most developing nations China has had very slow economic growth. Yes, with a massive population, but China ranks 110 by purchasing power per person. It's economy is terrible, the only thing it has going for it is scale. And it's not like it has a massive population density either ranking at #80 world wide.
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by hobbes78 on Tuesday March 13, 2018 @01:03PM (#16577614)
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by Retric on Tuesday March 13, 2018 @06:27PM (#16580439)
developing nations

USA in 1980 was already a developed nation with a high relative standard of living. It could only grow GDP by inventing new technology and process not simply import proven tech.

China's continued failures are massive and ongoing. Some numbers look ok relative to their past failures but that's about it.

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by gdubs on Saturday March 10, 2018 @09:20PM (#16561387)
I don’t have a source — lazy Saturday here — but I recall something about city planners using Sim City back in the day as part of their education, which horrified Will Wright since in his words (paraphrasing) “sim city is just cellular automata with some differential equations sprinkled on top.”
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by ebcode on Sunday March 11, 2018 @12:11AM (#16561788)
Yeah, but who's to say that real cities aren't just cellular automata? They kind of look that way from space.
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by gowld on Sunday March 11, 2018 @01:57AM (#16561981)
Even if they are, they don't have the same rules as SimCity's
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by CalRobert on Sunday March 11, 2018 @10:39AM (#16563151)
Indeed, though in some cases it reveals that the problem is likely how we design actual cities.

http://humantransit.org/2013/05/how-sim-city-greenwashes-par...

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by RandomInteger4 on Saturday March 10, 2018 @10:39PM (#16561584)
Dear god ... that game makes so much more sense now when seen in that light. I can't believe I haven't made the connection before considering much I enjoy cellular automata.
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by teamonkey on Sunday March 11, 2018 @08:18AM (#16562706)
> tend to validate the pet theories of the economists

I don't think that's really true. I don't think any game company or designer cares about forcing a pet economic theory to work.

More that game economies have a purpose and can be explicitly modelled to achieve that purpose, even if that means doing unrealistic things (such as conjure up resources out of nowhere). That's not too say that they can't be an effective test model for real world scenarios, if you bear those conceits in mind.

If an economy makes players have a bad time, they can jump ship in a way that they can't do in the real world. There is a financial incentive for game designers to build an economy that makes players satisfied. Strictly modelling a game on real life economic policies is usually not a good way to achieve this. Vast resource inequality between players is a good way to kill a multiplayer game, for example - unless you even the divide in some way, only those at the very top want to keep playing.

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by rtpg on Sunday March 11, 2018 @09:46AM (#16562959)
I agree that game designers are also trying to make a system that's a good game. But I do understand GP's point here, insofar as the designers have to build the system within a certain frame of reference.

As an adjacent example, City Skylines is a pretty fun city builder. A huge simulation, down to very complex traffic models. You can build sprawling cities with a bunch of highways.

But it's extremely hard to build anything that replicates old European cities, or denser cities like in Asia, because your smallest useful road is very big in relation to the buildings. The tools given to you basically point you directly to American-style zoning that leads to suburban sprawl and huge highway systems.

In a sense, that's the point of the game (to make you fight traffic), but it's difficult if you are trying to build a certain kind of city that we know exist and are, in fact, "better cities".

The simulation presents a certain worldview of how cities are built.

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by michaelt on Sunday March 11, 2018 @10:05AM (#16563039)
If you're designing Sim City or Cities Skylines, your balancing decisions will still reflect theories though.

For example, mixing commercial and residential buildings - will it work or not?

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by skookumchuck on Saturday March 10, 2018 @10:39PM (#16561581)
For example, the classic board game "Monopoly" was invented to push an economic agenda:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/the-scandalous-history-of-monop...

Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by Nomentatus on Sunday March 11, 2018 @03:21AM (#16562033)
But taught me very different things...
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by NegativeLatency on Sunday March 11, 2018 @03:46AM (#16562095)
Counterpoint: Eve Online
Re:Playing Video Games with My Son Isn’t What I Thought It W... by zdkl on Sunday March 11, 2018 @04:24AM (#16562185)
Hey credit where credit is due, CCP is working very hard yo make the game enjoyable by the solo/little guys again, more options than straight up grinding. Still, hope you like multiaccount moon mining.