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Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by watwut on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:06PM (#14420143)
I found it oftentimes easier to say no without saying reason. The issue for me was that when I state reason, people wanted to negotiate, attempted to "advise" me on how organize my time better and so on and so forth. Overtime (at least against many people) I found it much less draining to simply insist on politely stated no without further explanation.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by icambron on Friday May 26, 2017 @12:15AM (#14421952)
This is my dad's strategy. He's a pretty affable guy and often willing to help, but he has a way of saying "no"--and just "no"--that makes it sound like he's declining a second serving of ice cream. It's calm, terse, and inarguably final. More importantly, it contains not a trace apology. On the rare occasion someone asks why he just says "I'm not going to do that."
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by skosch on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:13PM (#14420183)
Counterpoint: when people do this to me, I instinctively assume that the true reason is laziness. On top of that, I feel alienated – what, you think you're so important that you can brush me off just like that, and I'm not even worthy being given a reason?

Be careful with this one. It's very much possible to state a reason and still express that you won't change your mind on the matter. Although it is more effort, you won't lose people's goodwill.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by pdonis on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:36PM (#14420310)
> what, you think you're so important that you can brush me off just like that, and I'm not even worthy being given a reason?

If you're a family member, friend, coworker, etc.--i.e., someone who has a reasonable expectation of my putting aside whatever I'm doing to consider your request--then this response would be reasonable. (But even then you have to respect the other person's time.)

But that isn't what the author of the article was describing. He was describing people who had no valid reason to expect him to be at their beck and call, still treating him as if he were at their beck and call. Such people are not entitled to a reason, because they're not entitled to any claim on your time in the first place. A polite "no" is enough.

(I should probably also clarify that by "friend" I don't mean "someone I just met on Facebook" or "someone I have a few beers with once in a while". I mean someone you have known for a fair amount of time and with whom you have mutual trust.)

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by TeMPOraL on Friday May 26, 2017 @12:41AM (#14422033)
> someone who has a reasonable expectation of my putting aside whatever I'm doing to consider your request--then this response would be reasonable. (But even then you have to respect the other person's time.)

The remark in parenthesis is pretty important here. A lot of people seem to feel entitled to your full and immediate attention 24/7 just because they're family or know you for a while. I suppose GP feels that too ("what, you think you're so important that you can brush me off just like that, and I'm not even worthy being given a reason?"). There's this strange phenomenon when people in some sort of relationship start treating the other party with less respect they'd show to a stranger.

I spent a lot of my late-teen / young-adult years teaching people around me that yes, I'm always open to help, but if you want me to consider your request, please respect my time and focus - it'll be better for both of us. I even translated PG's "Maker's Schedule, Manager's Schedule" just so I could show it to my mom (and some other) in order to explain why I don't respond well to being asked to do trivial errands at random times during the day.

At work I simplify this - when I want to signal I'm concentrating, I just put on over-the-ear headphones.

And mind you - I'm probably one of the more accommodating person you'd met. I find it very hard to say "no" when people ask me for help nicely. What I wrote above is the result of dealing with years of frustration and eventually deciding it's too much.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by ShabbosGoy on Friday May 26, 2017 @02:55AM (#14422407)
> I even translated PG's "Maker's Schedule, Manager's Schedule" just so I could show it to my mom (and some other) in order to explain why I don't respond well to being asked to do trivial errands at random times during the day.

I had not even thought of doing this, it's brilliant. I often run into this issue with my mother when I visit, even though I am her adult son. I will certainly try this.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by TeMPOraL on Friday May 26, 2017 @06:58AM (#14423171)
It was important for me back in my university days, when I was still living in family home. Now, when I visit my mother, I just block off that chunk of a day (preferably the last part of the day, because conversations with her and my younger brother are so interesting I stay hours longer than I planned...).

Anyway, for people from Poland who might find the essay useful, here's the translation: http://esejepg.pl/eseje/makersschedule.html. There are also some others (in particular, I wanted to have "What You'll Wish You'd Known" available too, to show to my younger siblings).

(I'd also love to get some help with translating more of the essays. After some personal issues back some 4 years ago I lost the drive to continue the work; since then, however, I've been told those translations are actually being printed out and given to people in some business classes, which sounds like they're useful to someone.)

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by averagewall on Thursday May 25, 2017 @08:51PM (#14421318)
I don't like giving reasons anymore because they're usually a lie. I don't write up a list of pros and cons and find there's only one con and that's the one true reason for not wanting to do it. Reasons are complicated and hard to know yourself. By saying it, the other person can find a way to show it's not true, or get another reason out of you which shows your first reason wasn't complete. People have sometimes used my reasons against me - "remember that time you said you did X because of Y?, Now you're saying Y wasn't true, so you were lying back then!" They miss the fact that there are multiple reasons, and they aren't binary ("I want to" and "I don't want to" can both be true at the same time!) and I miss the fact that I cherry pick reasons that seem placating and omit the reasons that might seem rude.

It's not rudeness, but honesty that makes me dislike giving reasons. Sometimes I give the reason "I don't want to" which seems about as correct as I can understand.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by dermybaby on Thursday May 25, 2017 @11:51PM (#14421875)
"Reasons are complicated and hard to know yourself" -- this is especially true for complex decisions. Sometimes you don't know yourself and trust your gut instinct. The real reason your inner thought suggested a 'no' reveals to you slowly. By explaining your reason to others you risk closing that loop. Some thoughts are better unsaid.

edit: I have found this especially true in family/personal matters

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by Swizec on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:31PM (#14420285)
It's a confidence thing. You don't need a reason to say No.

If somebody thinks you lazy, so be it. But you don't owe anyone a reason.

Reasons, as you see them, are often "excuses" to the other person. Mught be even worse. Now you're not just lazy, you also make excuses.

Personally I'm bad at this too. I often give reasons/excuses when there's no need and even more often I say No by not saying anything at all and waiting for the thing to pass.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by manmal on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:52PM (#14420426)
I think there's only a fine line between a reason and an excuse. An excuse is said with a culpable face and body language, while a reason is given neutrally, or maybe extra confident. You give excuses because you feel guilty, or give reasons because you know that you are right. I often force myself to do the latter - keeping an upright posture and a straight face helps a lot if you cannot get rid of the guilt feeling.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by dasil003 on Thursday May 25, 2017 @06:39PM (#14420704)
It's much more clear cut than that. An excuse is for something that you committed to. If you manage your time properly then you will only have to make excuses in extraordinary circumstances and you will develop a reputation for integrity. If you try to please everyone you will fail and eventually develop a reputation as a flake.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by watwut on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:46PM (#14420379)
It is not so much about me being important, it is more about me guarding privacy/autonomy/independence. It is not about your worth either, usually it is about that person negotiation tactic. Even if it would be laziness (or need for rest), you are still asking some extra time I don't ow you from me.

If saying the reason would not lead to people taking advantage of it, I would say it. But with many people it does.

But I would not just brush you off, actually. I would attempt to find a way to help you if I would see one or attempted to redirect you to someone who can help. So even if I wont do what you want, unless I have bad experience with you personally, I would try to figure out alternative solution.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by johnnyhillbilly on Thursday May 25, 2017 @06:49PM (#14420745)
Regarding favours: People that feel entitled to one's time can go think about their own attitude. The goodwill you mention is not good will at all. Whether the declining party's true reason is laziness is literally none of your business - unless you have one of a very few types of relationships.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by icanhackit on Thursday May 25, 2017 @08:12PM (#14421096)
> Counterpoint: when people do this to me, I instinctively assume that the true reason is laziness

It depends on who you are in the scheme of things. If you're a friend, colleague or family member you have the expectation that you can depend on a person because of your proximity to them in a social network. No usually does need to be qualified in those cases. But if you're not closely tied to a person in a network and request something from them, to expect a reason or explanation for non-compliance is unreasonable.

Social networks often act as ledgers for who owes whom what and when you're asked by someone who is a distant node in the network to do something the risk is greater that your actions won't be reciprocated in some form, even if its simply an acknowledgement of what you did for them, because you can't appraise their character.

Caveats: Money is a shortcut through all of this social-ledger malarkey. My explanation ignores time as a cost factor. I can't back any of this up with facts.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by TeMPOraL on Friday May 26, 2017 @12:49AM (#14422058)
Money to social networks is IMO like "System 2" to "System 1". We're wired to handle the "who owes whom" in small groups; money lets us scale this to a large society.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by icanhackit on Friday May 26, 2017 @01:57AM (#14422246)
So I guess we're at System 3 with crypto currency? A ledger for every item/exchange and plotting their movement/consequence through the course of time?
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by TeMPOraL on Friday May 26, 2017 @03:51AM (#14422596)
I apologize, I forgot to clarify in the original comment. I mean "System 1" and "System 2" as introduced by Kahneman. To quote from the Wiki[0],

> "System 1" is fast, instinctive and emotional; "System 2" is slower, more deliberative, and more logical.

[0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thinking,_Fast_and_Slow

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by Aeolun on Thursday May 25, 2017 @10:50PM (#14421708)
If the true reason is laziness, isn't that still a perfectly valid reason? I just don't particularly feel like moving your damn couch right now, I'd rather watch Netflix.

When I'm imposing on your time it's only normal that you get a chance to say 'no', whatever the reason for it.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by skosch on Friday May 26, 2017 @07:49AM (#14423384)
You know what, I put that poorly. You're absolutely right, laziness is perfectly valid.

There's nevertheless a psychological difference between (variations on) "sorry dude, too many things on my plate this week" and "No.". There's nothing about the former anyone one can argue with, but it shows that you value basic human mutual understanding.

If the couch-owner truly lacks self-awareness, to the point where they constantly badger you with unreasonable requests (we all know that one guy), then a "No." isn't going to enlighten them either – in that case, you do them a favour by respectfully but explicitly informing them that their request is unreasonable.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by piyush_soni on Friday May 26, 2017 @01:31AM (#14422183)
Yes, but then laziness is not a highly valued human quality, so next time whenever you need help, people might feel about it the same way. And if someone gives that reason on a habitual basis, it might just actually mean he is not a helpful person. However, if you give them a short genuine reason of why you can't do it at that time, may be you'll have some hope.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by rytill on Thursday May 25, 2017 @08:17PM (#14421130)
Seems like that's at least partially on you.

I have a friend like this and, while we get along great most of the time, he is always interrogating people who say no to him and you can just tell he's assuming 'the true reason is laziness'.

People make complex decisions and they shouldn't always have to explain why. Especially with someone you trust.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by TeMPOraL on Friday May 26, 2017 @12:54AM (#14422074)
When I feel someone is thinking this way ("true reason is laziness"), I instinctively react in an unpleasant way. I've been using a phrase "you treat me with less respect you'd treat a stranger" to remind them that empathy goes both ways, and I'm not their servant but independent human being.

I.e. if in the way you ask you show you're expecting them to comply, you're doing it wrong. Show respect to people's need for autonomy, and they'll be more willing to help you out.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by bluetwo on Thursday May 25, 2017 @10:05PM (#14421587)
Here is my strategy: Say "No" without a reason, but give at some reasonable alternatives. I will not lie.

"No, I can't do that for you at 5pm on a Friday. I can have it for you by noon on Monday, you can ask X to do the work, or you can invent a time machine and go back 24-hours and give the work to me yesterday."

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by nf05papsjfVbc on Friday May 26, 2017 @08:33AM (#14423577)
This still puts the 'requestee' in a bind. Why should s/he have to think-of/figure-out an alternative? The requestor should be able to take a "no" for an answer and not feel entitled. Of course gentleness and politeness (usually) go a long way in making it easier.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by bluetwo on Saturday May 27, 2017 @11:28PM (#14432969)
Yes, always be polite. I find if you give some reasonable alternatives, they often take one of them. Sometimes you need to let them talk a little more to find out really what they are trying to accomplish and what the priorities are.

I have incorrectly assumed that time or money were the priorities, but with a little more information found out something else was really driving the request.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by DanBC on Friday May 26, 2017 @08:37AM (#14423593)
Sometimes the person making the request is entitled - they're in a management role and they're giving you a task. In that situation it's a good idea to show that you would do it if you could, but at the moment you can't. That allows the manager to do their job (assigning priority) and makes it clear the decision to reassign work was theirs, not yours.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by coldtea on Friday May 26, 2017 @02:47AM (#14422388)
>Counterpoint: when people do this to me, I instinctively assume that the true reason is laziness.

What about the laziness of not handling the matter yourself? Talk about entitlement!

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by qrbLPHiKpiux on Friday May 26, 2017 @07:45AM (#14423359)
No one owes an explanation to anyone.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by skosch on Friday May 26, 2017 @07:52AM (#14423400)
True! I regret the way I put that.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by coldtea on Friday May 26, 2017 @01:57PM (#14425954)
Heh, don't sweat it. Just driving the point you've made further (that such an assumption can backfire).
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by rthomas6 on Thursday May 25, 2017 @10:03PM (#14421580)
How much do you ask of people that people brushing you off is a common occurance?
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by psyc on Thursday May 25, 2017 @08:21PM (#14421162)
I don't think I'm more important than you, but you bet I think I'm important enough to say no to anybody without a reason.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by x0x0 on Friday May 26, 2017 @01:34AM (#14422193)
You're pretty entitled there -- not only are you demanding things from other people, but if they don't fulfill your requests, they have to give you a reason to your satisfaction or you think poorly of them! You should really think about learning some boundaries, and that you're not entitled to things from other people.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by skosch on Friday May 26, 2017 @08:02AM (#14423444)
How I regret the way I phrased that! Coincidentally I'm a shy person, and probably too afraid of asking other people for help with even the smallest things.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by adrianmonk on Thursday May 25, 2017 @08:30PM (#14421211)
Yes, unfortunately true. It gives the other person a signal that says "I feel like you have enough power in this situation that I have to justify this decision to you".

And if they are the type to push people around whenever they are able, you've basically just told them they are going to win this battle, so go ahead.

Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by edgartaor on Friday May 26, 2017 @01:19AM (#14422148)
I couldn't say better.
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by manmal on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:15PM (#14420195)
If saying "no" without giving a reason does not alienate people, then you are probably very good at this game :) Do you probably add a compassionate "Sorry I cannot help you here" or something?
Re:Why I Quit Being So Accommodating (1922) by watwut on Thursday May 25, 2017 @05:34PM (#14420304)
Yeah, I usually try to communicate that I understand that it is important for them and take them seriously. If possible, I would also attempt to find another solution or something like that. Also, if you are someone I have good experience with I would give you a reason.

Yet also, I help if I can and if it does not cost me all that much. It is not like I would be saying only no to everyone around.

This strategy is largely the answer to specific people I deal with and their strategies. It does alienates them a bit sometimes, but it is not possible to keep everyone happy all that time and I am very unhappy with that negotiation I am trying to avoid.