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Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by tbrownaw on Saturday December 27, 2025 @08:22PM (#46407431)
So what are they using this software for, what's the proposed alternative, and what makes that alternative work better for their use case?
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by ziftface on Saturday December 27, 2025 @10:13PM (#46408031)
It's totally reasonable to be skeptical of palantir without knowing the exact product in question, given their record.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by monero-xmr on Saturday December 27, 2025 @10:52PM (#46408243)
I mean it’s totally reasonable to be skeptical of the NHS given their record
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by tombert on Sunday December 28, 2025 @12:41AM (#46408762)
You can be skeptical of both but Palantir and Peter Thiel especially are categorically horrible, and have shown to solely value increasing their net worth more than all else.

Yeah yeah capitalism optimize for shareholders, but there are plenty of successful large companies that haven't built an entire brand out of directly enabling large entities to erode any semblance of freedom we have left.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by bnjms on Sunday December 28, 2025 @02:29AM (#46409177)
Every time I’ve heard Peter Thiel speak I’ve believed he cares about other things. I’m more concerned about his implementations of things.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by tombert on Sunday December 28, 2025 @02:54AM (#46409292)
Sociopaths are often very convincing. Every action I’ve read about seems to end up enriching himself.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by petre on Sunday December 28, 2025 @04:32AM (#46409717)
Sure. The guy names his companies after tools that evil characters use. Just picture him in a SS uniform the next time he speaks.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by PaulRobinson on Sunday December 28, 2025 @05:22AM (#46410014)
Not really.

They have a track record of failed IT projects, because they have a very high bar for handling data properly.

Palantir have a track record of successful IT projects, because they do what they want and hope there's limited blowback - they've modelled their biggest customer very well, there.

As somebody born in an NHS hospital whose life has been saved by the NHS on at least 3 occasions, I'm more than happy to defend their record.

Palantir, given what we know that has leaked about what they do and how they do it, considerably less so.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by estearum on Sunday December 28, 2025 @09:20AM (#46411242)
> Palantir have a track record of successful IT projects, because they do what they want and hope there's limited blowback - they've modelled their biggest customer very well, there.

What does this mean?

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by PaulRobinson on Tuesday December 30, 2025 @08:51AM (#46433322)
Perhaps you could research it, it sounds like a fun thing to do.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by estearum on Tuesday December 30, 2025 @11:20AM (#46434841)
Research what? The claim that Palantir "just does what it wants to do and hopes there's no blowback?"

I literally can't even parse what that means. Palantir works in very close coordination with their customers' leadership and while the company and product "have opinions" about how to do things, it doesn't at all wash out to Palantir "just doing what it wants to do."

Such a claim doesn't even make sense in the context of a business that works the way Palantir does.

Do you mean sometimes customers pay Palantir to do things that other people or the public disagree with?

And who do you think "their biggest customer" is that they're modeling their own approach after?

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by megawatts on Saturday December 27, 2025 @09:35PM (#46407853)
They were already contracted by NHS to monitor vaccine distribution and covid data in 2020, that contract was terminated and moved to Mozaic Services after public outcry over data privacy concerns. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/10/uk-ends-one-of-its-data-shar...
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by harvey9 on Sunday December 28, 2025 @02:54AM (#46409294)
Did you read the article? Adult social care dashboard not vaccine data. Mozaic just handled migration and is not the host.

NHs FDP (Foundry) still has the vaccine data last time I checked.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by adolph on Saturday December 27, 2025 @09:37PM (#46407861)
Healthcare systems often use Foundry for organizing data. It's a complex problem and Foundry has a good toolset for the job.

https://www.palantir.com/offerings/health/

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by biophysboy on Saturday December 27, 2025 @10:14PM (#46408038)
As somebody that works in the biotech/health space, this page is not that exciting?

The bottleneck in drug development is not discovery; we have to test more hypotheses more efficiently, not generate more hypotheses. You don't need a product like foundry to have reproducibility or share pipeline templates; there are already free, scripting-language-agnostic workflow tools.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by ggm on Sunday December 28, 2025 @12:39AM (#46408753)
Healthcare use of foundry != biotech/bioinformatics use of foundry?

A former work colleague works in health ontologies. They are complicated and include EMT and ward staff using terms of art with inverse meaning.

Perhaps I misread your intent, belittling complexity in somebody else's information space (eg a function of multiple parallel legacy systems and organisational change) seems unhelpful. You weren't excited, maybe people on the management and health economics side were?

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by biophysboy on Sunday December 28, 2025 @10:06AM (#46411571)
I think you misread it a bit. On the bioinformatics point, I was addressing some text in the link. I don’t mean to belittle people that work in healthcare, just suspicious how Palantir secured contracts.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by adolph on Sunday December 28, 2025 @10:43AM (#46411855)
Yeah, ontology is a key word. Its like the best concepts from things like Informatica and Pachyderm and Snowflake, structured in a semi-sane data security model and certified with all the fedramp whatnot you need to make cloud saas work for enterprise.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by adolph on Sunday December 28, 2025 @10:56AM (#46411954)
Yeah, it is dead boring until you hit the real world of trying to make a data request from an IRB which doesn't talk to the IT folks who don't really know the ins and outs of the data they steward but have their own forms and approvals and bespoke deidentification process, . . . once your org is in that state then Foundry starts looking really good. Taking months to sort out getting a csv into your free agnostic workflow tools wasn't fine before, but c19 really made the tool's strengths clear and people want to retain that increased velocity.

Like the iPod, if you are Cdr Taco it is "No wireless. Less space than a nomad. Lame." If you are a normal person struggling with meaningful data in the enterprise and see all the things packaged together tidily, then iPod economics happen.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by biophysboy on Sunday December 28, 2025 @11:08AM (#46412048)
Its possible I was too dismissive. This problem is hard because of the huge gap between the health/biology domain and the tech domain. Is there a reason you feel like Palantir is better equipped to close this gap? I think I'm jaded/cynical because there is an endless graveyard of bad software tools in this world.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by adolph on Sunday December 28, 2025 @08:21PM (#46416336)
> This problem is hard because of the huge gap between the health/biology domain and the tech domain. Is there a reason you feel like Palantir is better equipped to close this gap?

I'm not certain that it is better equipped than any hypothetical or specifically focused system. Given any part of it, I see a lot of products that can be composed into a similar offering. That misses the point though because the problems are socio-political in nature, not technological. It is expensive, which means that if an organization adopts it, everyone from the top down better get into alignment or you will waste a lot of cash. Internal alignment like that can be achieved without spending a lot of money probably maybe, but not likely.

It is also externally aligned a little better than IBM/Oracle (saw Watson, Deloitte "data democracy" etc) as a SaaS with training and consulting.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by karlitooo on Sunday December 28, 2025 @12:58AM (#46408833)
When foundry came out the demo looked next level. I'm sure you could do much of the same thing with FOSS but IMO the problem that the NHS has been struggling with for multiple decades really looks like a lack of Technical Leadership due to the complexity of the environment and care needed when dealing with patient data.

Hopefully Palantir has the necessary skillset to navigate the political environment which involves developing a platform that: 1. protects patient privacy 2. supports needs of providers (e.g. hospitals, gps, specialists, DoH) 3. allows providers to use data to support their operations 4. allows NHS to use the data to improve patient outcomes and efficiency

This Foundry demo impressed me at the time but its a bit dated now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uF-GSj-Exms

Actual data analyst from a hospital talking about what the platform achieves: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ps47Azr2Jz0

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by questionableans on Sunday December 28, 2025 @03:13AM (#46409370)
I’ve heard Foundry is not only insanely expensive, but to actually accomplish something comparable to the demos in your domain requires a huge amount of integration work to build it out in a way that locks you in.
Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by KaiserPro on Sunday December 28, 2025 @03:58AM (#46409550)
They are currently trying to screw us for a 14% year on year increase (over 4 years)

and screwing us for licenses to run apps in "production"

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by dzhiurgis on Sunday December 28, 2025 @05:32AM (#46410063)
> requires a huge amount of integration work

Oh no!..

Data integration is literally Palantir's business.

Re:Say No to Palantir in the NHS by Oarch on Sunday December 28, 2025 @01:10AM (#46408871)
That second video was fascinating, thanks for posting.