You shouldn't have to be tender and gentle with the power cable for your device... it should be durable and stand up to abuse. After all, it's for a laptop which may experience hard yanks as people walk away with it plugged in, the cable being stepped on or crushed by a chair, being thrown into a bag not coiled (or sometimes coiled too tightly), dropped from waist-height (or higher), thrown to a friend, etc.
It's not unreasonable to expect these things to be very durable. Functionality and durability should take precedence over design aesthetics here.
(as an aside, the white color always ended up looking filthy in short while, and was nearly impossible to restore to bright white)
PC chargers, for instance, are universally worse. A lot worse.
This design already does the best job in the industry at handling hard yanks——that's what MagSafe is for. And it does fine with ordinary, expected use and abuse of the cable. And it does great with being thrown into a bag or dropped.
What it doesn't do, because that's impossible, is to magically become able to be yanked on 500 times and coiled as tightly as possible around itself, without ever wearing out. But I've offered a solution to that.
Your implied accusation that "design aesthetics" have taken precedence over functionality and durability is unfounded. The fact is that Apple's charger works a lot better and is a lot more durable than the competition.
This is an unsubstantiated claim not backed by any evidence. In fact, your original post speaks against your very claim - you advocate people be ginger with their chargers or risk breaking them.
> This design already does the best job in the industry at handling hard yanks——that's what MagSafe is for
You mean to say "that's what MagSafe was for". Magsafe is gone now... (although I would generally agree that type of connector is good).
> it does fine with ordinary, expected use and abuse of the cable
Clearly not the case, as evidenced by this thread here.
> And it does great with being thrown into a bag or dropped.
I can't speak to either way except with anecdotal evidence of having to replace far more macbook chargers than any other type.
> What it doesn't do, because that's impossible, is to magically become able to be yanked on 500 times and coiled as tightly as possible around itself, without ever wearing out
Somehow my Thinkpad's charger hasn't worn out, and I'm guilty of every laptop charger sin there is. The same holds true for my previous Dell laptop. These types of chargers are usually made from hard plastic, with a plastic cable. They don't fray the same way macbook rubber-y chargers do. In fact, Dell's chargers are designed specifically to be tightly wound around the charger and come with a nice rubber strap to hold it tight.
> Your implied accusation that "design aesthetics" have taken precedence over functionality and durability is unfounded
Perhaps, but it does seem so given all the anecdotal evidence in this thread. It looks pretty, but wore out far quicker than most should.
> The fact is that Apple's charger works a lot better and is a lot more durable than the competition.
This is another unsubstantiated claim, and/or is supported only by your proposition people treat their chargers with tenderness (which isn't going to happen).
Plain and simple - these things need to be designed to take a lot of abuse. If Apple can do that, great... but it seems they took a giant leap backwards with the new USB-C charger which will cause the infamous "broken DC jack" problem all over again.
It's not gone, it's present in all most selling Mac laptops, my latest rMBP has it, I think they only removed it from new MacBook because it's too lightweight and the magnet need to be super weak in order to get itself ejected once it's pulled without pulling the laptop itself, and usb type c was probably used to eliminate excessive separate chargin port to make this particular laptop lighter and smaller which is its main purpose.
As others have already pointed out, no, MagSafe is not gone.
Dell's chargers, as do many other PC chargers over the last 10 years, routinely break the charging port on the computer if they get yanked on too much, which is of course far more expensive to replace than a new charger.
You're bitching a lot about my evidence being anecdotal because it's only based on hundreds of chargers, and you're right, but your evidence appears to be based on, um, a single Dell charger that you think is awesome. That seems pretty weak.
Lastly, I do agree with you about the new USB-C charger for the MacBook. I think it's stupid and a step backwards and I wish they had retained MagSafe on that model.
I'm curious to how much hardware support goes into this, since most Apple machines are designed to not be support friendly (eg. non-replaceable and/or difficult to replace normal wear-n-tear components).
> routinely break the charging port on the computer if they get yanked on too much
Yes, most laptops have this issue, although it's not nearly as common with modern laptops as it used to be. However, I contest that's a design fault in the laptop, not the charger.
> which is of course far more expensive to replace than a new charger
Not always true.[1][2] DC jacks can often be bought for less than $5 online, and then it's just labor to solder it into place. A search online turns out quite a few services for $75 inclusive of the DC jack cost (your local repair shop probably does it even cheaper now, since no shipping involved, etc). Apple's cheapest adapter with magsafe cable on it is $79. A Thinkpad charger will only run you $59.99.[3]
> You're bitching a lot about my evidence being anecdotal because it's only based on hundreds of chargers, and you're right, but your evidence appears to be based on, um, a single Dell charger that you think is awesome. That seems pretty weak.
It's difficult to comment on this without resorting to some sort of "fanboy" argument.
> I think it's stupid and a step backwards and I wish they had retained MagSafe on that model.
I think we both agree on this. Worse off, if that single port breaks, you now cannot charge your laptop, nor use any peripherals (and a peripheral is more likely to break that USB port than the charger in my experience - such as a USB thumb drive hanging out and someone smacks it on accident). Even worse off, that port isn't easily repairable, so it's back to apple (who will replace the entire motherboard as their "fix", or if it's out of warranty, it's time to buy a new laptop).
[1] http://www.apple.com/shop/product/MC461LL/A/apple-60w-magsaf...
[2] http://repairmydcjack.com/
[3] http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/controller/e/web/LenovoPo...
https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Retina+Macbook+2015+Teardown...
That's an oranges-to-apples comparison. :)
It's not fair to compare 3rd party repair services to a new Apple product. There are also 3rd party repair services for Apple chargers. For example, I know these guys will repair them: http://madmacsoforegon.com/Mad_Macs_of_Oregon/Welcome.html
>
> It's not fair to compare 3rd party repair services to a new Apple product.
You have to remember that Alupis was replying to the following comment (which he quoted in his comment):
> [the charging port on a computer is] of course far more expensive to replace than a new charger...
Context is everything, friend. :)
Absolutely not.
I use a MacBook Pro, with the MagSafe feature hard, right along with a Lenovo higher end laptop. They both travel, they both get the same treatment.
I have gone through several Apple chargers. I have had exactly ONE Lenovo charger. The same was true for my older T60P and it's charger. In fact, that one is still like new, despite 10 years of use.
I like the MagSafe, and it has prevented a few strong yanks, or trips over the cord from damaging the Mac, but it's also prone to failure in the wire near the MagSafe connector, just as it's prone to failure in the wire near the charger assembly.
Interestingly, the Lenovo chargers ship with a nice Velcro wire retainer that is intended to be used right after WRAPPING THE WIRE FIRMLY around the charger. And the Lenovo devices have both easily gone a couple thousand use cycles, the older one maybe a couple more.
There really isn't a single metric, other than size, that favors the Apple charger in my use case.
So might Apple PSUs for all I know, my ancient white iBook G4 psu is still serviceable although the iBook is in its box because the hard drive sounds like a food mixer and I can't be bothered to go through the procedure needed to remove or replace the drive...
https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/iBook+G4+12-Inch+800+MHz-1.2+GH...
It's rather unfortunate that most Apple computers (with non-soldered hdd's) still require this level of complexity to change out a routine maintenance component that's expected to fail. (or with some models, the hard drive cannot be replaced at all).
That's not the same as implementing good strain relief. I used to work for a company that made medical devices. One of our products started with a cable with strain relief, and it kept breaking (a wearable monitor). We 'implemented better strain relief', and it kept breaking. It was revision D where we got it right and the cables stopped breaking. And if cables can't survive a 90-degree bend, then stop them from being able to be bent that far in the first place (we had to).
And to be fair, other companies don't have this problem, because they engineer their chargers for how people will use them - basically what you're describing is another form of "you're holding it wrong".
Anecdotally, neither the 7-or-8-year-old charger for my Toughbook nor the four-ish-year-old charger for the treats-all-her-cabling-like-it's-meant-to-be-load-bearing roommate's Toshiba Satellite have failed.
Apple definitely seems to be an outlier in this arena and is well known for their not-infrequent decision to sacrifice function, user comfort, and/or safety for aesthetic appeal.
I'd need some persuading that the rubbery sleeving was chosen for purely engineering reasons, and not mostly "it feels nice".
Apple has not implemented proper strain relief, with a perforated sleeve (presumably for aesthetic reasons), and they still use a thin, over-flexible wire. Their own website shows the cable wrapped tightly--on a page about avoiding cable damage, no less. (https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201600)
Blaming the user for, essentially, not being an engineer is common in the tech industry, and it really doesn't help anything, especially from a company that claims to be (and generally is!) as user-friendly as Apple.
- Former apple support guy
Apple favors form over function and tries to make their cables in interfaces as small as possible. The result is that there's no room left in their designs for adequate strain relief. They end up using the smallest cables they can get away with and have a bushing around the cable as it enters it's housing to protect against lateral force and that's about it. There's rarely any internal strain relief mechanism.
There may be a UL thing going on at the 120/240V side of the charger but it still seems ridiculously overengineered.
[1] http://www.newegg.com/AC-Power-Cords-for-Laptop/SubCategory/...
These power supplies aren't as obviously defective by design as an iPhone cable, but after looking at the amount of design detail and engineering directed at the power supply and MagSafe, the sacrifices made seem pretty insane.
People aren't "FAR too rough and careless." People behave as people behave.
A high end manufacturer like Apple should be design and manufacture their devices to stand up to the rigors that people typically put them through.
Why doesn't Apple? Because their user base (or at least the majority of their user base who winds chargers too tightly, which I apparently fall into) would rather buy a new charger every year or so than switch computers.
It's quite profitable for them.
[Edit -- fixed typo]
Why should I have to buy 2 chargers (at $99 a pop, no less) when one charger for pretty much every other laptop company out there will work for years with "rough and careless" users, and only cost $20 to replace?
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B008WWC6FU
It works wonders. I'm not sure this would work for Mac chargers because you couldn't get the sleeve over the ends, but it also works iPhone charger cables.
But Apple's design just suggests you do exactly that :/
But if the MagSafe connector cannot be made more robust (durable), then it should be replaceable.
If you can, count how many strands are inside that wire. If it's fewer than 90 strands you know why this wire fails.
I bet it's probably only 19 which is the minimum for a moving wire not to break.
> That's just not a thing we can do.
Yes it is. Assembly robots that move all day can have even 5,000 strands in the wires in a careful helical winding pattern that prevents the strands from being under tension - those will not break even after constant movement and folding.
I actually find the Apple charger a bit annoying, it doesn't fit flat in any of the smaller / side pockets of my briefcases or messenger bags, and overall the Dell charger isn't "ugly" if you would gave it the apple "storm trooper white" finish and an apple logo it would not look out of place in Apple's catalog.
The other thing I kinda hate about Apple is the fact that it won't take a standard mickey mouse cable, if you forget the cable / socket plug you are pretty much screwed if you are at a non-startup company :<
It's always possible that I just have bad luck. That doesn't mean I dislike your advice though.
I go through about one of these chargers a year. I leave one at my desk at home, so I don't have to move it, and I take the other one with me on the road. The one I travel with gets plugged and unplugged probably 5 times a day... and it never lasts more than 6-8 months. Shitty design.
It's almost as if they make a profit off of selling licensed cables with their proprietary technology or something.
I'll stop you right there, No.
Men should not serve machines. Machines should serve men.
If the machine cannot take the abuse that people typically subject it to, then the design of the machine needs to be revised. Trying to modify human behaviour to suit the unnecessary mechanical limitations of machines is insane.
Good tips ! I do exactly this and have a charger that has lasted 5 years. Cable looks good still (touch wood !)
I have a charger in a cable tray under my desk. Above my desk, one of these guys: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004GUS4XK
I've still had two Macbook cables fray, the sheath opening up like a paper lantern. There is near zero strain on this cable at any point.
That's the original charger for my 2006 black MacBook. It was in daily use by me for work until I got my mid 2010 MacBook Pro, and was then used as a "home machine" by someone else up until early this year.
The charger from the 2010 Macbook Pro is still working fine (but I'll point out I left that charger at work almost all the time, and "borrowed" the 2006 one when I needed to top up at home).
I suspect a difference is that I never "wrap the cable round the hooks", I just loop the cable up loosely and drop it all in my bag. I do the same with my iPod/iPhone cabes, and I've only ever had one of those fray (and I suspect that was one that got borrowed a lot). I wonder if this is a "you're holding it wrong" design oversight, where they've had lots of people using and testing them, but all in very similar ways which are not the only way they're used outside Apple?
So maybe if you stop taking "good care" of your charger, and stop wrapping it in a tight loop, it will actually last longer.
That said, a lot of people seem think you're supposed to wrap the cables. After all, the MBP charger has built-in hooks for exactly that purpose. The charger is badly designed if wrapping the cable around the provided hooks causes it fray very quickly.
I really think it's the internals that are too fragile.
Instead, grab both ends, hold them together, untangle and pull the two sides together .. find the new ends, combine them, fold, over and over .. until you get a nice tidy package.
This treats the cable much nicer - its built for expanding in the combined loops, but when you wind .. and wind .. and wind .. you twist the fibers. Fold, don't twist!
Take my phone for example - I tend to have a charger in every room of the house, several for my backpack and one at my desk.
I wonder if they'll allow non-Apple USB-C chargers. I think they'd have to.
Unfortunately there's still often a 90 degree turn where it connects to my MBP. I've found no reliable way to prevent that.
Instead of yanking the cable at a 90-degree angle and winding as tightly as possible, let the cable come out of the charger naturally, perpendicular to the charger, make a small loop, and then wind the rest of the cable gently around the two plastic hooks that are provided. If you do this, the charger will last a LOT longer.
The simple fact is that there is no way to make a wire that gets twisted and yanked and bent at a 90-degree angle, and which will nevertheless last forever. That's just not a thing we can do.
Another tip is: own 2 of these chargers, one for home and one for walking around, so that you don't have to wrap up your only charger over and over, every day.