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Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dis-sys on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:59AM (#14330722)
Lessons learnt by ransomware developers - rather than using a single pretty arbitrary test, always rely on a more robust statistical model to detect whether your code is running inside a sandbox.

Lessons learnt by NSA - never over estimate the skill level of your network admins.

Lessons learnt by Microsoft - never under estimate the loyalty of your Chinese Windows XP users, both XP and Win10 have 18% of the Chinese market [1].

Lessons learnt by the Chinese central government - NSA is a partner not a threat, they build tools which can make the coming annual China-US cyber security talk smooth.

[1] http://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/windows/de...

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by jahabrewer on Saturday May 13, 2017 @12:10PM (#14331633)
> Lessons learnt by ransomware developers - rather than using a single pretty arbitrary test, always rely on a more robust statistical model to detect whether your code is running inside a sandbox.

I like to imagine that one of the developers on that team filed a tech debt item to do exactly this, was never able to get their manager to prioritize it, and is now pulling out their hair saying, "I told you so!"

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by BrainInAJar on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:40PM (#14333372)
> I like to imagine that one of the developers on that team filed a tech debt item to do exactly this, was never able to get their manager to prioritize it, and is now pulling out their hair saying, "I told you so!"

Malware authors have budgets and schedules too. It's a business, probably more profitable than 90% of the startups in SV

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by 794CD01 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:23PM (#14333636)
That's not exactly high praise. A tuft of grass is more profitable than 90% of the startups in SV.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by secondhandvape on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:37PM (#14333675)
Especially if that tuft of grass is on piece of real estate in the bay area.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by EGreg on Sunday May 14, 2017 @10:23AM (#14335747)
I wonder if Levi's jeans were more profitable than the average goldbug
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by blablabla123 on Monday May 15, 2017 @03:42PM (#14344495)
Haha... That's a quite negative point of view. I mean even though most startups don't survive and won't make the involved parties more wealthy, there are people who actually use that stuff. From a user perspective it's profitable ;)
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by duncan_bayne on Sunday May 14, 2017 @02:44AM (#14334571)
> It's a business

No, it's not, and it's pretty damn rude to make that claim in the presence of legitimate businesspeople.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ageofwant on Sunday May 14, 2017 @04:42AM (#14334826)
Oh please. How many "legitimate businesspeople" believe its their moral duty to spend millions on tax evasion lawyers and schemes. That think nothing of destroying thousands of lives and millions of man years worth of hard-gotten savings from the defenseless with legal but immoral schemes. It is perfectly legitimate business people that refer to patients as "units" and literally let them die if not money can be made of them. I'll type all day and not get to 10% of legit accusations I can make against "legitimate businesspeople".

I'll take an honest crook any day.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by xorxornop on Tuesday May 16, 2017 @04:03AM (#14348069)
Haha, yep. At least they're honest about screwing you.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by klez on Sunday May 14, 2017 @04:27AM (#14334784)
They didn't say "reputable business". Even the mob is a business, meaning "something whose purpose is making money" (over-simplified, but I'm sure you'll get the point).
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by mowenz on Tuesday May 16, 2017 @01:15AM (#14347524)
The definition of a business is an entity which provides goods/services to consumers.

The typical moral distinction b/w a business and other entities which make[1] money is a business (presumably) does it within the constraint of their counterparties enjoying the liberty of choice. This becomes a grey area when government enters the picture and removes liberties--which is why there is debate about the legitimate role of government's monopoly on legitimate violence/aggression here.

1 - note, a further distinction could be made between entities which create value, and those which transfer it.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by beaconstudios on Wednesday May 17, 2017 @12:43PM (#14360190)
> The definition of a business is an entity which provides goods/services to consumers.

That's not true. A business is a vehicle for making money, that's it. Most businesses do this by providing goods or services, but certainly not all - for example, financial traders that only manage their own funds, like the Renaissance Medallion fund.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by mowenz on Wednesday May 17, 2017 @09:05PM (#14364136)
Financial traders are still buying and selling goods and services with a counterparty.

Even here, we still can observe that in most cases (except those where government interferes, or perhaps with organized crime) the counterparty is also enjoying a choice in whether or not they want to do the deal. I would argue that in cases where a counterparty has no choice, such a scheme should not be viewed as a legitimate busines, as it historically would not be.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by beaconstudios on Thursday May 18, 2017 @06:58AM (#14366217)
that's basically the root argument of libertarianism - that forced transactions are unethical and thus taxation is theft.

I'd still argue that a business does not have to provide a good or service to be considered a business though. The Medallion Fund that I mentioned solely exists to make money for its owners - it does not provide any goods or services.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by 13of40 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @01:53PM (#14332109)
I like to think that they know anything they implement will eventually get blocked, so they have a big collection of unexploited evasion tricks and just introduce them one by one.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by nray on Saturday May 13, 2017 @02:04PM (#14332155)
I like to think wankers who stop hospitals go to jail and never work with a PC again. It would be nice if those BTC were hard to cash out too.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by meowface on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:15PM (#14332499)
Not that it exonerates them whatsoever, but these kinds of attacks (including Wana Cryptor) usually aren't tailored for hospitals or any particular institution. They just harvest as many email addresses as they can (from leaks and purchased lists from spammers, etc.) and try to get as many infections as possible.

Hospitals just happened to be disproportionately affected by this attack because a lot of them have ineffective IT departments/mangement and never applied the MS17-010 patch.

Of course, these people are still felons and are likely responsible for millions of lost family photos, work and school documents, etc. They just aren't going out of their way to target hospitals.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by SapphireSun on Saturday May 13, 2017 @10:31PM (#14333951)
I understand what you're trying to say, but think about what happens when the military strikes a hospital and calls it "collateral damage." While you're correct that these people probably did not intend to damage hospitals, they could have reasonably foreseen that an indiscriminate attack on computer networks around the globe would have deleterious effects on essential infrastructure.

This means that they knowingly or with reckless negligence unleashed such an attack on the world. If they had been more "scrupulous" criminals, they would have more narrowly tailored their attack on targets they believed deserved to be extorted or where such extortion would not interfere with life critical systems.

I'm not a lawyer, but if they were a nation state, I believe they would have violated the Geneva Convention's prohibition on attacking hospitals.

That said, I think this attack gives more weight to NSA critics that contend that their exploit research should be focused more on defense rather than offensive capabilities. Their carelessness combined with another group wanting to embarrass them is what allowed this indiscriminate attack to be inflicted on civilian infrastructure.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by bostik on Sunday May 14, 2017 @09:51AM (#14335609)
> think about what happens when the military strikes a hospital and calls it "collateral damage."

Old news. The more recent and much more insidious variant is calling the hospitals simply "valid targets".

Or in case of an unexpectedly intense media backlash, "a mistake".[0]

0: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunduz_hospital_airstrike

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dmix on Monday May 15, 2017 @04:31PM (#14344856)
When it comes to military/state objectives that the public poorly understands the risk scenario is quite different.

Which is why we're currently in a situation where zero-days that NSA easily knew would be leaked were not patched at least a month ahead of time were left unpatched. The costs aren't significant enough to motivate them to respond to their failures.

People like to blame the capitalistic incentives for not upgrading from Windows XP but to me the failure to respond to this obvious outcome of the leaking of NSA malware is far more insidious. These sys-admins managing old systems were not prepared for state-financed malware to be released to C-level cyber criminals as a 'threat-actor'.

The poor state of corporate information security has been exposed in the last few days, but even that sorry state is nothing compared to the failed responsibility of the US government to value their citizens over internal objectives. Which is increasingly a common narrative that is a unsurprisingly a result of the unencumbered growth of the security state and by proxy the executive branch whom they ultimately report to.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by cubano on Sunday May 14, 2017 @12:44PM (#14336309)
I understand your sentiment, but what exactly is the military to do when the enemy specifically uses hospitals to house command bunkers?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lostlogin on Monday May 15, 2017 @01:00AM (#14339268)
Do many people think that bombing the patients is the acceptable answer?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ptaipale on Monday May 15, 2017 @06:21AM (#14340440)
The hospital really needs to move the patients out immediately if the local military starts military operations from within hospital (which is basically a war crime).

Then, if the commanders force patients to stay by threat of violence to stay as human shields, that's a further war crime. The responsibility of casualties here is more with those using patients like this, than anyone else.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by RodericDay on Monday May 15, 2017 @09:43AM (#14341475)
This seems like a long-winded way of saying "yes we bomb patients". Do you actually believe this?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by iaskwhy on Monday May 15, 2017 @08:11AM (#14340931)
There's probably a reason why we don't start killing hostages in an hostage situation.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Ntrails on Tuesday May 16, 2017 @10:32AM (#14349852)
Typically because the cost of not killing the hostage takers is basically the risk of dead hostages. There's nothing else at stake. You can safely assume that the next plane full of hostages that has terrorists at the controls will be shot down.

I'm not really advocating yes or no to bombing hospitals or schools to kill terrorist leaders hiding within - but your assertion is false. We will kill the hostages. All actual breaches involve a risk of % losses and that's baked into the decision to go in. Just a person somewhere trying to make a decision about the best outcome, for the "greater good".

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lostlogin on Monday May 15, 2017 @04:27PM (#14344831)
Obviously using human shields like this is criminal. Do you see the people who bomb hospitals as baring any responsibility?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by cubano on Monday May 15, 2017 @11:58AM (#14342581)
I believe many in the military would simple say that Total War doctrine, present since perhaps the US Civil War and definitely by World War I, would argue bombing patents to get at command-and-control would be acceptable during times of war.

Now before everyone buries me, total war is a rather rare military state, and probably only present a select few times in the 20th century.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by tomjen3 on Monday May 15, 2017 @12:31PM (#14342885)
About one million Germans were dead or wounded as a result of allied bombing. Almost certainly entire hospitals were blown up too, in Dresden if nothing else.

A small prize to pay for not having nazies stomp around my backyard (almost literally, there are remnants of a nazi bunker not half a mile from where I live).

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lostlogin on Monday May 15, 2017 @04:03PM (#14344656)
Area bombing was largely ineffective and German production increased during the heaviest periods. In the view of many, it was a crime committed by a vindictive group of criminals. Area bombing has some well documented cases of slowing down the fall of nazis (hindering troop advances, taking away a lot of war production resources etc) but little evidence of speeding up the end.

Edit: good book on the subject https://www.google.co.nz/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/books/201...

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by 794CD01 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:24PM (#14333640)
True of this attack, but ransomware attacks targeted specifically against hospitals have been booming over the past year or two. Aside from poor IT, hospitals often need immediate access to that data to treat patients, which makes them much more likely to pay. Which also means they generally ask for more than 300 dollars - that's the real proof that NHS was just collateral damage.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by PhasmaFelis on Sunday May 14, 2017 @02:00AM (#14334462)
Indeed. t you chuck a Molotov into a crowded theater, you don't get to claim that you didn't mean to hit any children.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by toyg on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:27PM (#14332554)
> never applied the MS17-010 patch.

Until today, there was nothing to apply if your computers were running XP or 2003. Guess which Windows versions are the most popular in UK hospitals? So I think your sentence should read like "Hospitals just happened to be disproportionately affected by this attack because they were forced to trust Microsoft would never put corporate profit before social responsibility."

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by meowface on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:39PM (#14332608)
XP and 2003 have been end-of-life for years. They both were released 14+ years ago. So you can just change what I said to:

"because a lot of them have ineffective IT departments/mangement and never applied the MS17-010 patch or are running ancient operating systems."

edit: And in fact, Microsoft did release a special XP hotfix for this vulnerability yesterday: https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/msrc/2017/05/12/customer...

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by stuartd on Saturday May 13, 2017 @04:38PM (#14332878)
> because a lot of them are running ancient operating systems that are the only ones that can interoperate with legacy hardware

FTFY

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by linkregister on Saturday May 13, 2017 @04:44PM (#14332910)
What news reports said anything about legacy hardware? The BBC and Reuters articles claimed the NHS suffered infection of their patient records servers and their reception computers.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ptaipale on Monday May 15, 2017 @06:24AM (#14340446)
Apparently the impacted XP and 2003 machines were accessing the same disk servers as the patient record systems. Thus an infected CAT scanner controller (or whatever) was able to destroy the patient records.

That doesn't tell a story of missing money or maintenance contracts. It tells of poor or even irresponsible and incompetent deployment procedures.

You shouldn't allow your CAT scanner to write over your patient records at a server. You shouldn't even have them in the same network segment.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by throwaway049 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:05PM (#14333019)
And on legacy software. My NHS Trust seems to have escaped unscathed, but it has software that won't run on modern systems which is why XP is still seen in most departments.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by smitherfield on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:52PM (#14333215)
What software is that? There is a 32-bit version of Windows 10, which can still run 16-bit Windows/DOS programs, and IE11 still supports ActiveX, Silverlight, Java applets and even (in IE10 compatibility mode) VBScript.

So AFAICT 32-bit W10 can run most anything 32-bit XP can (likewise the 64-bit versions, though neither can run 16-bit programs), and IE11 can run most anything IE8 can (with minor configuration).

Is it software that relies on undocumented APIs? (I can't imagine why hospital software would require exotic methods of poking at the kernel or hardware).

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by slackingoff2017 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:55PM (#14333721)
A lot of times it's the hardware interface that's the issue. Old stuff uses serial and parallel ports, motherboard slots,or even abuses PS2 for other purposes.

Good luck finding a windows 10 compatible PC that has ISA slots for example. A lot of old custom hardware hooked right into the ISA bus

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by PhasmaFelis on Sunday May 14, 2017 @07:53PM (#14338175)
There is definitely software made for one version of Windows that won't run on another, regardless of bit count. Not a lot of it, but it's there.

In my experience, industrial software is often pretty poorly designed, so it wouldn't surprise me if it's more common in a hospital environment.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by vmateixeira on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:47PM (#14333393)
because .. drivers?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by smitherfield on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:52PM (#14333405)
For what? Surely buying new printers is less expensive in the long or even short run than continuing to use an EOL-ed operating system.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ptaipale on Sunday May 14, 2017 @10:49AM (#14335841)
We're not talking about printers.

We're talking about medical equipment, such as CAT scanners, dialysis machines, radiation therapy devices, chemical analysators and the like. Stuff where the computer interface could be an afterthought, added to a machine that was designed years ago with a physical knobs-and-dials type of user interface, and implemented and certified for a particular PC hardware generation. Then this interface PC becomes obsolete in 15 years even if the equipment itself would work for a hundred.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Tarq0n on Sunday May 14, 2017 @11:46AM (#14336043)
Is there any reason why medical equipment couldn't at least be airgapped or on a network without an outside connection at least? Still seems irresponsible.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lostlogin on Monday May 15, 2017 @01:06AM (#14339283)
Imaging tech here. Remote logins from vendor service staff are very helpful when stuff breaks as they can order parts or suggest fixes without coming in. They also track things like helium levels and water temperatures. Problems in these areas can be very very expensive. Losing a hour can be a loss in thousands in revenue very easily, let alone a few weeks of scanner time and tens (or maybe even low hundreds) of thousands in helium and parts.

Other reasons for network connectivity include retrieving and sending image sequences and data files (basically the actual scans) which is done all day everyday.

The more alarming part is the retrieving of raw data which is the unreconstructed scan. This involves attaching a memory stick that is supposedly clean and uploading to that. Generally this stick is stuck into any old researcher PC and files are off loaded. Vendors don't particularly like this but getting 10-20 gig files off the scanner via command line is pretty clunky at the best of times.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ptaipale on Monday May 15, 2017 @03:08AM (#14339740)
Such devices absolutely should be isolated in separate networks (DMZs), and connections to outside world should be removed except for the bare minimum.

That the NHS has not done this is their actual failing and negligence. It doesn't take that much money to move such devices to a quarantined network.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by xorxornop on Tuesday May 16, 2017 @04:08AM (#14348093)
I mean, they are being systematically under-funded by one of the UK parties such that it will fail, so they can then point at it saying "I told you so", and so then get to adopt a US-like system, so they too can get in on that sweet, sweet cashflow :/
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by andy_ppp on Saturday May 13, 2017 @07:51PM (#14333561)
I assume drivers for scanners... but yes, if you underfund a healthcare system (remember half the cost of the US system for better outcomes) and constantly demand "efficiency savings" (and cancel long term Microsoft support contract) managers will cut IT before frontline services.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by smitherfield on Saturday May 13, 2017 @09:23PM (#14333780)
Places that cut the IT budget first are also places that raise the IT budget last.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by TheCoelacanth on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:24PM (#14333097)
XP has been unsupported for over three years and 2003 for nearly two years. Still using them at this point is gross negligence on the part of the hospitals.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by edmccard on Saturday May 13, 2017 @07:17PM (#14333474)
>Still using them at this point is gross negligence

I'd guess that most hospitals don't do in-house development for the software they use. They paid someone else for it, probably at "enterprise" rates; it's hard to blame them for not having the budget or desire to replace working systems with new shiny (complete with new bugs) every X years.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by worldsayshi on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:25PM (#14333644)
Sigh, we need to fix the software economy. Imagine if the software being used by hospitals and other public institutions was open source as a rule. Then maybe it could actually be reused and collaborated on instead of rotting away with the need of replacing it all when it's just not usable any more.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by majewsky on Sunday May 14, 2017 @02:40PM (#14336916)
If only some guy with a long beard had told us for the last 30 years what was going to happen! :)
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by jessaustin on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:30PM (#14333657)
This thread seems to be a series of "well, they had to make this error because previously they had made this other error"... presumably this can go on ad naseum, but isn't the eventual resolution going to be "spend money to install current hardware and software"? They could have done that at any point in the past. Complicated etiologies for broken systems, miss the forest for the trees.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by edmccard on Saturday May 13, 2017 @09:56PM (#14333841)
>Complicated etiologies for broken systems...

...are how the state-of-the-art is advanced in other industries? Imagine if the FAA's response to an air disaster was, "Never mind root causes, you just should've bought a newer plane".

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ethelward on Sunday May 14, 2017 @09:47AM (#14335591)
If they were flying airplanes from the 50's not supported by their constructors anymore, I'd say it'd be pretty good answer.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Piskvorrr on Thursday May 18, 2017 @08:33AM (#14366651)
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Zenst on Sunday May 14, 2017 @02:39PM (#14336907)
Back in the late 90's the government of the time split the NHS into Trusts and outsourced the IT to the likes of ICL (not sure who does it now). With that the last time any major overhaul was done upon the hardware and software was Y2K and as with most outsourced IT contracts it focused upon support from a reaction basis and not a proactive one.

With that the GSN (Government Secure Network) is still a good ring-fence (that's outsourced as well) but once something gets inside, boom.

Now with the Trusts - they do have a local IT bod and in the cases I dealt with, somebody who knew how a PC works and enthusiastic, which is nice but also dangerous and I had to deal with a few issues that were as I call them "enthusiastically driven". As such you have all these Trusts operating at some level as independants and with varity of results.

One case, was one `IT manager` at a Trust who was posting on a alt.ph.uk (UK hacking usenet group) and offering up inside information about how they operated. That did not happen as the alt.ph.uk lot are a moral ethical lot and health services are taboo, so was rightly shot down and equally the chap was soon in talks with security services.

But with so many legacy systems, and an event driven support mentality (again Y2K being an exception) then such events can and will happen. Sadly many trusts lack provision to handle such issues and as with many IT area's are event driven instead of being proactive. Indeed ITIL the golden managment love-in solution for support management is event-driven and many an implementation ticks all the ITIL boxes of compliance and yet still lack proactive support. This alas is mostly gets compared to firefighters pouring water on buildings so they won't catch fire and sadly pretty darn systemic in many an organization.

With that the best anybody in IT can do it to flag up an issue in a documented way to cover there ass then the outlined event does transpire to prevent unfair scapegoating. A sad situation of which many of not all IT support staff in all capacities can attest too.

Ironicaly DOS based legacy systems with no networking and exitic ISA cards in some equally over-priced hardware still work and the need to replace them does become moot, alas that example gets projected upon other systems that are networked. But the whole health industry has many legacy setup's that are expensive to replace, more so if they work and the motivation to limit potential damage from future events above and beyond backup's becomes a management issue that lacks a voice for budgets.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by mirimir on Saturday May 13, 2017 @09:49PM (#14333825)
No argument about the hospitals.

But making BTC hard to cash out is a hard problem. Although particular addresses can be blacklisted, mixing services are now mainstream. Some return fresh BTC from miners. Even so, it's problematic to mix humongous quantities. For example, the Sheep Marketplace owner/thief overwhelmed Bitcoin Fog with 10^5 BTC. The trail went dead after that, but he got busted while cashing out. His girlfriend was receiving huge international wire transfers, and could not explain where the money was coming from.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by smitherfield on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:29PM (#14333121)
It probably originated in Russia or one of the other cybercrime-heavy ex-Soviet states (Ukraine, Belarus, etc), so outside the jurisdiction of UK authorities. Although this time it appears to have done most of its damage in Russia, so the perpetrators might not benefit from the usual blind eye.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by 13of40 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @02:15PM (#14332211)
I've seen ransomware that explicitly tried to avoid hospitals, schools, government, etc., so there's that. I always assumed it was out of self interest though.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by walshemj on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:24PM (#14332542)
Yes screwing some Radom punter over is quite different that triggering an attack that meets the crtiteria for a CNI attack.

All this means instead of pc plod being unable extradite the perps from eastern Europe to you get the serious players involved.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by idonotknowwhy on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:26PM (#14333649)
Nah, let's not jeopardize the fungibility of bitcoins please. Besides, with anon-coins like zcash, what you're proposing would not be possible.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Dolores12 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:02PM (#14332433)
There is nothing that stops them to relaunch attack with modified version. Initial wave will use spam, then worm-like part of the ransomware will penetrate internal networks.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by wand3r on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:30PM (#14333334)
Sure but this generated a lot of press so it made the vuln more known; Microsoft released a patch and systems are likely less vulnerable to the same attack.

Similar attacks using other vulns or tooling are inevitable but this is prob much less impactful and the registration probably mitigated a lot of damage

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by EGreg on Sunday May 14, 2017 @10:30AM (#14335777)
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by libeclipse on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:46PM (#14333191)
You make it sound like some professional outfit. Is it really like that? I would've thought that it's a bunch of teens.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lmm on Sunday May 14, 2017 @03:44AM (#14334697)
I doubt it. This is organised crime motivated by money (which is usually something adults do); the very fact that the program tries to detect whether it's being sandboxed indicates a certain level of professionalism.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by bcruddy on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:04PM (#14333245)
You think a bunch of teens orchestrated a global attack on this scale? Surely this is satire and you dropped the /s right?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by edmccard on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:17PM (#14333295)
>...orchestrated a global attack on this scale?

Was it "orchestrated", or did the worm just spread randomly and opportunistically?

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by napsterbr on Saturday May 13, 2017 @07:10PM (#14333450)
My bet is a bunch of teens. Not really orchestrated as much as exploited a vulnerability amplified by p2p connection, which led to worldwide scale.

By the look and UX of the virus (yes there's a UX there too), they do seem to have a better grasp than most script kiddies, who usually can barely extend whatever script they've got.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by burntrelish1273 on Sunday May 14, 2017 @12:38AM (#14334250)
Hard to say. It could be an organized crime gang, terrorists, state actor, someone not making enough money legitimately in a 3rd-world country, bored middle-aged techie or teenager wanting to "get away" with something. There may or may not be levels of management, contractor(s) or multiple participants. (Shady "businesses" most definitely have subcontractors. Heck, I know of someone whom got their degrees paid for by a shady illegal gambling outfit.)
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Buge on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:17PM (#14333078)
Why wouldn't they do it initially? It would take like 5 minutes to make it use a random string instead of a hardcoded one.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dis-sys on Saturday May 13, 2017 @12:31PM (#14331739)
will he/she be called into a HR meeting to make a Performance Improvement Plan? ;)
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by walshemj on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:25PM (#14332548)
Probaly get a pair of concrete over shoes
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by jessaustin on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:31PM (#14333663)
Potato, potahto.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by haburka on Saturday May 13, 2017 @12:17PM (#14331663)
I'm that developer but instead of working on malware, I just want to make sure that iPhones can actually use the website.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lithos on Sunday May 14, 2017 @02:55PM (#14336984)
Malware is more interesting.

The site itself doesn't seem to have enough ads or well placed enough ads to be "income as a goal". So I'm guessing it's a " proof I can do stuff " or "trophy room" blog, which doesn't care (HR and recruiting will happily use worse websites to judge canidate value, or trophy rooms will be put in a room no one else wants/cabin so far from everyone it doesn't have electricity)

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by nonbel on Saturday May 13, 2017 @04:45PM (#14332914)
I'm kind of confused as to what the role of agencies like NSA, GHCQ, etc are in situations like this. Are they supposed to put an end to the attack? If so, how is it that a single researcher beat them to it (presumably with a budget many orders of magnitude less)?

Or maybe this story isn't really accurate and there was no accident...

EDIT:

And if it isn't the role of those agencies to defend the public health IT infrastructure, which agencies are responsible, if any?

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by JshWright on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:02PM (#14333001)
The NSA knew about this vulnerability and decided to use it offensively, rather than notifying Microsoft about it.

Then, due to lax controls, the exploit got leaked and used by the ransomware developers.

Their culpability goes back a lot further than not noticing a kill switch.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by nonbel on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:09PM (#14333041)
If previously aware, shouldn't they have been even more prepared to stop the attack then?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by JshWright on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:44PM (#14333187)
The attackers used the NSA's exploit as a means to distribute their payload. It was the payload that was inadvertently disabled.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by nonbel on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:37PM (#14333362)
I honestly don't know the details, I am just wondering what government agencies have the responsibility of defending against attacks like this.

Even in this case though, you would think the NSA, etc have to do less analysis of the payload since they got to inspect and play with it for much longer than anyone else. Therefore they could waste less time on that and more quickly focus on the rest of the issue.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Bartweiss on Monday May 15, 2017 @10:19AM (#14341744)
Historically, I think the answer is just that the NSA doesn't even try.

There are some three-letter agencies that do work on fighting malware, often by partnering with relevant companies like Microsoft (who was a major anti-malware player here too). I know the FBI does so publicly, and some government groups invite large companies to low-secrecy briefings on security.

But I've never heard a mention of the NSA 'fighting' malware that isn't obviously governmental. Even if they knew about the exploit, used the exploit instead of disclosing it, and are well-placed to fight it, I think that's just filed under 'not my department'.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Bartweiss on Monday May 15, 2017 @10:16AM (#14341716)
NOBUS is basically a doctrine of assuming that no one else will find and use these exploits, so they can be maintained as strict-offense.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lithos on Sunday May 14, 2017 @03:04PM (#14337026)
Do you want 3 letter agencies having more ways to get access to private networks?

Right now looking at how the election scandals went they are there at prosecution and have access that they are given willingly.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by nonbel on Sunday May 14, 2017 @09:39PM (#14338543)
Sorry, I am unclear on how this is related. Are you saying it is not their responsibility to stop attacks in progress?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by erk__ on Saturday May 13, 2017 @08:00PM (#14333586)
The danish center for cyber security issued a threat assessment, but there was not too many git in denmark because friday was a public holiday.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dagenleg on Saturday May 13, 2017 @09:51AM (#14330958)
Lessons learned in school: overestimate and underestimate are both just one word, no spaces needed.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by smb06 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @01:21PM (#14331979)
I don't get why you are being downvoted (also one word). I thought your comment was quite funny
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dagenleg on Saturday May 13, 2017 @02:51PM (#14332373)
I guess some people interpreted the joke as confrontational and admittedly it does not contribute to the conversation. Nonetheless, I just could not resist.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by flycaliguy on Saturday May 13, 2017 @04:57PM (#14332979)
Thing with HN is you get a lot of english second language posters... who actually didn't learn those words in school.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dagenleg on Saturday May 13, 2017 @07:54PM (#14333568)
Huh, I would suspect that in modern times English is widely taught at schools all over the world, unless I am horribly mistaken. The quality of teaching is quite another issue and it's usually lacking - to which I can testify from my own experiences with post-Soviet secondary education system. Regardless, I am not starting a grammar crusade here, more like making a small remark.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lumberjack on Saturday May 13, 2017 @11:45AM (#14331509)
I don't think the malware developers wanted this kind of heat directed towards them.

If anything they will learn to automatically disable any nodes that are clearly operating out of a public office building.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ufmace on Saturday May 13, 2017 @12:06PM (#14331613)
I wonder if something like that might be the case - that this malware escaped early or spread much farther and faster than the authors intended. That would explain the sloppy attempt at an analysis countermeasure that made it trivially easy to shut down the whole thing.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Bartweiss on Monday May 15, 2017 @10:21AM (#14341756)
There is a pretty long history of worms proving way more aggressive (either in damage or spread) than intended. I wouldn't be shocked if a slow-and-profitable infection went wrong and set off a crisis response.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Pxtl on Saturday May 13, 2017 @11:15AM (#14331376)
Ms should release one last security patch for XP, even pirate copies: a firewall that kills every protocol except HTTP/HTTPS and email. Close all the ports.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lexicality on Saturday May 13, 2017 @12:52PM (#14331825)
I'm pretty sure remotely disabling computers is covered under the computer misuse act in the UK and every similar law in all countries that have them.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Godel_unicode on Saturday May 13, 2017 @02:54PM (#14332393)
No DNS huh? NTP? Outgoing ssh? Http{s} to​ high number ports? Outgoing RDP?

...see the problem?

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Piskvorrr on Thursday May 18, 2017 @08:36AM (#14366670)
Oh, you mean like GWX was for Win7+? "Hello, we tried to upgrade your computer to WinX, your computer is now an expensive brick." Yeah, that's a great idea.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Natanael_L on Saturday May 13, 2017 @01:11PM (#14331926)
Tunneling still works
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by supergreg on Saturday May 13, 2017 @01:19PM (#14331961)
Pirates don't install security patches.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by fredley on Saturday May 13, 2017 @01:49PM (#14332091)
Neither does the NHS
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by stuartd on Saturday May 13, 2017 @04:40PM (#14332889)
There was no patch for XP until today, so how could they?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by TheCoelacanth on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:26PM (#14333109)
XP has been out of support for over three years. Continuing to use it is gross negligence. It was only a matter of time until something like this happened.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by murkle on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:39PM (#14333164)
2 years for NHS, but your point stands :) http://www.v3.co.uk/v3-uk/news/2406304/windows-xp-government...
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by ageofwant on Sunday May 14, 2017 @04:54AM (#14334849)
Yes. Gross negligence from gov for under funding a core government service.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by xorxornop on Tuesday May 16, 2017 @04:13AM (#14348117)
Quite intentionally, too. One of their parties is looking jealously at the cashflow that a US-style system might provide them. At the cost of everyone else, sure, but what's that to the allure of profit?
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by twelvedogs on Sunday May 14, 2017 @06:04AM (#14334959)
that's not really true, windows update has been working fine for pirated copies of windows for ages since creating spam-bots hurts everyone and doesn't really sell more real copies of windows
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by frik on Saturday May 13, 2017 @09:10AM (#14330773)
> Re your Statscounter link http://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/windows/de...

Win 7 is rising again for months

Win10 and WinXP are shrinking

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by dis-sys on Saturday May 13, 2017 @09:21AM (#14330814)
It is normal to see such data move +/-1% in a few months time. It is far more shocking to see 18% windows users in China are still running their XP. Must be very easy for NSA to do their job.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by toyg on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:32PM (#14332580)
The elephant in the room is that XP was the last version of Windows that was relatively trivial to pirate. Activation procedures got stricter from 2008 onwards.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by rangibaby on Saturday May 13, 2017 @07:36PM (#14333521)
What makes you think that? Win 7 is simple to activate using Daz loader etc. my theory is that Win XP is the last version of Windows that will run comfortably on true toaster <1GB RAM computers.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by collinmanderson on Sunday May 14, 2017 @02:06PM (#14336715)
See, I would have said that with Windows 2000. It came out only two years earlier and was pretty similar. I definitely am still holding on to my install cds.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by tomc1985 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @02:07PM (#14332174)
Then you really don't want to see South America... a few years ago every PC I saw at a business ran XP.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by lovich on Saturday May 13, 2017 @03:01PM (#14332430)
When I visited a firm we had contracted out with in India they also had machines running xp right next to machines running Windows 10 for our project
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by gwu78 on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:09PM (#14333261)
"Lessons learnt by ransomware developers..."

If you are suggesting that developers, regardless whether they develop mobile apps or ransomware, will start relying less on DNS, I respectfully disagree.

Someone else in this thread commented how reliance on DNS makes systems "fragile". With that I strongly agree.

The same old assumptions will continue to be made, such as the one that DNS, specifcally, ICANN DNS, is always going to be used.

How to break unwanted software? Do not follow the assumptions.

For example, to break a very large quantity of shellcode change the name or location of the shell to something other than "/bin/sh".[1]

Will shellcoders switch to a "robust statistical model" instead of hard coding "/bin/sh"?

Someone once said that programmers are lazy. Was he joking?

1. Yes, I know it may also break wanted third party software. When I first edited init.c, renamed and moved sh I was seeking to learn about dependencies. I expected things to break. That was the point: an experiment. I wanted to see what would break and what would not.

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by kccqzy on Saturday May 13, 2017 @06:22PM (#14333309)
If you change the name or location of the shell to something other than "/bin/sh", plenty of legitimate software would break too.

Even though the POSIX standard says:

> Applications should note that the standard PATH to the shell cannot be assumed to be either /bin/sh or /usr/bin/sh, and should be determined by interrogation of the PATH returned by `getconf PATH`, ensuring that the returned pathname is an absolute pathname and not a shell built-in.

> For example, to determine the location of the standard sh utility:

command −v sh

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by Buge on Saturday May 13, 2017 @05:18PM (#14333084)
I don't understand your Chinese government point. The post never said anything about China. And the only thing about the NSA was that it was an NSA-developed exploit. That doesn't make the NSA look friendly.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by sprafa on Sunday May 14, 2017 @07:48PM (#14338157)
If you look at cybersecpolitics, a blog written by a former NSA, he specifically says the "we hacked into a server box" story for how these tools got leaked is implausible.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by squarefoot on Wednesday May 17, 2017 @05:37AM (#14356878)
Lesson more people should learn: dump Windows.
Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by gumby on Saturday May 13, 2017 @02:12PM (#14332198)
> Lessons learnt by the Chinese central government - NSA is a partner not a threat, they build tools which can make the coming annual China-US cyber security talk smooth.

Wow, +1 Insightful!

Re:Accidentally Stopping a Global Cyber Attack by gumby on Saturday May 13, 2017 @07:01PM (#14333431)
I guess this came off (unintentionally) as sarcastic. I had always assumed the risk of the NSA leak was from non-state actors (as this case) and it hasn't occurred to me that governments will find it just as handy -- in retrospect of course they will.