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Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @07:18AM (#12007767)
I work for a 'big online old media company' and can offer some insight for all of this. First up, I strongly believe our industry has dug ourselves into the hole and really fucked itself over. Daily I use an adblocker to make the internet faster and easier to use (which is ironic because I'm the one who implemented the 'plz disable adblocker' banner on our site and i see it every single day http://i.imgur.com/xQza4fS.png)

Problems with self hosting:

- It's super duper hard to change the status quo. For them, the current solution 'works fine', once they fight the supposed evil that ad blockers are. Trust me, I fight for this sort of stuff and they just don't understand things the way we do.

- You can't do as much or sell ads for as much. You can charge more if you know more data about your visitors and can sell the ads to clients under the impression that it'll reach the exact demographic they're looking for.

- For some companies, it's already too much of a chore to have an in-house dev team to manage the content website. Have to have _people_ manage all these self hosted ads is not appealing to these companies. Very similar to AWS vs self-hosting

- An image is less interactive, so you can't sell it for as much. Those big fancy ads that are interactive are sold more many many more times the price as just a single jpg more.

- If you're 'lucky' to work in a media org big enough to have a sales team, even they don't sell out every single ad placement all the time - there's a big tailed on these states they still want to monetise and ad networks helps them do that.

That aside, things are changing. Everything on our site happens over HTTPS, which is a plus. We do win 'arguments' to move things in-house and not served from an ads network, where appropriate. We have an in-house 'studio team' who creates custom campaigns and creatives for clients, and they're almost entirely self hosted.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by zapt02 on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:39AM (#12008068)
This response is right on the money.

I'd just like to add that almost all the problems with malicious ads are caused by ad networks that are used as "backfills" for when the in-house ads aren't booked. Backfilled ads are not inspected and can contain everything, but they are also needed because otherwise you'll have unsold inventory.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by tluyben2 on Thursday June 30, 2016 @09:48AM (#12008458)
I am wondering how much $ those backfilled ads make though? In my (limited) experience they are really not worth the hassle even on high traffic sites. We resorted to just showing special deals of our own product in unsold inventory spots.
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by CyberDildonics on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:46AM (#12008105)
One thing that is starting to become more common knowledge is that ad space is a commodity. Typically commodities are auctioned or sold on exchanges. I would think it should be entirely possible to not have any backfill by having the prices for ad impressions fluctuate on an exchange (I realize ad exchanges already exist, it seems they just need to make it into these situations).
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:51AM (#12008129)
Exchanges are these backfills.

When we don't have a big sponsor for a section of our site, or haven't had enough direct sales for certain placements, it goes out to the ad exchange to action the spot off. That's where the problem is. That's somewhere we could start enforcing certain quality.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by zapt02 on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:58AM (#12008170)
Exactly! Larger ad inventory purchases are still largely sold by salespeople with written contracts.

Ad exchanges and real-time bidding (RTB) are only causing a problem for people working in the media space because on the one hand if you don't have them you lose money, but on the other hand it's like gambling in regards to the quality of ads that will be served.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by a3n on Thursday June 30, 2016 @09:18AM (#12008268)
Are there salespeople in this area anymore, or is it all automatic? Shouldn't the salespeople be working harder to sell unsold inventory?
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @09:25AM (#12008304)
Of course there are salespeople. When the country's leading air freshener brand wants to buy out all premium ad placements for a section of a website as a part of an integrated tv/online/outdoors campaign, they're going to want a salesperson to work things out with.
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by a3n on Thursday June 30, 2016 @09:31AM (#12008347)
And yet an excuse is auctioning unsold inventory to unsavory networks.

If I was buying a box of cereal, "we couldn't source enough reputable corn, so we topped it with melamine" would be the death of that cereal, for me.

(And yes, this is buyers at the cereal company instead of ad sellers, but it's the same: the hypothetical cereal company was not able to "sell" enough of its money to corn suppliers.)

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @06:21PM (#12012299)
But yet as a developer "i don't write good enough code, so we have a massive test harness to catch any bugs I might introduce".

Of course the goal is to operate at 100% efficiency, but in reality that's not going to happen all the time. Backfill channels like this are a way to make at least a little bit of money when sales a slow for a bit for whatever reason.

In terms of the problems the online media industry faces with advertising, the efficiency of in-house sales teams is not a huge priority atm.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by a3n on Thursday June 30, 2016 @06:47PM (#12012443)
And so I block. :)
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by WayneBro on Thursday June 30, 2016 @10:38AM (#12008838)
The change is starting at places like 'The Deck', where they only sell ads that don't track anyone - no Javascript or Iframes.

http://decknetwork.net/privacy/

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by soared on Thursday June 30, 2016 @11:43AM (#12009318)
To use The Deck a business would have to knowingly generate less revenue in exchange for user privacy. I don't see many companies doing this.
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by imglorp on Thursday June 30, 2016 @07:59AM (#12007891)
Would it help to have an off the shelf, self-hosted ad platform available? Perhaps a plugin to an existing CMS?
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:38AM (#12008064)
That might help, but it depends what problem you're trying to solve then - if everyone was using the same platform, then it would be easy for adblockers to block it.

If part of your pitch is that you avoid adblockers, then once you get big enough you'll constantly be fighting an uphill battle.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by imglorp on Thursday June 30, 2016 @09:13AM (#12008243)
I was just thinking of ye olde self-service in-house ad vendor, server, statter. If the static ad assets were coming from the same domain, how would an adblocker notice them?
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @09:29AM (#12008328)
well instead of blocking googleads.com/, they would just block nytimes.com/googleads/

Obviously in execution it would be different, but I hope you get the idea.

Edit: I think self-served ad platforms are one way forward, but it depends on what problem you're trying to solve.

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by WayneBro on Thursday June 30, 2016 @10:41AM (#12008858)
If I were designing this system, the paths would look something like nytimes.com/e2be6560/d570/xxx-yyy-zzz(.jpeg/.js/.html/etc).
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by CyberDildonics on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:39AM (#12008069)
You know... with uMatrix you can block the 'please dont adblock' element specifically so you don't have to see it anymore.
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by ryuuchin on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:51AM (#12008134)
Do you mean uBlock (Origin)[1]? That's the one with the element picker[2] if that's what you're referring to. uMatrix[3] does not have cosmetic filtering which may be required to hide an element like the one in question. You'd need uBlock for that.

[1] https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock

[2] https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/wiki/Element-picker

[3] https://github.com/gorhill/uMatrix

Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by madeofpalk on Thursday June 30, 2016 @08:52AM (#12008135)
But you see, then when I present our site in front of all the big important people, I can't showoff my use of adblocker then.
Re:What media companies don’t want you to know about ad bloc... by type0 on Friday July 01, 2016 @07:00AM (#12015073)
Just open it in some other browser without the adblock, problem solved.