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Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by funkyy on Monday June 23, 2014 @12:15AM (#7930204)
Because in London, Amsterdam, Tokyo or Singapore the weather is amazing all the time - this must be a reason for all the bikers there...

You prefer comfort over bikes - we get it. But bicycling is not "uncivilized madness". Its common way of transportation in most of the world (with exception of majority of the US). Healthy as well (much more healthy than gym).

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by megablast on Monday June 23, 2014 @12:56AM (#7930321)
And Australia, which has amazing weather for cycling, mostly flat cities, wide roads, has hardly any cyclists. Because it is so cheap to drive.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by stonith on Monday June 23, 2014 @02:00AM (#7930448)
Canberra has quite a lot, and very good coverage of bike paths + lanes. I commuted by bike by default for about 6 years there, and got the bus when it was raining.

Now that I live in Sydney I don't ride at all - I just don't feel safe.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by stephen_g on Monday June 23, 2014 @03:21AM (#7930640)
That's a bit of a big generalisation...

I live in the third largest city in Australia. Much of it is ridiculously hilly, the weather is usually stinking hot (apart from a few weeks of 'winter'), but we have plenty of cyclists... Not as many as the average European country but definitely enough to be annoying when you're driving!

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by girvo on Monday June 23, 2014 @06:39AM (#7931169)
Amen. I work in the valley and live in Red Hill, which, as you can tell by the name, is crazily steep. Anyway, we still have stacks of cyclists around here (and Paddington). Personally I walk and get the bus.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by mikeash on Monday June 23, 2014 @12:37AM (#7930263)
Is it really "most of the world"?

Living in France for a couple of years, and visiting London, Rome, and various other parts in that direction, I didn't see any more bicycle traffic than I see in the US. The one place where I have seen a lot of bicycles is Beijing, but that has completely disappeared in the past few years.

I wish we could discuss these things without turning it into a "the US is strange and stupid" whinefest.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by sleepyhead on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:06AM (#7930348)
Is there any other country that is built for individual automobile transportation the way the US is?

I haven't been to France but have you been to Amsterdam, Berlin or Copenhagen?

It is perfectly valid to criticize US without it being "the US is strange and stupid"

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:19AM (#7930383)
Yeah sure. Australia struck me as very "american" in feeling. Lots of the new Chinese development is specially car friendly. Same with new Russian development. I was surprised with how unfriendly Ireland was to anything but a car.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by hessenwolf on Monday June 23, 2014 @04:58AM (#7930899)
It's amazing when you get further out into the country in the Republic. There's almost no option to safely get down the road unless you are in a vehicle.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by mikeash on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:48AM (#7930429)
It's perfectly valid to criticize the US based on how the US is. It's not valid to criticize it based on some notion that the US is unique in a way that it is not.

I have no problem with stuff like "the US should...." Where I have a problem is with "everybody else does it another way" when it's just not true.

Aside from adopting the metric system, I can't think of any legitimate criticism that fits that mold. Bicycles certainly don't seem to.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @12:58AM (#7930325)
No, bike riding is incredibly uncommon the world over. Is an inconvenient, slow, tiring way to travel in anyplace without a good climate or near perfect terrain.

Edit: keep down voting in spite of your own ignorance. I've been lots of places the world over, and not seen lots of bikes outside of very very few areas with near perfect conditions for them.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by cylinder on Monday June 23, 2014 @10:38AM (#7932170)
Driving is convenient when all variables are optimized: when there's lots of free parking, no traffic, no reckless/drunk drivers, good safe roads, gas is cheap, etc etc.

But as we all know, driving in major cities is no longer optimal.

Any city that chooses driving over all other modes of transportation has deliberately decided it is closed for further growth at some point. Once you reach that critical population point, car-dependent life just becomes hell.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @11:46AM (#7932557)
100% agreed. I'm heartened that lots of new development is taking a mindful approach to smarter, mixed-use design centered around mass transit. It feels like, in the U.S. at least, we're on the cusp of a major transformation in some areas.

Unfortunately, for millions and millions of people, the city is viewed as a work location, not a living location. Building bike friendly infrastructure ends at the city limits and needs inter-government coordination and cooperation to achieve door-to-door biking. If you've ever dipped your toes in cross-county or other inter-government initiatives, you'll know that this is an extremely difficult proposition.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by stinos on Monday June 23, 2014 @03:45AM (#7930689)
It's not our ignorance that downvotes you, rather the opposite: the knowledge you are not making sense.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @07:25AM (#7931287)
Which part exactly doesn't make sense? Illuminate me why cycling should work in the vast majority of the world and why cars don't? Because apparently everybody outside of the Northwest Coast of the U.S. and the Netherlands must be idiots and morons who are simply overlooking a hassle-free and convenient utopia because they've been tricked by the big car and oil companies to prefer to get most places in the faster, lower effort, climate controlled and more convenient alternative.

Oh I'm sorry, this is apparently a religious issue and faith with get me over all practical issues.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by stinos on Monday June 23, 2014 @08:04AM (#7931426)
cycling should work in the vast majority of the world and why cars don't

Nobody ever made this claim, so there's no way to illuminate you about it. Same goes for the part about the idiots and morons.

Which part exactly doesn't make sense

For instance the part where you say Is an inconvenient, slow, tiring way to travel in anyplace without a good climate or near perfect. That is merely a generalized opinion.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @09:05AM (#7931682)
Yup, absolutely no illumination provided. Within this thread, I've provided support for the idea as well as anecdotes and data as to why more bike lanes won't get the average person on a bike. I've been downvoted and refuted with no particular counter argument leading me to believe that this is a religious issue and not a factual one. Bikers believe everybody should bike, and people who give reasons why they don't are summarily dismissed.

I'm sorry if I offended your religion.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by alphapapa on Monday June 23, 2014 @04:55PM (#7934604)
The dogmatic downvoting here is disappointing (no alliteration intended). You seem to be right. Reason doesn't work. I know there are reasonable cyclists, but few are speaking up here.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by alphapapa on Monday June 23, 2014 @06:03AM (#7931068)
Everything he said is simple truth. Your comment is the equivalent of, "Lalala I can't hear you." You can do better than argument by assertion.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by SideburnsOfDoom on Monday June 23, 2014 @07:52AM (#7931387)
> Everything he said is simple truth. ...You can do better than argument by assertion.

Why change now? It's assertions all the way down.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by SideburnsOfDoom on Monday June 23, 2014 @07:06AM (#7931231)
> Because in London, Amsterdam, Tokyo or Singapore the weather is amazing all the time

Either you're being sarcastic or you have never spent time in London.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by cylinder on Monday June 23, 2014 @10:35AM (#7932145)
How could you not understand that was sarcastic?
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by SideburnsOfDoom on Monday June 23, 2014 @11:05AM (#7932322)
Because discerning tone from ascii text is hard. How could you not have come across that fact before? There's even a law about it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe's_law

Also because is followup reference to "all the bikers there" is straight-up true, there are loads of bikers in London, really, though it doesn't follow from the statement before. Is that an attempt at sarcasm that fails because of a failed attempt at a false statement? Who knows. Why can't funkyy just say what they mean? Who knows.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @12:56AM (#7930317)
In four total weeks in London, I can count on 1 hand the number of cyclists I saw.

Never been to Tokyo or Singapore, but if they're anything like Seoul, where I've spent months, riding a bike in the streets is both playing Russian Roulette and virtually impossible on account of the bad terrain (and for pretty much all the same reasons I brought up earlier). You also have almost no place to store them given the size of the average apartment. Outside of dedicated parks, I've almost never seen a person on a bike their either.

I've been to dozens of countries on almost every continent, and bikes are a very uncommon mode of transportation. That's why places like the Netherlands, where it is common, are so notable. If it was common, we wouldn't care.

Rather than being snarky, what's your suggestion for overcoming these practical and social issues?

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by dohertyjf on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:06AM (#7930347)
Wow really? You spent 4 weeks in London and never saw a cyclist? Were you out in the suburbs? I spent a bunch of time in London and saw a TON of cyclists in central London. Many of them took the train out to where I was staying too (outside Brixton).

I also don't buy the "small apartments" thing. We live in a 650sq ft apartment and have 4 bikes hung up on our wall. Where there's a will, there's a way.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:15AM (#7930378)
Not surprisingly, being London, the weather was lousy.

650 sq ft is a pretty large place by Korean standards. I expect by Tokyo or Singapore as well.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by dohertyjf on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:28AM (#7930396)
It was grey and lousy when I was there too :-) Still a lot of cyclists including my old coworkers.

I'd dare say we could fit 4 bikes in a much smaller place too. It's not the size of the place that's at debate here though.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:47AM (#7930424)
It was so strange that I even remember one of the few riders I saw because he was using the DLR to get near the tower. I was curious if you could bring bikes on it and that answered my question.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by stingraycharles on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:06AM (#7930345)
Electric cars are a very uncommon mode of transportation too. Should we therefor not care about promoting that method of transportation? No, because then the status quo would never change.

The article discussed in this thread brings up one suggestion for overcoming practical issues. There are many, many more (proven) solutions to choose from -- when you make bicycle transportation pleasant enough, people will start using it.

If the "social issues" you talk about are because there's a group of people who thinks transportation by bicycle is uncivilized, I think it is a matter of education and tolerance. Once using bikes is common in a country, you will see that the only social issues are about people having unjustified fears (about the implications of considering bicycles as a method of transportation during city planning) and there are no real social issues other than people being dicks.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by bane on Monday June 23, 2014 @01:11AM (#7930369)
I don't have to rebuild every major piece of transport infrastructure to support electric cars.

Social issues refer to body odor my bike riding colleagues carry around with them all day because our workplace doesn't have a shower.

Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by andrewliebchen on Monday June 23, 2014 @02:03AM (#7930458)
We tear up and rebuild roads all the time. As we do, it's not that big of a deal to give more consideration to other modes of transit.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by alphapapa on Monday June 23, 2014 @06:04AM (#7931071)
Buildings don't move themselves.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by andrewliebchen on Monday June 23, 2014 @10:58PM (#7935994)
There's plenty of width in most roads, save for some narrow places you find in the older cities in the Northeast and Atlantic coasts.
Re:A New Bike Lane That Could Save Lives and Make Cycling Mo... by Margh on Monday June 23, 2014 @02:27AM (#7930513)
In Osaka / Tokyo / other large Japanese cities people ride bikes on the footpath instead of the road. They also ride comparatively slowly and the terrain is largely flat so in the cooler months sweating is a non-issue. Additionally folding bicycles are very popular because, as you say, the apartments are often very small. Finally, because the cities are so compact you rarely have to travel a large distance to get to where you're going.

So all and all, I agree with you, it's common in these places because the combination of these things makes riding very practical and they're noteworthy because of it.

-edit- I forgot to mention that most apartment buildings will have stacked locking bike racks. This combined with the generally low rate of theft, easily available recycled (read: cheap) bicycles makes them very affordable and low risk.