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Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by andrewla on Thursday September 08, 2016 @10:50AM (#12453503)
I agree that this seems odd, and all I've ever seen as proof that "truffle oil does not contain truffles" is the bald assertion, without any other evidence.

In the US, I can imagine (barely) that this might be permissible, but in Europe, with DOC and AOC laws, it seems almost impossible that something could be called "truffle oil" as opposed to "truffle-flavoured oil". "Truffle Extract" and "Flavoured with White Truffle" seem to be pretty unambiguously claiming that truffles were involved in the preparation.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by Alex3917 on Thursday September 08, 2016 @11:02AM (#12453635)
> all I've ever seen as proof that "truffle oil does not contain truffles" is the bald assertion, without any other evidence.

It's not even possible to make commercial truffle oil with real truffles, because the flavor doesn't last longer than a day or two. You could theoretically make it in your house and then use it immediately, but there wouldn't really be any point.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by mack73 on Thursday September 08, 2016 @11:56AM (#12454188)
> It's not even possible to make commercial truffle oil with real truffles, because the flavor doesn't last longer than a day or two.

Actually, the reason it's not possible to make real truffle oil is because (drum roll plz) truffles aren't soluble in oil. Or rather, the compound that holds the truffle essance is not soluble in oil.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by RBerenguel on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:24PM (#12454457)
It's slightly, but only a little. When you buy truffles you should preserve them in oil actually (because it won't take out the flavour), it will be scented but barely so. And the truffle will last more
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by NLips on Friday September 09, 2016 @05:04AM (#12460555)
Surely it doesn't need to be a solution - it can just be a suspension? The difference between extra virgin olive oil and purer grades are that the purer grades are filtered, not (e.g.) distilled.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by mack73 on Friday September 09, 2016 @08:59AM (#12461707)
Extra means the oil contains no more than 0.8% of free oleic acid.

Virgin means the oil comes from a mechanical process, not a chemical one.

The purest grade extra virgin olive oil is the first cold pressed. It's neither filtered nor distilled. Refined olive oil however is filtered and also tasteless.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olive_oil#Commercial_grades

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by NLips on Friday September 09, 2016 @09:10AM (#12461789)
From the same page: "The refining process removes colour, odour and flavour from the olive oil, and leaves behind a very pure form of olive oil that is tasteless, colourless and odourless and extremely low in free fatty acids"

I don't mean 'pure' in a good sense, just that it is a simple mixture.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by logfromblammo on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:12PM (#12454341)
I am primed to believe the worst after learning that a container labeled as "100% Extra-Virgin Olive Oil. Product of Italy." might not bear even a single truthful statement. The barest of investigative scrutiny reveals it as filtered and deodorized Spanish third-pressing olive oil, cut with hazelnut oil, that spent a traumatic night in Italy once. Or when I learned that the "clover honey" sold in grocery stores might actually be Chinese honey, from hives supplemented with high-fructose corn syrup, with all pollen and particulates filtered out to conceal its origins, then cut again during bottling with high-fructose corn syrup.

The burden of proof is actually on the manufacturer to show that their "truffle oil" contains actual truffles. The question is whether or not I can believe their claim without proof--and I don't.

If it sells at a premium above a near-equivalent commodity good, my default assumption is that the claims are marketing bullshit aimed at credulous buyers.

But how important is the claim anyway? If it makes my food taste better at a fair price, I don't really care if it has any actual truffle in it. I don't even know what actual truffle tastes like--nor do I really care to learn, at their typical market prices.

But I think in the U.S., there would definitely be a problem if a food label stated "natural flavor" or "truffle extract" when it was actually "artificial flavor". The name on the front of the package doesn't matter much here, except for specific exceptions. But if the back read as anything other than "olive oil, artificial flavor" the manufacturer could get slapped on the wrist so hard.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by basseq on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:46PM (#12454658)
The difference between "natural" and "artificial" flavors is academic at best. Fundamentally, they're the same chemical compounds: the difference is how those compounds are obtained... and the premium you can charge for being "natural". But natural does not mean that the named ingredient was involved at all.

From an older Scientific American article:

  Natural coconut flavorings, for example, depend on a 
  chemical called massoya lactone. Massoya lactone comes 
  from the bark of the Massoya tree, which grows in 
  Malaysia. ... This pure natural chemical is identical 
  to the version made in an organic chemists laboratory, 
  yet it is much more expensive than the synthetic 
  alternative.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-is-the-differ...
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by narag on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:57PM (#12454768)
I would really like artificial flavors to be on sale for consumers. I like yogourth not because some sad chip of fruit sinking in it, but for the proteins and calcium. A drop of some flavor would save me from the sugar spoons added to the fruit flavoured ones. "Natural" yogourth comes without any added sugar.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by logfromblammo on Friday September 09, 2016 @09:43AM (#12462083)
You can find a limited variety of artificial flavors in unsweetened Kool-Aid packets. You can probably find them for $0.10-$0.25 each at your local grocery store. The downside is that some flavors taste quite dissimilar to the fruits they purport to mimic.

I use them with powdered stevia, and sometimes erythritol or xylitol, to make sugar-free gelatin desserts. Also useful for such purposes are the bottles found near the baking supplies: vanilla, almond, and mint flavors.

Another cheap natural source of low-sugar flavorings can be found in the outer layer of citrus rinds. Lemon, lime, and orange zest adds a bit of [bitter] flavor that is still vaguely fruity.

You can also get powdered malic acid and citric acid in bulk, which will let you make things more tart without making them taste like vinegar.

While it is difficult to find some flavors/fragrances in the grocery store, some essential oils are marketed for cosmetic purposes, for DIY soapmakers or perfumers, but you have to be careful to buy them as food-grade and do your own research into potential toxicity if you ever intend to flavor foods with them.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by narag on Sunday September 11, 2016 @10:05AM (#12473393)
Thank you for your thourough answer. I'm in Spain, so the options are slightly different. Sacharine + cyclamate (I think it's banned from the USA) tastes much better than anything else.

Cocoa (with no sugar added) and orange peel is my favourite choice for the natural additives.

The artificial flavors are more or less the same. But it's very limited. There's no way to find the complex, more subtle mixes used in branded yogourths, say mango, papaya, kiwi, raisins and the more realistic fruit varieties.

I believe that the lack of choices is caused by the artificial bashing propaganda. People would not buy artificial flavors yet they're consuming them anyway, just because they're conveniently fooled by a few fruit bits in the mix.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by adrianN on Thursday September 08, 2016 @06:11PM (#12457844)
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by jpindar on Friday September 09, 2016 @05:54PM (#12466321)
I buy artificial flavors all the time, for adding to yogurt or shakes. It comes in little bottles in spice section of any American grocery store. There are various fruit flavors, plus vanilla, almond, cinnamon, root beer and mint.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by germinalphrase on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:46PM (#12455269)
It is also extremely easy to make (which is what I strongly recommend you do).
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by logfromblammo on Thursday September 08, 2016 @03:34PM (#12456501)
It is easy to get most of the flavor profile of a natural flavoring using a single pure synthesized molecule. But natural flavors have a host of other "support" molecules that add to the flavor, like adding harmonics to a musical chord.

For every molecule like vanillin, which is a powerful enough component of vanilla that it can often stand in for the whole, there are dozens of molecules that produce variations in flavors when combined. Most humans can't tell the difference in a blind taste test in baked goods.

Furthermore, those support molecules can become easier or harder to taste in the presence of proteins, sugars, or non-aqueous solvents.

So if, for instance, you want to make your artificially flavored vanilla ice cream taste exactly like naturally flavored, the aromatic additive cocktail you must use in addition to the vanillin will need to have a different composition from another food-chemist's concoction for vanilla-flavored sugar cookies.

But even then, you will have to decide what kind of natural vanilla you will choose to mimic, because the country of origin of cured vanilla beans can be discerned by professional tasters and with 100% accuracy by chemical analysis!

It's only moot because it is possible for people to prefer the taste of the artificial flavoring over that of the natural flavor, not because they are indistinguishable from each other.

And as I mentioned elsewhere, compounds purified from genetically engineered microbes can still be called "natural". That seems to be a clear case of pitting the letter of the law against its spirit.

Edit: I mean natural in the vernacular sense, not in regard to whatever is allowed by food labeling laws. That sense is "natural", in scare quotes. Natural coconut flavoring can only come from actual coconuts. "Natural" flavoring can come from the bark of an unrelated tree, beaver butts, engineered microbes, mushrooms, or anything else that could grow in the wild if it were released there. Artificial flavoring comes from a biochemist with a tank of ethylene and a CRC manual.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by stouset on Thursday September 08, 2016 @03:58PM (#12456726)
Unfortunately, "natural" flavoring doesn't at all mean that you're getting those additional flavor molecules, or that they even come from the plant the flavor purports to be from.

See another poster's comment here about natural coconut flavoring, which comes from the bark of a tree and not coconuts. In many, many cases, "natural" flavoring is literally the exact same compound as "artificial" flavoring, just extracted from a source in nature.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by shostack on Thursday September 08, 2016 @06:07PM (#12457802)
Any sources on the honey? Also, are you aware of any good resources for vetting various brands while shopping in store? I'd love some scanner app that would just tell me if it was fake or not.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by logfromblammo on Friday September 09, 2016 @10:21AM (#12462440)
I think the only way to know for sure is to identify the pollen grains under a microscope. If you can't find any, the origin of the honey has been concealed with filtration, and is therefore statistically likely to contain mostly Chinese honey, based solely on examination of amounts produced and amounts exported. If you can find some pollen, but there doesn't seem to be enough, honey with an identifiable origin was probably cut with filtered honey.

Honey can also be "laundered" by feeding it to another hive, then extracting from their combs.

There is no scanner app. If it's in stores, its origin is suspect. Buy honey directly from your local apiary. They will be able to tell you exactly where the hives were feeding before the honey was harvested, and the honey from some locations, or from single-flower honey, has a very different taste than the store-shelf-standard clover honey.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by shostack on Saturday September 10, 2016 @08:45PM (#12471558)
Are there any easier tests that don't involve a microscope, particularly to sort out HFCS in the honey? Like, do they have different melting points, or any other easily testable solution?
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by 13of40 on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:14PM (#12454360)
My wife picked up a cheap bottle of what claimed to be truffle oil at a chain grocery store in Herculaneum (that's in Europe) last year. On inspection, it was actually a bottle of cheap vegetable oil with a slice of some other kind of mushroom in it and a hint of trufflesque flavoring. Maybe somewhere in the fine print it said what the flavoring actually was, but the rest of the bottle, from the "TARTUFO!" label on the front to the fake truffle chunk inside, was a blatant con.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by soperj on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:26PM (#12454477)
There's also been cases of shredded Parmesan not containing and Parmesan at all, and a big part of it actually being woodpulp.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by 13of40 on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:53PM (#12454728)
Cellulose powder - says so right in the ingredients, alongside lipase, calcium chloride, and potassium sorbate: http://www.garycameron.org/files/2012/04/Kraft-100-Parm-q50....

Even better, it says "The label doesn't just say parmesan, it says 100% parmesan. That's because we only use the finest ingredients, carefully crafted and aged for a sharp, distinctive taste that enhances your favourite dishes - a taste that's 100% real, 100% parmesan."

They can get away with it because "parmesan" doesn't actually mean anything outside of the EU.

Edit: As that other poster just pointed out, maybe it does mean something in the US (that label was from Canada), since someone's actually facing criminal charges for it.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by tunap on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:57PM (#12455402)
Totinis frozen pizzas changed their description in last year or so. The new description says "pepperoni flavored pizza topping" now. Who defines what "pizza topping" is, however, IDK.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by Udik on Thursday September 08, 2016 @02:47PM (#12455997)
Flavored? It makes you wonder what those slices are actually made of. Ah, now I googled and saw the box. It says "made with pork, chicken, beef". In no particular order and in variable proportions, I guess.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by oxide on Thursday September 08, 2016 @03:38PM (#12456544)
"mystery meat" doesn't have the same ring to it as "pepperoni flavored pizza topping"
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by stouset on Thursday September 08, 2016 @03:52PM (#12456677)
The word "parmesan" pretty much literally doesn't mean anything in the US. If you want actual "parmesan", you must go with "parmigiano reggiano", which is a protected designation.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by seanp2k2 on Thursday September 08, 2016 @09:00PM (#12458930)
Protected designation where? IIRC that's not a thing in the US.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by nommm-nommm on Thursday September 08, 2016 @12:49PM (#12454690)
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-02-16/the-parmes...

>Slippery Rock, Pennsylvania-based Castle produced mainly imitation cheeses for nearly 30 years. The company, whose factory was adorned with crenelated battlements and curved archways to look like a medieval castle, had $19 million in sales in 2013.

>According to the FDA’s report on Castle, obtained through the Freedom of Information Act, “no parmesan cheese was used to manufacture” the Market Pantry brand 100% grated Parmesan Cheese, sold at Target Corp. stores, and Always Save Grated Parmesan Cheese and Best Choice 100% Grated Parmesan Cheese, sold by Associated Wholesale Grocers Inc., which along with its subsidiaries supplies 3,400 retail stores in 30 states. Instead, there was a mixture of Swiss, mozzarella, white cheddar and cellulose, according to the FDA.

>Castle President Michelle Myrter is scheduled to plead guilty this month to criminal charges. She faces up to a year in prison and a $100,000 fine.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by _puk on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:43PM (#12455238)
30 years of $x million annual sales of essentially counterfeit product results in "up to" a year long sentence and $100,000 fine. Madness.

Though I find it ironic that they responded honestly to the FOI request.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by nommm-nommm on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:51PM (#12455325)
You are surprised the FDA responded honestly to a Freedom of Information Act request?

The FOIA request was a request to the FDA from Bloomberg for the FDA's investigation on Castle. It was used by Bloomberg to write the article. The Freedom of Information Act is only to request information from a government agency. To uncover the fraud the FDA physically visited Castle. They were tipped off by a disgruntled former employee. Without the tip off there is a extremely small chance they would have ever been caught.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by _puk on Friday September 09, 2016 @06:12AM (#12460797)
Actually missed this point about the FDA visiting on the tip-off, hence my surprise.

The FDA can only respond with the information they have, so as it took the FDA actually visiting Castle (on a tip-off no less), they must have been lied to as well.

Surely, a FOI request can't realistically trigger someone jumping in a car to verify data held on file.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by dragonwriter on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:02PM (#12454815)
> There's also been cases of shredded Parmesan not containing and Parmesan at all

To a reasonable approximation, the only shredded Parmesan you can buy that is likely to contain anything like Parmesan is the stuff that's shredded on-site by places that also sell wheels/chunks of Parmesan.

OTOH, there's rarely a good reason to buy shredded parmesan even if its real; for most uses you want shredded parmesan, the size/shape of shreds you get from such a product aren't great, and its better (and, in any case, cheaper in the long run) to just get blocks of parmesan and a grater, and in typical use quantities you aren't saving much time or effort by getting pre-grated.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by soperj on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:42PM (#12455234)
I agree and don't buy shredded parmesan. Just insane that that is allowed to exist at all.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by dawnerd on Thursday September 08, 2016 @02:52PM (#12456067)
Right? You can grate some just as fast as it takes to open the tub. Price wise it's just about cheaper to buy a wedge anyways. I'll give people a pass for store shredded, but god when I see people using Kraft parmesan "dust"...
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by brassic on Thursday September 08, 2016 @02:17PM (#12455630)
Pretty much all packaged grated cheese has added cellulose to stop the flakes sticking back together.

If you want 100% Parmesan (or even 100% cheese!) you need to buy a block.

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by nommm-nommm on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:09PM (#12454898)
Who cares if it's permissible? Food fraud is surprisingly common and the chances of getting caught are close to zero. If you buy fish there's a 33% chance you get a different fish than what you bought.

http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/02/21/172589997/one...

Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by andrewla on Thursday September 08, 2016 @01:33PM (#12455146)
I saw this article and was slightly dubious as well. Some follow-up research indicates that the testing methodologies used had known error rates approaching the discrepencies detected during the analysis. That was enough to make me somewhat skeptical of the analysis, without doing the due diligence to dig any deeper into it. I would be much more comfortable if someone had a sting operation or videotaped an instance of actually substituting the fish as claimed, which should be incredibly easy considering how common they allege the substitutions are.
Re:There Are No Truffles in Truffle Oil (2014) by 4ad on Thursday September 08, 2016 @05:51PM (#12457672)
I can't speak for all Europe, but here in Austria truffle oil has small pieces of truffle in it.

Of course, those do nothing, as the chemicals found in truffles are, to a first approximation not soluble in oil. It's just the same chemical crap with some placebo truffle in it.

Friends don't let friends buy truffle oil.