News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by dm2 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @07:35AM (#7982462)
I was talking on the phone to someone in another country (a US friendly country) and the other person mentioned Tor. The second he got to the end of the word the phone call cut out. I haven't had a phone call cut out in years except that one time.

It was most likely a complete coincidence but it would be very interesting if anyone else has ever had a similar experience.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by e455b328 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @08:35AM (#7982646)
It was not a coincidence. I created an account just to respond because I've been waiting years to have my experience... "validated".

The same exact thing has happened during phone conversations I've had except with a different word. And I first noticed it years ago but it was post-9/11. When it happened I thought the phone call dropped by accident. I called back and picked up where I left off telling the same story. At the same word the call dropped again. I called back again and said "uhh, that was weird. Did you notice it cut off again when I said _______?" And the call dropped once more. At that point there was no plausible way it was a coincidence. The next time I called, I decided not to test it again.

I've been looking out ever since for some mention of this somewhere. Never saw one until now.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by dm2 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:06AM (#7982778)
It would be very interesting to be able to reproduce that happening and be able to test what it does and does not "detect".

I would imagine that foreign terrorists would speak in their native language. Any sophisticated terrorist would use code-words (Get on the train and trigger the Goat). Does the system pick up if you spell out a word?

It's certainly possible but there's not much reason why the phone calls would consistently drop unless that was their method of preventing terrorist activity.

It's known that all calls around the president are monitored for X miles, so the technology is certainly in place and in use.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by e455b328 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:09AM (#7982805)
Oh and also both I and the other end of the call were US.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by grkvlt on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:11AM (#7982816)
It was absolutely a coincidence. What on earth would the rationale be for an intelligence agency to cut off a call as soon as they heard a term of interest? I think your tinfoil hat is leaking.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by coldtea on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:58AM (#7983070)
He might be dellusional, but you didn't even think for 2 minutes before answering.

For example, what he describes could be a bug on the "engage phone tracking when keyword is heard".

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by dm2 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @11:25AM (#7983629)
Your scenario is very possible and was my initial thought as well. The call dropping could be carrier/phone/region specific due to invalid or error causing commands breaking something when the call logging or recording is activated. (tower connection, phone software, phone radio firmware, or anything else along the connection)

It's probably been fixed by now if it was a bug such as that. I'm sure bugs like this go unnoticed every day by people interacting with computer systems and just brush it off as a "glitch" or "service issue".

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by grkvlt on Thursday July 03, 2014 @01:43PM (#7984530)
It just isn't likely. There's no plausible mechanism or reason for an intelligence collection system with keyword analysis to have real-time control of the signalling pathway for the phone system.

Which incidentally works very differently to the way most people seem to imagine phone tapping works -- some agents in trenchcoats in a dark room full of reel-to-reel tape recorders, wearing headphones and carefully putting crocodile clips onto a particular wire, and listening in, hoping the suspect isn't tipped off by crackles or beeps on the wire, or suspicious dropped calls. Maybe in 1950s Hollywood that was how it worked, but now the NSA is just grabbing the content and metadata wholesale from a backbone connection, and analysing at their leisure.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by mikecb on Thursday July 03, 2014 @11:51AM (#7983778)
If a system can parse for keywords, any tracking or recording is already enabled.

It's also not how the phone system works.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by pkinsky on Thursday July 03, 2014 @11:52AM (#7983782)
I've heard similar stories from people making international calls to China.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by aatos on Thursday July 03, 2014 @08:52AM (#7982709)
What was the word?
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by BillyParadise on Thursday July 03, 2014 @08:57AM (#7982735)
Obviously, it was _______

And if this one is blanked out, too, then you know I'm the newest addition to the Watchlist.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by enraged_camel on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:57AM (#7983059)
It's not blanked out for me. Clearly the NSA is interfering with your web experience.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by e455b328 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:01AM (#7982752)
I didn't mention it cuz I figured if they're monitoring calls for it then they're damn sure monitoring posts for it and I didn't want to end up on a list. But what the hell, I'd rather learn more about what this is really all about. And that's the thing: the word wasn't even that crazy, unless you're on line at an airport (apparently) which I wasn't.

The word was "bomb".

(...Now that I think about it, I was at a train station. Not a major one though, doubt if that's related.)

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by grkvlt on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:14AM (#7982833)
People use the word 'bomb' in conversations on the phone all the time. Nobody is getting their calls disconnected for saying that, I assure you. It was a strange coincidence - a fault on the line or similar phenomenon.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by Throwaway0812 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:20AM (#7982870)
Agreed, it's an incredibly popular word, and even if calls were just being dropped in train stations, it would still be widely known. Plus, what would be the advantage of dropping the call, and allowing the person to redial? If the call is being monitored, wouldn't it make more sense to send the audio to security for review? If they're calling from a public phone, you could activate a silent alarm so they're randomly selected by security, or simply redirect security cameras to their location.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by mpyne on Thursday July 03, 2014 @10:05AM (#7983109)
Jesus Christ people, learn about the birthday paradox someday, please.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by amalcon on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:23AM (#7982891)
I find it unlikely that this is intentional. To do intentionally intentionally would require human monitoring (or more powerful context analysis than I've heard of): "Tor" is a homophone for "Tore" and "Torr", and in a few accents it's very similar to "Tour". It's also a prefix for a lot of words. At least "Tore" and "Tour" are more common in conversation than "Tor", and I'd expect things like "Torrent" to also be more common.

In the case of human monitoring, cutting the call off immediately is an odd response: usually both spooks and law enforcement would rather keep listening to get more information. An automated system might try to do that, but only one whose designers don't care if it's noticed: if my phone cuts off whenever I talk to a foreigner about a tour, I'm surely going to notice.

There could have been something fishy going on there, but it doesn't fit the usual threat models in non-dictatorial regimes.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by dm2 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:42AM (#7982976)
I agree that it was most likely a coincidence, other than server access any intelligence agency would have no reason to monitor me.

Even if you were near the president and said on the phone or over a radio "Shoot the president's head" it could be completely justified depending on context (if you were a production crew talking to a camera operator for instance). It would be nearly impossible to sort out the false positives and even if you could it wouldn't prevent much because of code-words that could be used.

Then again, we all know that bugs happen, there might have been a new system in place. It would be conceivable that the phone/tower/something received a bad command when the "recording" started and it caused the call to drop.

I say "hacked" and "stolen" on the phone all the time, but those would likely be on the list of "calls to record".

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by probably_wrong on Thursday July 03, 2014 @08:32AM (#7982635)
Whenever I finish a Skype call, I immediately get a message supposedly from the other person with a 4-digit number. I don't know what that number means yet. Also, my phone's wifi will not turn off since last week.

Those are all probably just coincidences, but then again, it would also fit in the kind of behavior I'd expect to observe from spyware, either state-sponsored or just the usual kind. In any case, the NSA has made it very easy to become paranoid.

Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by randallsquared on Thursday July 03, 2014 @09:28AM (#7982908)
If you're using Skype on Linux, it's the number of seconds of the call. Skype on Linux hasn't been updated in so long that the client doesn't always know what to do with what it's sent; if you're using Skype on Mac, that's when it tells you that you just got off a call with so-and-so for such-and-such time, but on Linux, it just prints out the literal number of seconds and it's done.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by delian66 on Thursday July 03, 2014 @11:35AM (#7983689)
I had the same problem, when I used the 4.2 linux version of the Skype client. It seems that it was a protocol mismatch between the Windows and Linux versions of the Skype client, and the 4-digit number is the duration of the call in seconds.
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by AlyssaRowan on Thursday July 03, 2014 @01:10PM (#7984308)
Does the other person know what that means? Is it their phone unlock code?
Re:Tor users are selected and monitored by the NSA as extrem... by Istof on Thursday July 03, 2014 @10:18AM (#7983168)
The same didn't happen to me when talking about bombs with someone in another country. Could it be because it was VOIP?